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Updated over 8 years ago, 04/13/2016
The "lost my wallet and somone overdrafted my acct" excuse
Hey BP folks, looking for a situation opinion here. First time this has happened to me.
I solely utilize buildium's e-pay service for rent collection and for the fisrt time had an "echeck" reversed for NSF. The tenant just moved in on 3/1/16 (@ $600/mo) and then wanted to pay the rent for april a couple weeks early via cash while I was there working on the lower unit. My reply was that he pay online through the tenant website as it is a condition of our lease agreement, its convenient, safe, yada yada. So on 3/31/16 he made the online payment, great. Then on 4/5/16 the payment was reversed due to NSF.
On 4/6/16, i applied the $50 late fee(normally is applied on the 2nd, no grace period) and applied the $35 NSF fee. Then I let him know the situation he asked if I was sure beacause he had a receipt for payment(buildiums auto email for making the payment) I replied with yes, check your bank and you'll see that I was never pulled.(confirmed this with buildium/forte). No response from tenant
On 4/8/16 he texted me that he needs a few extra days because he lost his wallet on the bus and someone used his card to overdraft his account and they have to do any investigation. My response was your 7 day notice was issued on the 6th so you now have 5 days.
Today I let him know that I would be going to the court house on the 14th to file for eviction if the balance was not paid. I also let him know that I removed the NSF fee as it never hit my bank and therefore my bank is not charging me for it. His reply, "so I just have to pay the 600 rent"
I haven't replied yet. So do I stick to my guns and leave the late fee on his account? Remove the late fee in hopes that this is a one time fluke? Remove the late fee if he proves to me via bank statements, investigation reference #, etc that his claim of losing his wallet is actually true.
Thanks guys, sorry for the long post.
Charge him late fee, because he will have to learn the lesson. This tenant is too new to let him slide. I work with tenants, who have been with me for a while, but a new tenant has to see you stick to your guns.
Originally posted by @Michaela G.:
Charge him late fee, because he will have to learn the lesson. This tenant is too new to let him slide. I work with tenants, who have been with me for a while, but a new tenant has to see you stick to your guns.
Now that I think about it more, I'm thinking the same thing. I always tell myself I need to run my business as a business and not let my emotions have any say in my S.O.P's. The nice guy in me says, let him prove it and then remove the late fee. The business guy in me says, he's probably making the whole thing up. Even if it's actually true, why should I care when my mortgage company, cell phone provider, etc doesn't care if I lost my wallet. Also, I don't have too many properties at this point in time, but there's no way I could let myself spend time of figuring out if their excuse is actually true when my business has scaled up significantly.
#2 General Landlording & Rental Properties Contributor
Apply the late fee and prepare yourself for an eviction. This guy is too new of a tenant to give him even a second thought. He has not yet earned any special considerations.
He is lying to his landlord and expects you to believe him. As soon as a tenant starts with the poor me sob story I interrupt and tell them that their personal life is none of my business and they are not required to supply me with reasons. I do not listen to or consider reasons, excuses, fantasy tails or anything else by way of explanations. They owe their rent by the first in full and I expect them to pay me ahead of all other debts, including utilities, car repairs, medical, phone, food etc. If they want a roof over their head they need to understand priorities.
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Stick to your written lease and your policies!! Ifor you make an exception, particularly for a new tenant, you are setting a precedence.
- Nathan Gesner
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
Exactly! You are a machine. You have no emotions. You don't accept any excuses. Just like the mortgage company who you are probably sending part of his rent to!
I'm really not sure why tenants seem to think the landlord can be flexible about payments when nothing else in life is that way.
Charge him the late fee so he knows it's not ok for him to lie to you. Trying holding him accountable, either he will respond well or continue on his downward spiral. You did the right thing though preparing to evict right away.
- Michael Noto
Im going save an iteration of this in my notes on my phone.. Soon as they start in with the excuse.. ill copy,paste,send.
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
Exactly! You are a machine. You have no emotions. You don't accept any excuses. Just like the mortgage company
I'm writing this on my white board!
Originally posted by @Michael Noto:
Charge him the late fee so he knows it's not ok for him to lie to you. Trying holding him accountable, either he will respond well or continue on his downward spiral. You did the right thing though preparing to evict right away.
Yeah actually my lease states rent is paid by 5pm on the 1st. The post office closes at 6p. I check my buildium acct and print and mail any needed 7 day notices. If it's a weekend or I can't make it, they are mailed on the 2nd. I try to stay on top of this but this time around I wasn't notified of the reversed NSF payment untill the 5th.
No mercy. Always think in terms of how would their other creditors handle this? Do mortgage lenders give breaks based on any kind of excuses? Car lenders? Credit cards?
Really, how did you end up with this tenant? You can't have screened well. This kind of thing doesn't just accidentally happen.
You showed too much mercy when you rented to these losers. Don't show any more. Learn your lesson and get rid of them. You won't be the first or the last "nice" landlord to learn it.
Get rid of him now,right now.He's a liar and a loser and will be a pain until you shove him out the door.
I haven't had great luck with tenants lately. I guess I'll have to review my screening process. Seems like there aren't many great tenants looking in my area, especially during this time of year.
Originally posted by @Brandon Battle:
Get rid of him now,right now.He's a liar and a loser and will be a pain until you shove him out the door.
