Oceanpointe Investments LLC

[Todd Burton]

I believe this will the be the final and definitive word regarding Oceanpointe Investments LLC, Bert Whalen and by association, their closely allied business partner, Morris Invest.

The Indiana Attorney General has concluded their investigation of Oceanpointe Investments LLC and, along with the Indiana Real Estate Commission, they have “Permanently Revoked” the Real Estate license of Oceanpointe and Bert Whalen as of 12/18/17. Please note; per Indiana Code: 25-34.1-3-2; no person shall, for consideration, sell, buy, trade, exchange, option, lease, rent, manage, list, or appraise real estate or negotiate or offer to perform any of those acts in Indiana or with respect to real estate situated in Indiana, without a license.

Here is a  that has the case details as well as information regarding Mr. Bert Whalen which includes “Renewal Fraud” of his Indiana Real Estate License.

[Alex Corral]

Wow.

[Jay Hinrichs]

@Todd Burton  I was wondering if Morris himself was licensed in the markets he works in or maybe had an employee of his that was licensed .. but you know many of those selling these turn keys or out of state are not properly licensed.. just like most wholesalers do it illegally as well.

but anyway... this should lead to a lot of business for other PM's although I bet many won't take on the low end stuff these guys have been selling.. its a niche you have to want to deal in.. Maybe Alpine will take them on or FS 

[Son D.]

@Todd Burton so what happens to all the properties that they are managing or in different stages of rehab?

[Clay Manship]

Thanks for sharing, @Todd Burton. Confirms what everyone has speculated for quite some time. Wow.

[Todd Burton]

Originally posted by @Son D.:

@Todd Burton so what happens to all the properties that they are managing or in different stages of rehab?

I don't know if or what the Attorney General does regarding follow up or contacting the property owners. I suspect they don't do anything further. It's really up to the property owners at this point. I would recommend they immediately move their management to licensed management companies. 

Regarding rehabs, selling properties they own, etc, that does not require a Real Estate license. It's up to the consumer to due their own due diligence on the vendors and sellers they use and purchase from. We, as a community, just need to continue to report and post problems and issues so that potential customers can have access to to all the important information. 

[Todd Fry]

Todd, thanks for bringing this to the forum's attention, and to my post about my experience with OP/MI.  Live and learn.

Oh, and cool name bro.  ;)

[Kieran Mazzola]

Thanks @Todd Burton. Quick question, just to make sure. The document linked has the spelling Oceanpoint, without the "e" at the end. The Oceanpointe that I've been dealing with as a result of MI is spelled with the "e." Are we sure that they are the same? Or are they using two different LLCs spelled slightly differently for the same purpose?   I'm not an Oceanpoint(e) defender by any means, the one I've been dealing with has been terrible and I've been seriously thinking about switching PMs even before this.  Looks like the time to jump ship was about  month ago!!

[Todd Burton]

Originally posted by @Kieran Mazzola:

Thanks @Todd Burton. Quick question, just to make sure. The document linked has the spelling Oceanpoint, without the "e" at the end. The Oceanpointe that I've been dealing with as a result of MI is spelled with the "e." Are we sure that they are the same? Or are they using two different LLCs spelled slightly differently for the same purpose?   I'm not an Oceanpoint(e) defender by any means, the one I've been dealing with has been terrible and I've been seriously thinking about switching PMs even before this.  Looks like the time to jump ship was about  month ago!!

Yes, I am 100% sure they are the same. If you click on the link in my post you'll see the supporting document and the principal is Bert Whalen. I'm not sure if the different spellings are an effort to confuse or mislead people or just the simple issue that most people don't pay close attention and are not used to spelling "pointe" with an "e" at the end. 

[Hector Ortiz]

Hello @Todd Burton

Thanks for the info. Can you let us know where you found the article with the Attorney General conclusion? I contacted the Indiana Real Estate Commision (http://www.in.gov/apps/pla/litigation/searchresults.aspx?mode=adv) via phone and web, and found out Bert does not have real estate license, but OceanPointe is still active and not shut down. I do own one property that I bought with MI, and will be buying a few more in Indiana very soon. The document you posted can be found online via their litigation search on the website, but the conclusion is different. Love this forum. Keep up the good work guys.

EDIT: Sorry for the duplicate from another forum. 

