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All Forum Posts by: Patrick Roberts

Patrick Roberts has started 4 posts and replied 346 times.

Post: New law makes wholesaling illegal is SC

Patrick Roberts
Pro Member
#2 Private Lending & Conventional Mortgage Advice Contributor
Posted
  • Lender
  • Charleston, SC
  • Posts 351
  • Votes 244
Quote from @Nehemiah Thorn:

Hi, can you explain how an installment contract would work in regards to the SC anti-wholesaling law? Thanks a bunch! :)


 The buyer enters into an agreement to purchase the property by making payments with some amount due in the first payment and then a schedule of the remaining balance paid in installments. Meanwhile, the deed is placed in escrow. This give the buyer equitable interest in the property, making them an owner in the eyes of the law. Also makes them put skin in the game. That's how I understood the argument.

Post: New law makes wholesaling illegal is SC

Patrick Roberts
Pro Member
#2 Private Lending & Conventional Mortgage Advice Contributor
Posted
  • Lender
  • Charleston, SC
  • Posts 351
  • Votes 244
Quote from @Tom Gimer:
Quote from @John Underwood:
Quote from @Tom Gimer:

@John Underwood  I read what I believe to be the new SC legislation. Please provide the full new definition of “wholesaling” and reconcile the conclusion of your post with the last sentence in the definition.


  No need. After listening to several Attorneys, they are not going to risk closing these deals goin forward as they have been done in the past.

OK then I will. The definition of wholesaling (a new term under SC brokerage laws) reads as follows:

"Wholesaling" means having a contractual interest in purchasing residential real estate from a property owner, then marketing the property for sale to a different buyer prior to taking legal ownership of the property. Advertising or marketing real estate owned by another individual or entity with the expectation of compensation falls under the definition of "broker" and requires licensure. "Wholesaling" does not refer to the assigning or offering to assign a contractual right to purchase residential real estate.

Since every word of a statute has to be given meaning, the last sentence is a clear carve out for investors who assign contracts and offer that interest to the end buyer. Sounds like more business is coming for local attorneys who understand the new law.


 I've kinda been thinking the same thing. Contract assignments are very common across many industries, including real estate. I've read through the bill and watched/read a few commentaries on it. There's an interview between Jerry Norton and Gary Pickren on youtube that I feel is particularly insightful. Pickren is an attorney in SC with a ton of experience and also sits on the RE Board for SC. It was clear from the video that this new law attempts to prevent wholesaling entirely, and Pickren feels that the interpretation of the law is sufficiently wide enough that any marketing for the assignment of a contract will fall of under the definition of this law. 

I'm not so sure I entirely agree with this. As you said, codified laws are very specific and have specific meanings - this is why there are definitions in near every statute and law. The average person should be able to read a law/code/statute and understand what actions are illegal for him/her to perform. They can't be vague and are specifically designed not to be left open to the subjective interpretation of a fact finder. 

It seems to me that the legislature is actually targeting equity stripping by wholesalers with this bill. I think they don't like the idea of Johnny the wholesaler convincing grandma to sell her house for $150K (when it's really worth $300k), and then turning around and selling the contract for it to make an obscene amount of money relative to the work performed, all at grandma's expense. They feel that a licensed agent shouldve sold grandma's house on the open market and gotten her the full amount. 

They attempted to prevent this by asserting that wholesaling is an activity that requires licensing, because licensed agents are much easier to regulate. It's very difficult to create blanket laws stopping people from entering into voluntary transactions, even the transaction is largely disadvantageous to one party. But when one of the parties is licensed by a governmental board of some sort, the board can subject the licensed individual to higher standards behavior, and they can do this largely at will and without the higher thresholds of most criminal laws. This can be seen throughout the licensing of RE agents, mortgage lenders, financial advisors, etc. I think this is why they wanted to attach the licensing requirement to these kinds of deals - to give them the broad leeway they want in saying what people can or cant do without having to write 4,000 laws.

I don't know that this law as it's currently written will withstand the suits that are sure to come from investors asserting that the marketing of a contractual position to buy a property is not captured by the wholesaling definition (and I don't think that it is). But, I think that wholesaling is probably dead for while because the fearmongering and fistbanging from the SC board will likely deter most closing attorneys from working these deals. I think the message being sent to attorneys is, "you can try it if you want, but if we win, we're going to hammer you to make an example," and my guess is very few attorneys are going to risk that. Time will tell, though.

Post: Wanting info on DSCR loan for a condo?

Patrick Roberts
Pro Member
#2 Private Lending & Conventional Mortgage Advice Contributor
Posted
  • Lender
  • Charleston, SC
  • Posts 351
  • Votes 244
Quote from @Wayne Doucet:

Thanks for all the great advice. I know we have been talking about DSCR stuff I am also looking at a property with 3 units on it. This would fall under more of the commercial loan side. I have one lender that is wanting 25% down that is local. Is there any other lenders out there that will do 20%?

There are some investors that will allow 80% LTV, but pricing on those loans will likely be horrible. Most lenders/investors are wanting a margin of safety in investment loans given where the economy and RE cycle are at. I would expect to stay at/below 75% LTV for pricing to be reasonable or near market.

