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All Forum Posts by: Michael P.

Michael P. has started 30 posts and replied 1900 times.

Post: Takeaways from a REI conference for my California friends (and beginning investors)

Michael P.Posted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Brooke Park Drive
  • Posts 1,978
  • Votes 2,439

 I'm not following. What is "cat tree flipping". 

Post: Property managment in Toledo

Michael P.Posted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Brooke Park Drive
  • Posts 1,978
  • Votes 2,439

If we are talking single family grass cutting should be in the lease as the tenants responsibility. Yes my PM changes the HVAC filters and has done many roofs for me. PM me if you want their info.

Post: I spent $800K with Own It Detroit -- $20,000 on this rehab. Rate it! (Part 2)

Michael P.Posted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Brooke Park Drive
  • Posts 1,978
  • Votes 2,439
Quote from @Steve K.:

Why would you throw another $800k into a market that you're bleeding money in? It seems you're justifying it with appreciation, but it's not a time-proven appreciation market. Plus I suspect your valuations are high compared to what your actual net sales price would be if you sold those properties today. Don't forget transaction costs, seller concessions, vacancy loss if you sell vacant (which you should), capital gains taxes on the profit if there is any, etc. You need a minimum amount of rent to support a rental (realistically $1,500/month or more, this is what you need coming in to have the minimum amount of $300-500 going towards maintenance/repairs/capex/issues that come up), so your best buyer is probably an owner occupant. Can locals afford to buy a property there for $100k? Are there other less expensive options for them nearby that they might buy instead? If so, your valuations are high and your days on market will be long, and your list to sales price ratio won't be good. Maybe a newer investor with similar loose underwriting, just looking to get in the game will buy them (it's an offensive term and I'm sorry for that but it's called "The Greater Fool" theory). 

You're seeing the truth in your portfolio performance. Hiring a new PM is not going to fix this I'm afraid, because it's simply a math problem. Operating rentals costs a certain amount of money and it's really hard for low-rent properties to make enough to be self-sustainable and spin off any profit unless the owner is hands-on, self-managing, fixing things themselves etc. Every time a tenant has an issue, the PM calls an electrician, plumber or handyman to fix it, it's going to cost a few hundred bucks minimum, sometimes thousands. If your monthly budget for this type of thing is $100, you're losing money. Not making these repairs is not an option, you can't just not fix things or you lose tenants and suffer vacancy loss, potentially have legal problems, and just end up with more differed maintenance/ bigger issues over time if you don't stay on top of repairs. This is just the normal operating costs, never mind the big things that come up occasionally with capex like when you have to replace a major component (furnace, water heater, sewer line, driveway, steps, deck, windows, roof, doors, siding, landscaping, etc,) and it costs $10-20k. A typical turnover can be a month or 2 of vacancy and $2-10k in make-ready costs (cleaning, paint, flooring, appliances, towel racks, vanities, etc. that gets beat up and broken norma wear and tear). There's no budget for any of that when the rent is only $800 and at best you're putting $200 aside for those things in a rainy day fund. Realistically you're probably taking a haircut on these purchases, and definitely continuing to lose money every month if you keep them. What is the point? 

It seems that you can afford to invest in a better market where you'd be more likely to make money instead of losing it. Why not do that? Not to mention it would be so much less of a headache and so much less time and energy invested on your behalf, plus much less exposure to risk, easier to manage etc. to just buy a single multifamily for $800k in a good location with strong underlying fundamentals. If you were somebody who could only afford a $75k property and your only option is to bootstrap your way up starting from the bottom, then that would be different. I'd say go for it, everybody has to start somewhere. If you were to self-manage one property like this like a hawk then slowly add another and another, ideally down the street from where you live, doing all the maintenance and repairs yourself in order to avoid losing money, then that could make sense. But it sounds like that's not your situation, so I don't get why you'd want to hold a portfolio like this. Too much risk, too little upside.  

Detroit is not what most investors consider an appreciation market. 2 years of appreciation during a time period when every other market appreciated also, following decades of up and down with extra down doesn't suddenly make it an appreciation market. Not if your strategy is long term buy and hold. It's more of a classic boom/bust town that is still bulldozing whole neighborhoods because of an oversupply of housing due to the population shrinking by half. In 2010 the values there went all the way down to what they had been in 1993, 17 years of appreciation gone. The next downturn could be a repeat, if the subsidies dry up and the dumb money stops coming in, propping up prices. One thing I like about real estate over stocks is that there is always the underlying asset with RE, and it's rare for RE values to go to zero in good locations, but there is the risk of that happening in places like Detroit. These assets are illiquid in a downturn. Why buy the real estate equivalent of a penny stock when you can afford to buy blue chip aristocrat dividend stocks (Class A multifamily properties in good locations with actual strong fundamentals like population growth, a diverse and recession-resistant job market, limited supply and high demand, affordability, and consistent long-term appreciation)?

 Great post. 