As long as they don't pay I can, they are on a year lease.
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#4 All Forums Contributor
- Lender
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@Account Closed this is too funny... all the hang the bastard comments.. now I know why I am the worlds worst landlord... I fell for every sob story on the planet... if it was me I would told him no problem to just get him to shut up and get off the phone.. LOL>
- Jay Hinrichs
- Podcast Guest on Show #222
I had my first "hey, can I be a couple of days late? I had some expenses come up." text message this month. I told them since they were there with 100% on time payment I would waive the late fee, but they are now not 100% and it won't happen again.
In your case, it's their first real payment. They have no history or goodwill from you. At this point charge the fee as your lease says.
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
Originally posted by @Michaela G.:
Charge him late fee, because he will have to learn the lesson. This tenant is too new to let him slide. I work with tenants, who have been with me for a while, but a new tenant has to see you stick to your guns.
Now that I think about it more, I'm thinking the same thing. I always tell myself I need to run my business as a business and not let my emotions have any say in my S.O.P's. The nice guy in me says, let him prove it and then remove the late fee. The business guy in me says, he's probably making the whole thing up. Even if it's actually true, why should I care when my mortgage company, cell phone provider, etc doesn't care if I lost my wallet. Also, I don't have too many properties at this point in time, but there's no way I could let myself spend time of figuring out if their excuse is actually true when my business has scaled up significantly.
Don't forget that a goon Lessor - Lessee relationship has it's own value when it comes to this type of business. Letting him prove it and waiving the fee may be the better thing to do. He already knows that you wont hesitate to charge the late fee and proof is required if it ever "happens" again.
I've had a similar set of excuses. "My companies van with all my tools was stolen and I used the rent money for tools so rent will be late." My response, "That's too bad, will your renters insurance cover this? When you pay the rent be sure to add the late fee. I'll talk to the partners and see if they'll refund the late fee when you send a police report." He never came up with the police report, but did pay the rent plus late fee. Several months later his rent check NSF'd. He said someone hacked his checking account and he didn't know it until it was too late. I said "When will you be paying the rent plus NSF fee plus late fee. I'll talk with the partners and see if they'll agree to refund the late fee after I get a statement on bank stationary signed by a bank officer that you're account was hacked and a police report." He never sent these materials, but he did pay the rent and all fees.
Moral of the story. Charge the fees and communicate you're willingness to CONSIDER return late fee if he provides adequate third party documentation.
I inherited some bad tenants when I was hired as a manager. They both eventually went bye bye - yay! But, a couple of excuses I got from them: "I can't pay rent on time because I got my eyes tattooed so I won't have to wear makeup anymore." And, another favorite, "I'm calling from North Carolina. I'm on vacation visiting my family and the airfare was so expensive, I won't be able to pay rent this month."
Yeah, I told them both to come up with the rent, or they'll be getting served a 3 day notice. Part of the problem was the previous manager - one of the owners - would let them get away with this garbage. When he turned it over to me, he said (of the one who went on vacation so she didn't have money for rent), "Um, she's behind about $8,000 in rent, so you should start collecting that."
LOL! Her rent was something like $600/month. Over a year in back rent was owed. I did end up collecting it all from her, but she'd keep asking for me to bend the rules for her, and I'd keep saying no.
Some tenants will ask. Like little kids, though, if they learn the answer is always no, they'll eventually quit asking.
After reading the GREAT responses given by the rest of the BP fam I'll say no more!
@Account Closed I wonder if you could target better tenants. Just some ideas, law students and med students are great, nurses are great, engineers & engineering students (even undergrads) are great. MBA students seemed to be flaky as a group - not staying long. Those are just some of my experiences.
Could you target a hospital or grad school and just advertise to them? If you can avoid Craigslist, it's nice, because you get sooooo many applicants and so many of them won't qualify, it's a lot of work. So, when you can do targeting advertising, just on the law school housing page, or maybe on the hospital's facebook page or bulletin boards, you have a lot less rejecting to do.
I've heard many excuses why the rent is late.
"My mom died"
"My daughter died"
"I had to go out of town because of a funeral"
"My brother got shot in the head"
"I gave my friend the money and she didn't get it to you"
"I gave my daughter the money and she was supposed to get it to you"
"The government didn't send my check yet"
"My employer was supposed to mail me my paycheck and I haven't gotten it yet"
"My employer messed up my hours and shorted me on my check"
"My employer changed my pay schedule from weekly to bi-weekly and I didn't get my check yet"
It's always because someone died, or someone else didn't do something, or the government or the employer's fault. It's NEVER the tenant's fault. You need to learn that as a landlord -- NEVER the tenant's fault. It's ALWAYS someone else's fault. (end sarcasm)
I haven't had a chance to read through all of the comments so I'm sorry if this is redundant.
It seriously sucks if this did actually happen. BUT there will be proof. Any bank will have you file paperwork for recuperating the money and they will be given a copy of it. They should be able to show you this. No paperwork, no leniency. Stick with what your lease agreements has printed out (fees, eviction, etc.). This is the real world, but things do happen.
I'm very impressed that you were able to recover that $8,000!
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
@Account Closed I wonder if you could target better tenants. Just some ideas, law students and med students are great, nurses are great, engineers & engineering students.
This is a great idea, I'll see if I can put up a flyer at the closest schools etc. I have only been using zillow lately.