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Updated 6 days ago, 12/09/2024
Investing in Bitcoins
It is not an investment
it doesn't produce anything of value, look up Dutch tulip speculation in the 1600s it is basically the same thing.
ride the wave. There is no long haul imo
how many other currencies do you know of that a government will allow unregulated, untaxed, and and untraceable? The bigger it grows the larger the potential for someone to cry foul, and the hammer comes down. Along with a dozen other reasons it could end.
in the meantime, ride the wave ;)
- Realtor, General Contractor, and Developer
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There's a lot of people investing in Bitcoin and other digital currencies. Few people have no clue what is or how it works, I was just reading today that the cannabis growers that will be trading BILLIONS of dollars in CA, cannot deposit those funds in traditional banks, therefore; many will be using Bitcoins and other digital currency.
There's always going to be pros and cons of everything. What if you have a bunch of money in Bitcoins and North Korea sets off a nuclear bomb that takes out satellites and shuts down all communication, computers, etc. then Bitcoins aren't going to be too accessible will they?
I don't know much about digital currency, but will watch this thread to hear thoughts from those in IT.
- Karen Margrave
highly volatile and unpredictable. There is no logic behind.
If it does not make sense don't bother.....
Thanks for the input everyone! It’s just strange to me, going along with all your points, it’s a digital currency that people have an “itch” will be the “next big thing” but company’s are accepting bitcoins like regular currency to purchase products, I’ve been reading at least. I’m very skeptical about bitcoins but I guess it all depends on what the government will allow, along with what top end business minds will accept for their products
Originally posted by @Aaron K.:
It is not an investment
it doesn't produce anything of value, look up Dutch tulip speculation in the 1600s it is basically the same thing.
Please do your due diligence before parroting things.
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/there-never...
Originally posted by @Sam Shueh:
highly volatile and unpredictable. There is no logic behind.
If it does not make sense don't bother.....
High volatile? Yes. Unpredictable? Arguable.
The logic is speculation on Blockchain Technology would will be one of the next large digital revolutions.
Originally posted by @Alexander Felice:
ride the wave. There is no long haul imo
how many other currencies do you know of that a government will allow unregulated, untaxed, and and untraceable? The bigger it grows the larger the potential for someone to cry foul, and the hammer comes down. Along with a dozen other reasons it could end.
in the meantime, ride the wave ;)
While there are "Privacy Coins" like Monero, Bitcoin is not one of them.
I am not sure where you are located (location says US) but Bitcoin is regulated, taxed and (arguably) traced in many countries including the United States.
@Anthony Bertolino If you actually read the article you linked to past the headline you will see that there was tulip speculation and the market did crash, and there were people who treated it as an investment rather than a luxury good. My point still stands that bitcoin doesn't produce anything to make it an investment it is purely speculative like gold or antiques.
Warren Buffet has discussed this in the past saying if you had all the gold in the world you would have a giant cube of gold except for minor industrial uses, but if you had all the farmland in the world you would be able to produce a product (food) that people would buy, thus giving you a return on investment.
This is a RE site. I think if I can go to the title company hand them a digital money, if it is acceptable for RE transaction for real property. I will pay attention.
To me it boils down to bitcoin being a currency. I wouldn't consider any currency an investment since there is no value created. You only make money by trading, buy low sell high.
Only buy Bitcoin at an amount you are willing to lose because at the end of the day it is gambling, not investing. Stick to Real Estate!
I'd only play with extra money and pull back gains as it's super volatile.
And it's not investing to me.
Originally posted by @Karen Margrave:
There's a lot of people investing in Bitcoin and other digital currencies. Few people have no clue what is or how it works, I was just reading today that the cannabis growers that will be trading BILLIONS of dollars in CA, cannot deposit those funds in traditional banks, therefore; many will be using Bitcoins and other digital currency.
There's always going to be pros and cons of everything. What if you have a bunch of money in Bitcoins and North Korea sets off a nuclear bomb that takes out satellites and shuts down all communication, computers, etc. then Bitcoins aren't going to be too accessible will they?
I don't know much about digital currency, but will watch this thread to hear thoughts from those in IT.
Karen is right. One power outage at the wrong time and you and the "investment" are toast. See the article on the "missing" $4,000,000 in Bitcoins. I was in High Tech BTW. And just what about 145,000,000 accounts were hacked at Equifax don't you get? Bank of America "lost" a $1,000,000 payroll deposit one weekend. We finally located it. the guy who's account it got dropped into was quite surprised. Things happen. I'd love to believe that we have an alternative to the paper we pass around, but we don't yet.
In addition, did you know that your bank account can disappear or your electronic refund from the IRS can be hacked, and there is NO recourse?The IRS will NOT replace the lost funds.
ANY electronic "money" (wire transfers, debit cards, credit cards, bank accounts, 401k's) are at risk. But obviously it can't happen to you reading this, eh? In fact, a bunch of people are complaining that the company they electronically had their renters send the rent to, has gone bankrupt and now they are stuck. They can't retrieve the money, At least with a check you have proof the payment was sent and can present that to the bank for "cash".
