General Landlording & Rental Properties
Market News & Data
General Info
Real Estate Strategies
Landlording & Rental Properties
Real Estate Professionals
Financial, Tax, & Legal
Real Estate Classifieds
Reviews & Feedback
What can we legally ask in screening a felon? (sex offender)
I had a potential tenant contact me and ask if I accept felons. I have read that it's illegal (discrimination) to flat out say "no felons" so I asked what the crime was. He said "sex offender, 16 years ago when I was 18 years old". I told him I would "review with the owner" and get back to him. Since then, I've been trying to read up on what I can legally ask him. Can I ask him more details on his crime? E.g. if it was consensual sex with a minor girlfriend 16 years ago, I don't feel I need to disqualify him if he's been clean for 16 years since (of course I'll do a background check to verify). If it was violent or more serious in nature, I would disqualify him. But I am wondering where I can learn/research more about what specific questions I can legally ask prospective tenants. Also - this is a single family, C property and there are 2 registered sex offenders in the apartments across the street so....I definitely still screen all tenants but have to have realistic standards for this type of a property.
The problem here, he's on the sex offender registry. And the unwavering anti-sex offender protesters (while rightfully so in MANY cases) make no distinction between a pedophile, and an old man that slapped a waitress' rear once in a diner 20 years ago (not condoning, but just pointing out it's a WIDE swath). Sadly, they are easily self justified in harassment and even vandalism unless they get their way. I would pass for that reason, especially if this is a house. Now, an apartment complex, maybe?,outside my area of knowledge.
Also, there is NO WAY, he didn't know a 13 year old is under age, even a "mature" one. So that goes to a judgement red flag in my opinion.
OP is kind of in a jam with the property itself.
It sounds like this is a slum-ish rental if there’s multiple offenders lingering around who got accepted in other rentals - so it would be hard to say no.
Slim pickings it seems?
Originally posted by @Sarah Buchanan:
@Joe Splitrock thanks for weighing in. I know you know the local market. I was thinking maybe I should turn this one Class C into a "felon friendly" property since we have a prison here and definitely a need for it - but I agree, too risky for me, at least at this point.
This might be a topic for a law review article, but if a landlord decided to rent exclusively to RSOs and ex-felons (a specialty market), could the LL be found in violation of the anti-discrimination housing laws?
@James Galla I’m really glad to see that at least one person said they would rent to them and understanding that people do grow and they do gain fear of having their lives ruined again, I have an uncle who is in his 70s and still no one will rent to him for something he did in his 20s and it is so frustrating , the man cannot keep up his own home anymore he wants to go to an apartment but he can’t, we live in a small town too and he is stuck. He is too healthy for a nursing home but he is weak, too weak to take care of his own home anymore and I feel awful for him and anyone like him.
I personally absolutely would rent to someone with that record,( assuming credit and income qualify- for a SFH) for the sole reason that I find it unfair that this is the only crime that is discriminated against in the way that they have to register and tell all of their neighbors what they did. Murderers don't have to do it , thieves don't have to do it , kidnappers don't have to do it.
And anyone doubting what a 13-year-old can look like they should go to YouTube and look at the channels that are dedicated to this subject. I’ve seen 13-year-olds in my own neighborhood that look like they’re in their 20s because of the way girls dress and wear the make up now . I feel bad for men now.
Now all that being said .... I would not allow it in a multi family or apt unit.
SIMPLY BECAUSE it would scare off potential renters in my other units.
But if I had a SFH in a rural area : I would help someone get a new start.
I am an attorney (not criminal law, but I am relatively familiar with sentencing guidelines). I don't know how strict the laws in your state are, but that sounds like an awfully long sentence for the crime he claims he was convicted of. Seems to me like something here isn't adding up, but look, if you have other felons on the property, or are OK with it being sort of a first stop point for these folks, then maybe take him. I would be a hard pass here, but I don't know what I'd do if I owned a property near a prison, and had some of this tenant base in the area. Maybe you should consider it?
Originally posted by @Sarah Buchanan:
@Joe Splitrock thanks for weighing in. I know you know the local market. I was thinking maybe I should turn this one Class C into a "felon friendly" property since we have a prison here and definitely a need for it - but I agree, too risky for me, at least at this point.
