My Experience of Rich Dad/Elite Legacy Event Scam

[Constance Kang]

I want to talk about my experience taking Rich Dad/Elite Legacy Education's three days Real Estate workshop. The conclusion: it's a scam. The purpose of this post is to alert people about this $35K scam (since BP has such a high Google ranking, and hopefully this post might come up in some's search result when they are doing research on this so called "Elite Legacy Education"), and here are the details:

I read the Rich Dad Poor Dad book back in high school, and I'm fascinated by his emphasis on financial education (although later on I realize man of his other books are repetitive and erroneous). So about a month ago, I came across a free rich dad ad on Instagram. Based on the graphic presentation of that ad, it shows Robert Kiyosaki, so I thought it would be great to attend this free event and meet him (similar meet the author events are very common here in NYC, so I didn't give it a second thought). I thought, learning any information is better than not learning at all, isn't it?

So I went the Hilton hotel where they held the conference/event. There were about 100 people attending. Much to my surprise, the author himself was not there--so I figured, they just borrowed the copyrighted trademark "rich dad." The first speaker talked about real estate; he started with a long introduction about how he become rich from a college student with debt by investing in real estate-- the theme of the story: education makes you broke, and you have to get a financial education. Since I always wanted to learn more about real estate and OMG, he was good at selling (plus they create an atmosphere of preying on people's fear of missing out). For the second part, another guy came out, and in the name of "multiple streams of income", he sold another three-day stock workshop course to me. Alright, I mean, after all, it's a free event, so I don't blame them for selling. Because I want to learn more about these subjects, I paid $299+ $199 to learn more about introductory to Real Estate and Stock Market. Fair I thought.

They gave me two bags, with some books and audios to read/listen to at home as my "homework" before the workshops. "Thoughtful!" I thought to myself and thought the workshops must be very intensive.

For me, the 3-day Real Estate Workshop was held at Roosevelt's Hotel.

First Day:

I was given two booklets--

1) Real Estate Workbook (wich supplements the book they gave out before the workshop)

2) Real Estate Elite Workshop Events Catalog (which I first thought was the daily schedule for the workshop but later found out it's an information packet on the $39,500 "elite" courses that they sell)

The ironic part is that, through this three-day event, the so-called instructor Jason Jones referred to the Ad packet "Real Estate Elite Workshop Events Catalog" SIX times (he literally asked us to take it out and flip to certain page) and didn't mention ANYTHING nor asking us to read the "Real Estate Workbook ". What a great way to teach!

The instructor gave a case study where we needed to team up as groups of fours and figure out a way to buy an REO property with no money of our own and increase the equity by 30K. The resources we had:

- a bank (conventional) that lends money up to 35k for 650 credit score

- hard money lender with APR 120%

- seller/community (who acts like he doesn't want to talk at all)

- a real estate mentor that costs $35K to use

The "answer" to this exercise was:

Use personal credit to borrow from the bank and spend the $35k on mentor, and then mentor has the "connection" with the community bank to negotiate a deal and brought a 70K property for 40K with FMV of $140K. However, they didn't discuss how the student was able to raise another 40K (which I'm significantly concerned about lending 40K from a hard money lender and pay APR 20%).

Second Day,

They told us that they were giving out a bonus session for early comers. So people went there at 8:30 before the 9:00 start. And they end up talking about credit repairs.

But then, things turned VERY FISHY:

They asked people their credit score and asked us to fill out a "Strategy Session Checklist" that asked about the full legal name, occupation, annual income, bank account $, 401K, IRA, TSP, Available Credit on Cards, and Credit Score.

Instead of actually having a 1-1 personal financial coaching, they got your financial info and "taught" you to apply for a credit card and pay for their $39,500 program. And they said it's okay to "temporarily" have a bad credit score because you could also repair your credit. Ah! That's what the bonus session was for!