For protection, keep a bunch of currency on hand, don't use a bank's "safe deposit box" (they won't let you in when there is a crisis), keep plenty of food at home. I asked the check out guy at Safeway if they had a way to sell food if the power went out or if the cash register lost connection to the satellite and he said "they shut down the store and send us home". Welcome to the REAL world.
No, electronic currency isn't "safe" yet.
Oh, I got "off topic". Sorry. But with a little planning you might still eat in a power outage. See, Hurricane Kartina, Maria, etc, etc,
I just think of Beanie Babies whenever I hear Bitcoin.
The internet is not going down, and sky net is not going to come take your data. Your more likely to misplace your cellphone, wallet, or kids, than you are to lose data now of days.. welcome to the cloud!
If you think keeping money in your backyard keeps you financially safe, just remember how that did not workout in Greece. People's money came worthless overnight. They started trading hand written IOUs for food. If things go truly south, you may as well invest in dry goods, it will be worth more.
Cryptocurrency is not regulated at this point, until then it provides a free way for anyone to move money between countries tax free; convert illegal gains from criminal enterprises, legally hide business profits as it's not recognized as money... That's trillions of dollars moving around. It's here to stay, that's for sure... Just like the Internet in 1990's, people are going to make and lose a lot of money. The internet also got reborn in the 2000's, and has been working just fine ever since.
We've already gotten past stage 1 of Cryptocurrency, it's now solidifying into stage 2 as a framework used by many, at some point the Government will start regulating it in some way, then things will smooth out and people will talk about the days people made and lost mad money with Cryptocurrency!
Originally posted by @Alexander Felice:
ride the wave. There is no long haul imo
how many other currencies do you know of that a government will allow unregulated, untaxed, and and untraceable?
https://www.google.com/search?q=is+bitcoin+traceab...
That's not correct. Bitcoin is incredibly traceable since the blockchain technology is public. See link above.
And "unregulated, untaxed" ? Currency is currently regulated by a group that wants your money to be worth less than it currently is (inflation). I'll pass on that. Also, untaxed? Money is not taxed, people or businesses are.
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
Originally posted by @Karen Margrave:
There's a lot of people investing in Bitcoin and other digital currencies. Few people have no clue what is or how it works, I was just reading today that the cannabis growers that will be trading BILLIONS of dollars in CA, cannot deposit those funds in traditional banks, therefore; many will be using Bitcoins and other digital currency.
There's always going to be pros and cons of everything. What if you have a bunch of money in Bitcoins and North Korea sets off a nuclear bomb that takes out satellites and shuts down all communication, computers, etc. then Bitcoins aren't going to be too accessible will they?
I don't know much about digital currency, but will watch this thread to hear thoughts from those in IT.
Karen is right. One power outage at the wrong time and you and the "investment" are toast. See the article on the "missing" $4,000,000 in Bitcoins. I was in High Tech BTW. And just what about 145,000,000 accounts were hacked at Equifax don't you get? Bank of America "lost" a $1,000,000 payroll deposit one weekend. We finally located it. the guy who's account it got dropped into was quite surprised. Things happen. I'd love to believe that we have an alternative to the paper we pass around, but we don't yet.
In addition, did you know that your bank account can disappear or your electronic refund from the IRS can be hacked, and there is NO recourse?The IRS will NOT replace the lost funds.
ANY electronic "money" (wire transfers, debit cards, credit cards, bank accounts, 401k's) are at risk. But obviously it can't happen to you reading this, eh? In fact, a bunch of people are complaining that the company they electronically had their renters send the rent to, has gone bankrupt and now they are stuck. They can't retrieve the money, At least with a check you have proof the payment was sent and can present that to the bank for "cash".
For protection, keep a bunch of currency on hand, don't use a bank's "safe deposit box" (they won't let you in when there is a crisis), keep plenty of food at home. I asked the check out guy at Safeway if they had a way to sell food if the power went out or if the cash register lost connection to the satellite and he said "they shut down the store and send us home". Welcome to the REAL world.
No, electronic currency isn't "safe" yet.
Oh, I got "off topic". Sorry. But with a little planning you might still eat in a power outage. See, Hurricane Kartina, Maria, etc, etc,
Bill, while there are cases of third party counter risk similar to "Equifax" getting breached, these are due to centralized points of failures and (generally) completely out of your hands.
There is significant difference in holding your own Digital Asset using Private Key Cryptography. This is your starting point to actually learn what Crypto-Currencies are about.
Originally posted by @Levi T.:
The internet is not going down, and sky net is not going to come take your data. Your more likely to misplace your cellphone, wallet, or kids, than you are to lose data now of days.. welcome to the cloud!
If you think keeping money in your backyard keeps you financially safe, just remember how that did not workout in Greece. People's money came worthless overnight. They started trading hand written IOUs for food. If things go truly south, you may as well invest in dry goods, it will be worth more.