No doubt it is hard for felons. Some are good people trying to improve their lives. I have compassion, but it is just impossible for a landlord to filter the good from bad. If it was just me as a single person, I may take a chance, but with a wife and child it is just not worth it. I am talking safety issues here.
Is there a lot of demand for this property? Are you trying to choose between multiple applications? My experience renting to felons is that they are particularly grateful, loyal, and respectful of me and my property.
I've had NON felons paint my hard wood floors, and similar horror stories every other landlord has.
My former felon tenants on the other hand don't want any trouble, don't attract any attention, and pay their rent on time KNOWING they'll have a very difficult time finding someplace else to live.
So......who here who has chimed in has had problem tenants that were NON felons?
Who here has actually leased to felons and had problems that are not common to landlording?
@Sarah Buchanan do what you feel is best for the offender and your company. Personally, I respect you for wanting to understand this guy and the specifics of the incident. Shows good character on you and for him to actually volunteer some info. One the flip side, it could tarnish your reputation, but I subscribe to the philosophy of second chances.
@Shiva Bhaskar Their law stipulates 2 things, under the age of 10 = 10 years in prison; between 10-16 yrs old, and actor is 3+ yrs older than victim = 15 years. Not sure why the age disparity makes a difference, unless they are covering for children that are really young that would possibly commit this act. The 3rd Degree label lends me to believe it was not an aggravated assault/rape, yet something that was"consensual". I feel there is more to the story but nothing that would lead me to think he is lying about what has happened.
And I agree with @Dawn Burwell there are some girls that don't act, dress or even look like they are 13.
You can say no, its ok.. does he have work? does he make 3x rent? you say hes only been out 18 months.. how long has he been at his job? he can be disqualified based on work length history etc
I like to approach it as "all applicants will be screened for criminal history." This terminology should be included in the "qualification acknowledgement form" provided at time of application. I would focus on the actual criminal records that have been reported, rather than having a conversation with the prospective tenant.
I suggest you write up and post your rental criteria. Ours clearly states no felons. It will make your life much easier.
@Sarah Buchanan I’ve had to turn down everyone on an offenders list because the property is between two elementary schools only a few blocks away in either direction. They can’t locate within a certain distance of schools, so I mention the schools and they move on. This way I’m not discriminating. It’s also why some will commit identity theft to be near a school.
For someone who has spent their whole adulthood in prison, I definitely would think twice about renting out to him. However, on the other hand he could be a felon who will pay his rent on time and not cause any trouble simply because he understands it's especially hard for him to find someplace else to live.
Originally posted by @Dante Pirouz:
I suggest you write up and post your rental criteria. Ours clearly states no felons. It will make your life much easier.
Curious.... what if no one else applies in this area? OP has already stated C class with other former offenders near by.
Is a vacancy better? Easier? Seems a little short sighted if not misguided.
Again......who here who has chimed in has had problem tenants that were NON felons?
Who here has actually leased to felons and had problems that are not common to landlording?
I'm thinking that if folks have NOT leased to felons before, the opinion expressed is simply that. I see more fear based than fact based. Just sayin'
@Jerry Puckett we actually have rented to felons in the past. Not one has stayed out of their old lifestyles and out of trouble. In a most recent case because we didn’t happpen to check the local court records (just pulling a criminal report from the for -profit services is not complete in our experience). I figured this guy had 2 kids, a wife, a new job as a tile installer and just out of jail...The tenant started slipping payments within months, would not follow simple complex rules (as if he didn’t even get basic stuff...because he had been incarcerated for years???), was threatening to my crew (his wife was too), his kids harassed other tenants because they were unsupervised most of the time, and then we learned he was arrested for parole violations, drug possession, assault and suspected robbery. It is hard for some to change bad habits so without a track record of a few years out of jail with a clean record I would say keep looking. I say let’s reward tenants who are trying hard to do things correctly not felons who have not put in the time outside of jail to practice responsibility and good habits. Just sayin’
@Dante Pirouz
Well said. I can respect your experience, and appreciate you speaking from it. It certainly gives weight to your views.