Third Day:

They asked a past student Andy to gave a talk on his success story after going through the program. What's annoying is the woman (one of the "expert" who played "mentor" role) kept on asking him rhetorical questions to prove the value of their program and act like it's the only way for one to succeed in the real estate market. But what I found ironic are:

- Andy, who has been working full time in RE for 4 years, are finally going to make $50K passive annual income from rental (with a flawed net profit calculation that didn't income vacancy rate, maintenance fee); and he said after attending the $39,500 program, he paid total $80K--poor Andy didn't even make his initial investment back after four years and yet they are demonstrating him as a success case.

- In fact, Andy is now a "trainer"--which seems to me, training is their stream of income, not real estate

- Andy revealed that he found his deal leads through words of mouth; what's ironic is the instructor kept on selling the importance of the company's Elite Success Software and told us we can't make deal without it

Instead of teaching something, they spent the whole third day (at least until 1 pm when I finally decided to leave) selling the program. When one student asked if the instructor is going to talk about a case study he promised to demonstrate, he responded (don't remember his exact word, but it's pretty much something like this:) :"If you are not even going to buy the next training, it's not relevant to you." And started to identify us as who will not make money and never succeed in life.

My thoughts:

- I don't mind paying $40K for real estate education; however, my reservation is their professionalism. So far they only demonstrated their proficiency in the art of selling but nothing talented about their industry knowledge.

- They are extremely manipulative in their sales approach. Don't get me wrong; I don't hate sales people, being in Media industry myself, I understand that selling is necessary because at the end of the day everyone has bills to pay. But you need to be at least transparent and ethical in your practice. They are not calculating, but also very deceptive that now when I look back, the whole three days training is a step by step scripted the process of selling, every single second of it.

- I went to a top college and have a very stable career with great income. However, most people attending the event are less than college educated and have lower income. The fact that they don't have critical thinking skills and limited income/saving, makes them desperate and easy target. This is also my purpose for sharing the experience with the BP community and the internet community so that people are more informed. Seeing someone with bad credit, messed up financial, no job, putting the debt on his parent's account to pay for this program and hope to achieve a dream that he's most likely not achieve, really breaks my heart! 

[David Dachtera]

@Ben Neds,

Not everyone aspires to the beach life. When I build the passive income I want, I will seek opportunities to present to groups on topics which are dear to me ... credit literacy, financial literacy, etc.

[Brandon Taylor]

@Constance Kang Thank you so much for your information. I do have a question though, I recently attended the free seminar...and signed up for the 3 day workshop. The cost of the 3 day workshop was $695. I paid $400 to receive all of the materials. My question is, can I cancel the class without paying the remaining $295 or am I liable to pay the rest because I signed the form? after reading all of these comments, I don't want to waste my time ( considering I have to drive 1.5 hours each way to the workshop). Any information will be greatly appreciated. Thank you!

[Jordan Moorhead]

Constance Kang go to real conferences, REIA’s, meetups, spend time on BP and network with other investors.

Get started at some point and you’ll learn a ton. I love education but I’ve learned a ton just by getting out there and doing it.

[Mike Reynolds]

I just buy a PRO membership here and get any answer I have ever needed so far. Like @Jordan Moorhead says the rest you will learn as you go. I have read the RDPD books before and got value from that though. 

[Jill Thomas]

I actually have a different take on this. I too went the the free workshop and signed up for the 3 day classes. We, my husband, son and I, signed up for more classes either online, on demand or in person, and a 3 day private in person, on site mentorship. Just finished the third class, which was great for us and gave us a lot of new tools, and just finished the 3 day mentorship with a guy who was fantastic named Rick Sigler. Can't say enough good about him and the amount of guidance and info he gave us over 3 days. That's too bad you had a bad experience. We didn't and just wanted to say not everyone associated with Elite and Rich Dad Poor Dad is bad. Happy to answer any questions.

[Shiloh Lundahl]

I went to the 3 day Rich Dad Poor Dad event in March of 2015. I came home and told my wife that I wanted to sign up for the $40,000 course. She said “no” so I didn’t. We were starting to do real estate ourselves and did our first flip on our own and lost $5,000. Then my wife went to a 3-day training herself and ended up signing up for the 40k course and an additional 25k coaching course. All in all it was about 75k that we spent. It was not the RDPD training but I imagine it was similar. The year of the training we earned 95k from 6 flips. The following year we switched to a buy and hold model and increased our net worth much more than that.

