All Forum Posts by: Ryan Moyer
Ryan Moyer has started 11 posts and replied 902 times.
Post: AirBNB or AirDNA or Awning - Rates & Occupancy - Who To Believe ? Mid July 2023

- Property Manager
- Orlando Kissimmee, Davenport
- Posts 917
- Votes 1,330
Quote from @Account Closed:
Quote from @John Underwood:
Quote from @Account Closed:
Quote from @John Underwood:
Go on Vrbo and Airbnb and check these yourself.
By the way, are the numbers given by AirBNB, AirDNA, etc for current expectations:
based on trailing 12 months divided by 12 ?
based on what other STRs around are currently charging ?
based on seasonally adjusted numbers ?
The time period they are using makes a big difference in putting together projections and seeing if a property is a viable STR based on a 12 month cycle.
I don't know if this is still accurate, but I believe AirDNA uses trailing 12 months, while Rabbu uses forward looking 90 days.
That's why AirDNA generally returns much higher results than Rabbu right now. AirDNA still capturing a bit of inflated 2022 numbers while Rabbu's numbers get hurt by the much shorter than usual lead time currently since their data is forward looking.
That also explains why in 2021 it was the opposite and Rabbu was estimating high (since everyone was all booked up for 2021) while AirDNA was still pulling pre-covid numbers since it looks backwards.
Post: Hillsborough Tampa FL Airbnb

- Property Manager
- Orlando Kissimmee, Davenport
- Posts 917
- Votes 1,330
Andrew Steffens is the resident Tampa expert around here. I'm sure he'll be able to answer your questions.
Post: Leads for cashflow STR properties?

- Property Manager
- Orlando Kissimmee, Davenport
- Posts 917
- Votes 1,330
Sounds like you want the Short Term Shop.
Post: West Eleventh Residences: An Airbnb Building, Your Thoughts?

- Property Manager
- Orlando Kissimmee, Davenport
- Posts 917
- Votes 1,330
Quote from @Andrew Steffens:
I would stay away from HOA's - little power to control the costs. Also do they force you to manage with them?
I looked into it a while back and if I'm remembering right yes you do have to manage with them, but the management fee is included in the HOA. It's essentially Airbnb managing it, which I would assume means they're partnering with someone for management. Although with them trying to expand into this niche (essentially Airbnb hotels) maybe they're planning to do it in-house so they can keep doing more.
If I recall that part of it was actually reasonably priced. Something like 10% covered full management and all HOA fees. But I could be mis-remembering.
The big downside to me was tying up all that money and not having a projected completion date until 2028, which as we know will likely be pushed back a few more times. That's a lot of time to lose out on the time value of that money, not to mention who knows what that market will look like that far in the future.
Another thing I was not impressed with was the sales people. Overseas call farm that would call back over and over and try not to let you off the phone. "Have you looked at the packet we sent yet?", "are you ready to put down a deposit?", "we can go ahead and get that deposit taken for you right now". Felt more like a shady telemarketing call for car insurance than a potential $1M real estate transaction.
Post: Arizona STR market article

- Property Manager
- Orlando Kissimmee, Davenport
- Posts 917
- Votes 1,330
Quote from @Bruce Woodruff:
Quote from @Noah Laker:
Phoenix / Scottsdale / Tempe / surrounding areas only recently implemented any sort of permit process, which essentially ended up being a $250 levy.
Barriers to entry are a huge factor. Many investors are scared to get into California -- and perhaps rightfully so, because I am now forced to attend a hearing this Wednesday at the Capitol to lobby against an ADDITIONAL 15% hospitality tax which is being proposed here in CA statewide.
It's never easy, is it?
Nothing is easy. Well nothing worth having or doing.....
Well there was a time for a while there in 2021 and early 2022 where it was both easy and worth having ;)
Post: Help with Analysis - 1 Bedroom Cabin near Pigeon Forge TN

- Property Manager
- Orlando Kissimmee, Davenport
- Posts 917
- Votes 1,330
Quote from @John Underwood:
Cleaning fees are a pass through. The guests pay these.
But something as small as cleaning fees could put you in the red then this isn't a money maker.
I'd look for a 2 or 3 bedroom cabin over a bedroom.
A 1 bedroom is only going to appeal to a couple who want a cheap place to stay.
If they're pulling the revenue data from AirDNA then it is including cleaning fees in the revenue, and hence cleaning will need to be subtracted back out as an expense.
I think this is something that trips a lot of people up when underwriting.
AirDNA total revenue DOES include cleaning fees.
AirDNA adr does NOT include cleaning fees.
This is why when you multiply ADR * Occupancy on AirDNA you get a number that is less than the total revenue.
So if using the total revenue number then cleaning does need to be subtracted as an expense. If using ADR then it does not.
Post: Short Term Rental, Long Term Wealth Book Feedback

- Property Manager
- Orlando Kissimmee, Davenport
- Posts 917
- Votes 1,330
Debt service is way up, revenue is generally down, down payments are way up, financing terms and costs are much worse.
The time of fast scaling has passed, unless you're very creative.
It was easy to scale fast when a down payment was 15-30k on a property that cash flowed several thousand dollars per month. Not so much when down payment plus closing costs are 150k+ for properties with modest if any cash flow.
Post: Including baby items in STRs

- Property Manager
- Orlando Kissimmee, Davenport
- Posts 917
- Votes 1,330
I have homes in this market and we get people asking about them fairly regularly. We supply them. If you get even one person that uses it as a tiebreaker to choose your property then it pays for itself and then some.
Post: Question on management companies for STR

- Property Manager
- Orlando Kissimmee, Davenport
- Posts 917
- Votes 1,330
In the Orlando area specifically, there are several of these that will do just the guest management/maintenance/cleaning while you control the listing.
Post: Best area for STR, Santa Rosa Beach, Nashville, Austin

- Property Manager
- Orlando Kissimmee, Davenport
- Posts 917
- Votes 1,330
Quote from @Luka Milicevic:
The only person that can really answer this accurately is someone that invests in ALL 3 markets lol!
I can say that anything CA should be avoided. Starting a business, investing, buying a house, etc.
I have helped many people from CA move to Nashville and can't understand how anyone can live under those crushing regulations and red tape
Nashville is a great market for both STR and MTRs. It has a mix of industries that draw in travelers from all parts of the country, not just tourism. There are several large employers in the area that have corporate staff coming in for extended stays as well.
I'm pretty sure she is talking about Santa Rosa Beach in Florida, not Santa Rosa the landlocked wine country in California.
Regardless, Nashville and Austin are just as oppressive from a regulatory standpoint as California anyways, so it's sixes there.