What you have described here is behavior that I've seen repeated in many contractors be it tile setting or drywall, criminal history or no...(who in RE has not know contractor drama?). But I wouldn't let that keep me from leasing to contractors.
This is in fact behavior that I think many if not most Land Lords experience and is not unique to felons.
Have you had any similar experiences with non felons?
You're right. It is hard for some folks to change bad habits of any kind, including stereotyping. Nelson Mandela spent 27 years in Prison, and I don't think anyone could accuse him of not getting "basic stuff" due to his long incarceration.
Reward folks trying to do right? You bet.....who are the other applicants? I have yet to hear if there are others to even choose between.
And just to be crystal clear....my intention here is not to advocate for anything other than evaluating every opportunity on a case by case basis. There are some very astute people like@Jay Hinrichs who have weighed in here with a true entrepreneurial view.
Just sayin'.....(Hey!! please come up with your own tag line :-)
Originally posted by @Dawn Burwell:
I personally absolutely would rent to someone with that record,( assuming credit and income qualify- for a SFH) for the sole reason that I find it unfair that this is the only crime that is discriminated against in the way that they have to register and tell all of their neighbors what they did. Murderers don't have to do it , thieves don't have to do it , kidnappers don't have to do it.
Actually - with all due respect to your uncle - I would discriminate against all those felons equally and pass on their applications. I wouldn't rely on public record, either. Those crimes would be revealed during the criminal background checks.
Registered sex offenders can be tough. Since they are often on a registry, other tenants will find out and potentially leave the building because of it.
Many, including myself, think it is draconian to have someone permanently classified as a sex offender when a consensual incident happened in their teens - for example a minor girlfriend. Your economic interests, however, should come first.
I think it comes down to if you, personally, feel comfortable with this guy living in your property and if you feel comfortable renting to felons in the future. Of course verify his income is 3x the rent and see what more you can research about his felony, if possible, online. If you can meet face to face and ask pointed questions you'll probably find your answer. Everyone has given good input, but in the end it comes down to what you're comfortable with. If this situation will be keeping you up at night with stress, pass on it.
@Sarah Buchanan let’s break this down as simple as possible! NO! HELL NO! F NO!
@Sarah Buchanan
I would stay away, I’m not sure in your state, but in mine you can type an address in and it brings up a map of all the sex offenders in the area. Before I have bought all 3 of my personal homes I have done this search. If there was one close, I wouldn’t even consider buying it. So if this guy is living in one of your places he could keep people out of your other units or out of the whole neighborhood. Plus his story does not hold water.
@Sarah Buchanan everyone deserves a second and a place to live, if he qualifies base on other factors, and after meeting with him and your woman intuition doesn’t throw off alarms( you gals have extra sensory men don’t have) than I would consider.
sorry but dont care what anyone did 18 years ago.
i hope your not being self righteous and think your above being accused and or convicted yourself of anything in this unjust broken world that any cop or attorney like charge you with.
btw remember sex offenders can be presidents ie Bill and Hillary. so if voted for sex offender but not rent to one than your being hypocrite.
if he has good landlord recommendations, good income 3x rent, and is not currently actively in courts check with his boss, his ex landlords, and call his references.
ive never met perfect tenant nor perfect landlord.
cause neither exist.
reduce risks on everyone
imho sec 8 are worst tenants overall than former felons. even if guilty does he pay his rent and bills. end day thats what matters.
p.s.s
the so called list is unconstitutional, it is essentially double jeopardy, and not allow them serve time once but daily and no freedom of privacy, now everyone gets punish him.or her every day forever. thus suicide rates high. but most self righteous hateful people dont care about perpetuating unconstuitional rules laws against fellow americans but i do. screen same for everyone.
Originally posted by @Jerry Puckett:
So......who here who has chimed in has had problem tenants that were NON felons?
Who here has actually leased to felons and had problems that are not common to landlording?
done both.
everyone has issues not all are as bad as label of felony.
most sec 8 types are far worse, more destructive, entitled, spoiled, lazy bring more drugs, crime etc thanks to govt handouts,
actual old or one time felons ive rented to are usually thankful, quiet, hard workers and family men. prefer many them as long as its not active current very recent crime etc