For my wife and I the training worked really well. But I would say I have the personality for it and we were in a good position to take advantage of it.  We sold a rental that we had to pay for the majority of the training. We had money and access to creator over and above the cost of the course so we were able to hit the ground running. Not everything in the course appealed to me (ie they had some turn key properties that didn’t look like they were as good as advertised). 

Could I have learned what I learned during that 1-year program for a lot cheaper by reading books and articles. Maybe. But that really isn’t my learning style. I learn best through personal interactions and seeing things being done.

Some benefits to the training were:

1. It helped my wife and I get in the same page with investing.

2. We learned how to get access to a lot of credit.

3. We got great contacts and referrals that have helped us springboard our business.

Some cautions of training programs in my opinion are:

1. Know your own personality - if you are someone that succeeds in most things then a training like this can help you do it faster. If you are someone that jumps into things and then lose momentum and returns to the same place and state of mind then this is probably not a good idea for you.

2. Know your learning style - if you learn a ton from reading books and articles and can go out and do things you have read then it is a lot cheaper just to read books or articles rather than pay for a formal education program.

3. Know where you are starting from. If you have little to no money, then I would not suggest doing a program like this. I would suggest learning how to manage your finances and get into a better financial position before doing a program like this. Otherwise you are left to just learning how to wholesale to start earning money. Which is t a horrible thing and some wholesalers do great. But most wholesalers I know have a large team and lots of money in their business to find leads.

So in conclusion, I agree that some (or many) of the training programs have high pressure sales techniques to get people to join their programs. A lot of the people who join are not financially in a place where they should spend more money to join at that time. And some people don’t have the personality for it and are likely not to do much with it. I just wanted to share my thought here because I just don’t like threads that are negative towards real estate education programs as a group. It’s like saying all used car salesmen are bad or dishonest. If that is the case than it leaves us to only buy new cars. Which might not be the best financial decision. 

So hopefully this post may balance out some of the opinions given here.

[Alex Alob]

I usually attend free events for the free info that they divulge. I learned a lot of the basic details and went home to research the rest. Sales are tough to come-by and I won't give up my hard earned dollars just to anybody. My take is this, you can always learn the ropes on your own. Cost is the biggest barrier to entry into anything now a days. First thing I didn't like about the free event was how cheap it is to get in initially and right off the bat I knew there will be additional expenses. Secondly, the author was not present. Red flag right there. Lastly, the presenter mentioned there is a recording camera in the back and that threw me off completely as I figured they get sued a lot and reminded me of Trump University scandal.  Guys, don't reinvent the wheel, take the free info and run with it.  A lot of the stuff they say is true and build on the free info they give you and grow your portfolio. My rich cousin taught me this rule since I was 13 years old, "You don't pay, to get paid". Brian Tracy says we should invest 10% of our income into our education every year which I agree but from reputable guys like Tony Robbins, Brian Tracy, and etc. 

[Jason Spillman]

My experience has been way different. I am completing my final year as a student with Elite, and the my experience has been very positive. Perhaps Elite has changed since you all took it. I paid for the basic package which was $17500 but I was able to split that cost with a buddy. They allowed two people to take this journey together. I gained enough knowledge that I have bought 5 duplexes and 3 SFR's (Memphis). I am grossing $93K/year with an average Cash on Cash of 16.6%.

[Charles Ray]

We went to a free seminar also where we were introduced to the rich dad guru, but Mr. Kiosaki wasn't there. Instead we were told we had to pay $500 to attend a 3 day class workshop where we would be instructed on how to obtain real estate deals that would make us thousands of dollars, and in the bag of goodies they sold us was an Ipad as part of the deal. So we went for it. The class instructor did show us various creative financing methods, but most of the time was spent trying to hype people up to become better people and help other people out of a foreclosure situation. The instructor said he had made over a million dollars after being in the military, and it only took him 7 years. We are in the last day of class and are being sold high education classes for about $60,000. It looks like a scam to me but I want your opinion. We can't afford $60 much less $60,000. They even cried at the end of their presentation to show the class how important this elite classes are and how it helped them. I would love to learn creative methods of investing in real estate, but I don't know where to turn without getting ripped off.