Post: Help Me Start Short Term Rentals

Patrick Roberts
Pro Member
#2 Private Lending & Conventional Mortgage Advice Contributor
Posted
  • Lender
  • Charleston, SC
  • Posts 351
  • Votes 244
Quote from @Logan Jones:

Hey everyone, my name is Logan Jones. I am trying to start doing short term vacation homes/rental properties. I am 21 and do not know where to start. Please help me with any source of knowledge that helped you or even steps to starting. Thank you so much and glad to join the bigger pockets community!


AirDNA can provide some insights on data in the market you're planning to work in. Airbtics is a similar platform. I would also attend the BR area meetups and try to speak with someone active in the STR niche. This platform is a great place, also.

I'm originally from BR. Give me a call if I can help with any questions about the financial side of STRs. I don't currently own/manage any STRs, so I may not be of much help on the operations side of them. 

Post: Newbie here to learn and grow

Patrick Roberts
Pro Member
#2 Private Lending & Conventional Mortgage Advice Contributor
Posted
  • Lender
  • Charleston, SC
  • Posts 351
  • Votes 244
Quote from @Francisca Mac:

Super excited to start this new adventure in real estate investing. 


Charleston has a super strong REI community. Get involved with the local meetups and FB pages. Lots of activity here.

Post: How to get cash out of a property you bought 3 months ago for cash.

Patrick Roberts
Pro Member
#2 Private Lending & Conventional Mortgage Advice Contributor
Posted
  • Lender
  • Charleston, SC
  • Posts 351
  • Votes 244
Quote from @Jeremy Porter:

dscr told me i can only get what property purchase price plus rehab and not 70-80% of appraisal. 


DSCR products are not universally the same. Different investors back different products and have varying overlays. Talk to a few different lenders. Someone will likely not have an overlay like what you're referring to, but min loan size may be an issue. Most DSCRs will be at/below 75% LTV, and very few will go below $100k loan size. Other variables will be income coverage, your experience and FICO, the market, and the property type.

Post: Wanting info on DSCR loan for a condo?

Patrick Roberts
Pro Member
#2 Private Lending & Conventional Mortgage Advice Contributor
Posted
  • Lender
  • Charleston, SC
  • Posts 351
  • Votes 244
Quote from @Wayne Doucet:
Quote from @David Bilandzija:

@Wayne Doucet Absolutely. Condos are eligible properties for DSCR programs. You'll want to find out in advance if the property is a warrantable or non-warrantable.

Question might sound silly. But what are meaning by warrantable or no warrantable?

 Warrantable condos can get traditional financing, such as Conventional loans. Nonwarrantable condos will have to have nonQM financing (which is usually more expensive). In some cases, you may not be able to finance the unit at all. The condominium project itself has to be evaluated, not simply the individual unit. 

Post: North and South Carolina vs Florida

Patrick Roberts
Pro Member
#2 Private Lending & Conventional Mortgage Advice Contributor
Posted
  • Lender
  • Charleston, SC
  • Posts 351
  • Votes 244

Columbia, Greenville, and Spartanburg are still affordable and mostly doable for LTRs. Bluffton/Beaufort/HHI are growing rapidly but still relatively doable compared with Charleston and the coastal areas. STRs are super popular in Charleston, but there's a lot of regulation now that's only getting worse, as well as some saturation issues.

HOI costs will be higher east of I95 in SC for the most part. Prob around 50% or more of the properties in the Lowcountry will need flood insurance, also. 

DYOR on property taxes in SC. There's a stark difference in tax rates between legal residences (primary residences) and investment properties/second homes. 

Post: Deciding ! Keep rental or sell ?

Patrick Roberts
Pro Member
#2 Private Lending & Conventional Mortgage Advice Contributor
Posted
  • Lender
  • Charleston, SC
  • Posts 351
  • Votes 244

I would look at the ROE differences between what you can make now by selling, including the yield on that lump sum if reinvested in the current market conditions, versus what the property will be worth at a point in the future (5 years, 10 years, etc). You'll want to consider this in light of your long term plans - i.e., do you want to have a portfolio of RE properties down the road, or are you expecting to cash out and do something different. 

Constructing an IRR timeline on both options using the timeframe you decide on will help you visualize the better yielding investment. You could also explore other options, such as seller financing the property for another investor. If you structure the deal correctly, you could possibly get some of the equity in cash now while keeping some equity invested and even increase your yield.

As someone has already pointed out, if you're selling just to avoid upcoming capex, an astute buyer is likely to spot this and the value of the property will reflect this. If you're selling to someone who will be a homeowner and is buying for emotional reasons, this may have a different impact. 

Post: Looking for Contractors and/or Handymen in Baton Rouge

Patrick Roberts
Pro Member
#2 Private Lending & Conventional Mortgage Advice Contributor
Posted
  • Lender
  • Charleston, SC
  • Posts 351
  • Votes 244
Quote from @Edgard Leite:
Quote from @Patrick Roberts:
Quote from @Dane Jutila:

Thanks, Patrick! Really apreciate it, please do. These will be lower priced homes rented out to Housing Choice Voucher (section 8) tenants, no luxury needed but still want to create a nice environment for renters.


 Check your inbox

@Patrick Roberts, could you please share their contact information with me as well?


I appreciate the help


 Will do