Post: I bought 1.5M worth of property in Detroit... Here are the numbers.

Michael P.Posted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Brooke Park Drive
  • Posts 1,978
  • Votes 2,439

I’m guessing your $4,911 per month cashflow will look more like $0 per month. But I hope I am wrong. 

Post: WOW, Toledo is the future!

Michael P.Posted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Brooke Park Drive
  • Posts 1,978
  • Votes 2,439
Quote from @Remington Lyman:
Quote from @Michael P.:
Quote from @Remington Lyman:
Quote from @Michael P.:
Quote from @Remington Lyman:
Quote from @Michael P.:

These articles are ridiculous...

How is every city in the top 10 places to invest in real estate?


 Every city is not in the top 10.  Only Toledo.  Toledo forever.


 True. I cannot wait for you to visit there


 Gross. I just invest there. Not going to visit there.

Columbus looks cool to visit.


It is more cool than Toledo. The last time I was there they said I was not welcomed back to the Toledo Athletic Club... Too many Michigan fans up there for my liking. Started chirping them at the squash tournament. They did not like that.

My only other experience was when I visited my then girlfriend, now wife when she was interning at Owens Corning for the summer. I told her I was not coming back after the first visit. We were staying on the University campus and there was only one bar within walking distance


You should move the family to Toledo 

Post: WOW, Toledo is the future!

Michael P.Posted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Brooke Park Drive
  • Posts 1,978
  • Votes 2,439
Quote from @Remington Lyman:
Quote from @Michael P.:
Quote from @Remington Lyman:
Quote from @Michael P.:

These articles are ridiculous...

How is every city in the top 10 places to invest in real estate?


 Every city is not in the top 10.  Only Toledo.  Toledo forever.


 True. I cannot wait for you to visit there


 Gross. I just invest there. Not going to visit there.

Columbus looks cool to visit.

Post: WOW, Toledo is the future!

Michael P.Posted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Brooke Park Drive
  • Posts 1,978
  • Votes 2,439
Quote from @Remington Lyman:
Quote from @Michael P.:

These articles are ridiculous...

How is every city in the top 10 places to invest in real estate?


 Every city is not in the top 10.  Only Toledo.  Toledo forever.

Post: WOW, Toledo is the future!

Michael P.Posted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Brooke Park Drive
  • Posts 1,978
  • Votes 2,439

Post: Norada Capital Management suspending payments

Michael P.Posted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Brooke Park Drive
  • Posts 1,978
  • Votes 2,439
Quote from @James Wise:
Quote from @Jay Hinrichs:
Quote from @James Wise:
Quote from @Jay Hinrichs:
Quote from @James Wise:
Quote from @Adam Terneus:

Just got another email from Marco…😑

17% Interest Promissory Note | Short Terms
My partners and I are raising $5 million of short-term expansion capital for our exciting and profitable growing business, the Aspire Tour.

Aspire is "The Largest Business Tour in the U.S." ~ Forbes

Aspire is a major part of our Level Upand Money Is Mastermind family.
We have roughly 1,900 paying members with a current valuation of $43 million.

We're looking for a small number of Promissory Note investors with these terms:
.
    • 17% annual interest.
    • 12-month or 36-monthterm.
    • Quarterly interest payments.
    • Secured by equity. (not real estate-based)
    • $50,000 minimum investment.
    • First-come, first-serve basis.
    • Accredited investors only.
.
Feel free to book a 10-15-minute call to learn more.

Marco Santarelli, Partner
Aspire Tour and Money Is Mastermind

P.S. Be sure to
check out Aspire Tour on as well.

Click Here to Book a

 Lol, they even got the Wolf of Wall Street. Nothing says "this is a legitimate investment" like the investment company hiring the dude who stole hundreds of millions of dollars from people.


 ya but I loved the movie !!  



 well going to Nuk on them sure wont achieve the return of investment all but assures a wipe out. 


 Based on what I've seen in this thread and a very very limited look at these investments and the websites behind them, I'd say these investors have a better shot at getting a date with Margot Robbie than getting their money back.


I bet RadioShack could make a comeback in Cleveland. Just needs a hype man who is good at making videos. 

Post: All Cash or Loan

Michael P.Posted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Brooke Park Drive
  • Posts 1,978
  • Votes 2,439
Quote from @Kevin Goldman:

Just got back to Los Angeles from inspecting the property in Toledo...  Laundry list of deferred maintenance, looked like total slumlord status:   I cancelled escrow today.  

  • Moisture in ceiling; subfloor damage.
  • Moisture in ceiling; staining and previous repairs.
  • Moisture in baseboard and floor.
  • Moisture in ceiling; staining.
  • Moisture in ceiling.
  • Roof replacement; address moisture and leaks.
  • Exterior inspection; identify and fix moisture sources.
  • Fix moisture damage.
  • Electrical system overhaul; ensure safety and compliance.
  • Temporary housing costs for tenants during repairs.

  • Send it to me so I can buy it for lowball price.