[Account Closed]

I've never been to a RDPD seminar. I read the RDPD books, which I thought were OK, and I played the Cashflow board game about 50 times (mostly Cashflow 101) over a 4-year period back in the 2000s. I highly recommend the Cashflow game.

I felt uneasy with how Kiyosaki would associate with other investment guru types who I concluded were shady. One stormed out of the room, telling me I would "come around" when I refused to move all of my money from the stock market to the SFH investments he was promoting. I came around instead to the conclusion he was trying to swindle me out of my life savings and thankfully I kept my money where it was in the stock market.

The CBC secretly sent a reporter with a hidden camera to a RDPD seminar in Canada and you can come to your own conclusion about whether these seminars are a good deal or not.  I conclude the RDPD seminars are a scam.

http://www.cbc.ca/player/play/1404600019

[Logan Aardrup]

Thank you for you're review!  I went to one of the free events yesterday and ended up falling for the first real estate class.  I left after they started selling the options trading class.  I left feeling strangely violated.  You're post saved me from wasting my time and money.  Thank you!

P.S.  This is embarrassing to admit but they are now giving out free tablets to keep track of all the documents needed for the class.  And buy free I mean charging $400 for a $150 tablet because instead of my class being $300 like you'res was I paid $700!  Although in my defense I had never been in a sales situation before.  Now I know what to look for!  Thanks again!

[Sam Shueh]

@Constance Kang

History repeats its self. I think he did spend time and is a gambler in  Vegas today. Now he admits it is hard to make money...…. 

[Moises Jasso]

@Constance Kang My friend also invested 40k into that program. The terrible thing is that its not lifetime access, plus they just build up packages after package. I was lucky I found a community of Real Estate Investors, and they have been guiding me! 120% hard money is crazy. @Andrew Ware And yes. Guaranteeing 6 figures is just a bad sign. @Raymond Lee If you guys have not found good guidance for Real Estate Investing, I can help you out.  

[Bartosz Rosol]

I attended one of Rich Dad's free seminars a couple years ago, here's what I experienced.

The event started out with the main speaker sharing his success stories in RE, and ended with him trying to get us to sign up for the classes. He sounded somewhat convincing in the beginning, so I stayed for half the seminar. During his speech I researched his background and found out that he's a professional speaker hired by agencies to give presentations, and has no ties to RE. I ran out of the room as soon I found his online profile.

It's unfortunate that people fall for this scam

[Jay Hinrichs]

Originally posted by @Bartosz Rosol:

I attended one of Rich Dad's free seminars a couple years ago, here's what I experienced.

The event started out with the main speaker sharing his success stories in RE, and ended with him trying to get us to sign up for the classes. He sounded somewhat convincing in the beginning, so I stayed for half the seminar. During his speech I researched his background and found out that he's a professional speaker hired by agencies to give presentations, and has no ties to RE. I ran out of the room as soon I found his online profile.

It's unfortunate that people fall for this scam

99% of the set up folks are all actors or professional speakers.. a lot of successful real estate folks are not great presenters.. and would lay and egg on the stage. you need that type of personality..   its a skill set ... I mean many investors are just not great at public speaking nor would do it.

[Nick C.]

To piggyback on Jay's point, generally speaking I think the kind of personalities that are really good at real estate are the opposite of the kind of personalities that are really good at self promotion and presenting. 

The individuals I've met along the way that are really good at real estate are analytical, level headed, and disciplined. Their income comes from buying, selling, and holding real estate over the long term. 

The shameless self promoters are gamblers, narcissistic, and constantly chasing the next money making scheme. They become gurus as soon as humanly possible, and their income comes from preying off of newbies by convincing them that they buy, sell, and hold real estate when really they're just selling courses. 

I'm sure there's individuals that are good at both, I'm just speaking in generalities. 