We've already gotten past stage 1 of Cryptocurrency, it's now solidifying into stage 2 as a framework used by many, at some point the Government will start regulating it in some way, then things will smooth out and people will talk about the days people made and lost mad money with Cryptocurrency!
+1
Originally posted by @Clint Earnest:
Originally posted by @Alexander Felice:
ride the wave. There is no long haul imo
how many other currencies do you know of that a government will allow unregulated, untaxed, and and untraceable?
https://www.google.com/search?q=is+bitcoin+traceab...
That's not correct. Bitcoin is incredibly traceable since the blockchain technology is public. See link above.
And "unregulated, untaxed" ? Currency is currently regulated by a group that wants your money to be worth less than it currently is (inflation). I'll pass on that. Also, untaxed? Money is not taxed, people or businesses are.
+2
To all:
This entire topic thread is quite delightful to read because it shows just how early we are in the Digital Asset category. For those willing to be open minded and do quality due diligence, there are great rewards to be had.
Feel free to PM me for any serious debate(s), discussion or simply pointers :]
Originally posted by @Aaron Mazzrillo:
I just think of Beanie Babies whenever I hear Bitcoin.
Perhaps identical except for one big difference, billionaires invest in bitcoin / crypto. Some of those guys made hundreds of millions in a couple three years. Now several billionaires are starting up and these coin funds are going into 401ks, IRAs etc. It's real money vs stuff animals. I get your point still.
@Andrew McManamon did you buy real estate in 2007 when everyone told you it was a good idea?
Personally i invested small amounts into bitcoin and xrp, i agree with Dan Wickland, invest what you willing to lose. I'll be interested to see how far it gets; if it does't oh well, if it does, yes!! Most of my funds are in flips though, and small faction in stocks; i prefer some diversity, and cryptocurrency is another option to branch out too.
- Realtor, General Contractor, and Developer
- Redding, CA & Bend OR
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I think the concept is fascinating, and that it's in just the beginning stages, but here to stay. Who ever imagined robots that are advanced enough they can create their own language to communicate with each other? Talk about I Robot,
As for the internet not going down @Levi T. In the 80's the electrical grid from Oregon to Mexico went down, and it was chaos for a few hours. People had no idea what to do at stop lights, gas pumps didn't work and those that already pumped gas couldn't pay because the attendant couldn't take cash, the lights were out in office buildings and hotels, grocery stores were worried about frozen and refrigerated food going bad, theme parks had people stuck in rides screaming to get off. Imagine a real crisis where they couldn't get the grid back up, and you couldn't access your accounts, etc.
As another poster mentioned, there are already financial risks in the ways in which we handle money, therefore; why are investors going to look at crypto currencies any differently than any of those? It's not like we have a gold standard any longer.
- Karen Margrave
Only a handful of people in this thread know what they're talking about. The others are throwing off BS they read on Forbes or CNBC. Cryptocurrency (maybe not necessarily Bitcoin) will encompass a significant percentage of money in this world. If you don't agree, you simply don't understand the technology. Anything based on blockchain (also known as distributed ledger technology) is going to revolutionize every aspect of our lives. Do your own research and come to your own conclusions. For sure, don't just believe what a few luddites on BP have to say.
Originally posted by @Jesse M.:
Only a handful of people in this thread know what they're talking about. The others are throwing off BS they read on Forbes or CNBC. Cryptocurrency (maybe not necessarily Bitcoin) will encompass a significant percentage of money in this world. If you don't agree, you simply don't understand the technology. Anything based on blockchain (also known as distributed ledger technology) is going to revolutionize every aspect of our lives. Do your own research and come to your own conclusions. For sure, don't just believe what a few luddites on BP have to say.
One of the few in here who understands the space from a macro level. Well said Jesse.
To all, read the following article by my friend Ari:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/apaul/2017/11/27/its-1994-in-cryptocurrency/#4801b1eeb28a
I'd argue bitcoin is more "real" than our current currency. Once we left the gold standard..money became fiat...
that said, investing in bitcoin takes some stomach as the swings are huge. but i personally feel as @Jesse M. mentions, this will be an important currency and could, if the fed doesnt have a hand in it, take out our current currency.
many who buy bitcoin are also buying up large sums of gold, silver, platinum, and copper on the side as well as hedges against the current currency.
this is a huge discussion in general and i for one like the idea of it but with limited resources now, id rather invest in real estate until i get some more income to move to bitcoin investing.
Quite a turnout on the topic, great debates! I agree with the majority that this electronic currency or “digital currency” is just too new to have a very educated opinion but of course you can do your due diligence to be ahead for that matter. It was simply a question I threw out to everyone at BP, just to see what some educated investors would think of the currency. I do believe there can be a future to the currency and I’m very curious on how far it will go. I’ve been following warren Buffett on the matter and he seems to be very bias about it, but hey let’s wait and see!