[Jay Hinrichs]

Originally posted by @Nick C.:

To piggyback on Jay's point, generally speaking I think the kind of personalities that are really good at real estate are the opposite of the kind of personalities that are really good at self promotion and presenting. 

The individuals I've met along the way that are really good at real estate are analytical, level headed, and disciplined. Their income comes from buying, selling, and holding real estate over the long term. 

The shameless self promoters are gamblers, narcissistic, and constantly chasing the next money making scheme. They become gurus as soon as humanly possible, and their income comes from preying off of newbies by convincing them that they buy, sell, and hold real estate when really they're just selling courses. 

I'm sure there's individuals that are good at both, I'm just speaking in generalities. 

I think that basically sums it up.. but lets remember also there is HUGE money in the top 10 gurus.. TV flipping show.. then align with back end fulfillment company usually out of Utah and your off and running..  Like Tarik and Christine.. or than merril or any of the others. its a natural progression and the HUGE money is made selling the information. 

to be fair and balanced like Fox news.. there are always a % of folks that come through these trainings that do quite well and the money they spent forced them to take action.. its just the other 90% who spend the money and well never really do anything.. I mean really buying rentals is not overly complicated..  A Great broker is all you need.. !!!

[Jeff C.]

I think there must be some organization that has this canned business model ready to go and approaches people who have names / followings and offers to implement it for them, given the near absolute uniformity in the advertising, and the convention / sell / upsell structure with all the exact same sales tactics, just substituting out the guru for the flavor of the week.

[Mark De sagun]

Last weekend, I went to an afternoon presentation and ended up signing up for the $500 3-day course. Dumb move. Luckily, when I found out that it wasn't going to be much help to me, I was able to cancel. I still need to return the 'free' books to get my full refund.

[Ian Walsh]

Regardless of the info being offered and how it is offered, it's all about the person trying to learn and what they do with it.  Granted some information is more pitchy or surface than others, but most times it's decent info.  The person trying to learn usually just doesn't do anything with it or know how to apply it.  The people teaching the class are teaching but they are not the ones that will implement the ideas to propel your success.  I have no affiliation with this group or know anything about them besides what this person just wrote. I am speaking from mentors/classes in general.

[Marisol Varela]

thank you for sharing this experience. We did not buy into their hype. Their sales pitch is way too strong. 

[Ryan Gougeon]

There was a guy some years back that literally dismantled Robert Kyosaki and his "Rich dad" story, fact for fact. He apparently was some MLM scam guy who changed his gimmick to real estate, and then made up the "Rich dad" story. 

As you were telling your story, I half expected you to say WWE's own "Brother Love" jumped out and gave a sermon about real estate and if you buy the course, he'll LUV YEWWWW!~ (youtube brother love wwe if you don't know who he is). 

[Rob Massopust]

I am in the wrong business. Seriously not a guru goes by that is not charging an unconsciousable amount of money. Do you know why they can get away with this is because people buy this crap. i am disappointed in RD because you would think someone out there wants to really help the little guy, I guess they do its just going to cost you $40k. One must pause when someone offers advice on getting rich the most likely case is they are making more money selling you a pipe dream, if it was lucrative why would they not just be doing it. Thats like knowing where a gold mine is located and selling maps to go find it. Its no surprise to me that RD is out there talking about how the world economy is going to crash etc etc. If that was the case why would they be stumping for real estate. Funny he has a new book out called "Fake" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWG2b-36JLc

[Account Closed]

So glad you posted this. For years I have seen postcards and ads inviting me to a Rich Dad seminar. And like someone said, they try to lead you to believe that Robert will be there, but I knew for sure he wasn't gonna be there.

Nowadays, other people are doing the same exact thing with other big names, such as Daymond John for Shark Take. I see ads about free seminars in my city and I am 90% certain it will be a pitch fest and very little value shared.

[Juan Marroquin]

Just  did the free seminar yesterday and got as much as I could out of it. Then towards the end started pushing the 3 day workshop  “valued” at 2k for $495. Some did sign up, I thought about it but had to look up the information they talked about to see if it was backed up by any other source besides them.

What I took from this was, be peppy salesmen and fish till you hook one. They were practicing what they were selling .