[Todd Burton]

Originally posted by @Hector Ortiz:

Hello @Todd Burton

Thanks for the info. Can you let us know where you found the article with the Attorney General conclusion? I contacted the Indiana Real Estate Commision (http://www.in.gov/apps/pla/litigation/searchresults.aspx?mode=adv) via phone and web, and found out Bert does not have real estate license, but OceanPointe is still active and not shut down. I do own one property that I bought with MI, and will be buying a few more in Indiana very soon. The document you posted can be found online via their litigation search on the website, but the conclusion is different. Love this forum. Keep up the good work guys.

 Hello Hector- The information was not an article but I letter directly from the office of the Indiana Attorney General. The letter states specifically that the matter was regarding the license of Oceanpointe Investments. That letter is posted above. I also called to get a copy of the Board's order and was told it takes time to process the paperwork and get the final decision documents into the system. 

[John Thedford]

Excellent. Another FRAUD AND SCAMMER that believes they are entitled to break the law. Good riddance

[David Brown]

Thanks for posting Todd, 

We are in the process of ditching him, and had just hired a lawyer. Would be interested to hear of anyone else in the same boat. Are they looking at any other business partners? Jack Gibson etc?

[Jay Hinrichs]

@David Brown  I suspect there are more than a few product feeders to Morris if the claims of 50 a month in sales were accurate he had to have more than a few companies bringing him deals.

its funny because I have asked several times those that posted to look at their huds and see exactly who sold them the property... now these could be a lot of double closes with oceanpointe and the straw man.  

but I am sure this is far deeper as it unravels.  Its like Clay Manship got on here and said he sold property to them.. that's one guy removed. .. but I know clay is just a wholesaler middle man in these deals.

Good luck with your property !!!

[Jay Hinrichs]

@Todd Burton   here are the last guys I know that did this same stuff sold absolute junk in Indy and KC and did not finish rehabs.. but they went a step further with rental gurantee's and then borrowed money etc etc

Look where they ended up.

https://www.sec.gov/litigation/litreleases/2016/lr23451.htm

and Clatfelter got away without Jail time but his career as you can imagine is not good.

Duetcher got 7 years hard time.

this is serious stuff you start representing that your selling stuff .. taking money and not following through its a scheme and if enough people complain boy your in for a world of hurt.

 

[Ryan B.]

As I read the complaint and the letter, the action was taken against Bert personally.  Bert isn't the only person involved with Oceanpointe who holds a real estate license (well, I guess he didn't really have one).  I don't think this shuts them down.  

[Todd Burton]

The Indiana Attorney General's letter says specifically "In the matter of the license of Oceanpointe Investments, LLC".

[Todd Burton]

Bert Whalen of Oceanpointe Investments LLC threatens to kill me!

I received a voicemail last night at 10:05pm. This is the message that was left;

“Keep spouting lies about me mother f**ker and I’m going to be on you like you’ve never seen before. You’re a piece of sh*t loser and I’m gonna’ f**king kill you!” 

We looked up the call record on our Vonage system. We did a reverse lookup of the phone number and it came back as Sandra Whalen (I assume this is Bert Whalen’s wife or some other relation).

I have reported this to the police.

[Jay Hinrichs]

Originally posted by @Ryan B.:

As I read the complaint and the letter, the action was taken against Bert personally.  Bert isn't the only person involved with Oceanpointe who holds a real estate license (well, I guess he didn't really have one).  I don't think this shuts them down.  

 Maybe not  but it certainly is not a ringing endorsement of the company LOL... if you just look at the ACTUAL REAL investors that pop on here and have had nightmare scenarios how anyone can sweep this under the rug and think its all groovy  well  

[Charlotte Johnson]

I have invested through Morris invest and work with Oceanpointe. The issues with communication are being resolved and make sense after speaking with one of the office personnel. While I was on the line with her she explained that calls go unanswered because they are on the phone with other clients. I have emailed questions and always get an answer. As far as people being concerned about the properties this is mind blowing to me when we as the investors have a responsibility to do our due diligence in investigating and educating ourselves on our purchases. I very knowingly purchased a C/D class property with the expectation that this is way different than purchasing an A or B class property. The tenant base isn’t different the amount of money spent on rehab and the result are different. I won’t go as far as to say that I haven’t had any problems with Oceanpointe, but they have rectified every situation that has arisen to my satisfaction. For everyone to jump on one persons bandwagon without doing their own homework is asinine.

[Todd Burton]

Originally posted by @Charlotte Johnson:

I have invested through Morris invest and work with Oceanpointe. The issues with communication are being resolved and make sense after speaking with one of the office personnel. While I was on the line with her she explained that calls go unanswered because they are on the phone with other clients. I have emailed questions and always get an answer. As far as people being concerned about the properties this is mind blowing to me when we as the investors have a responsibility to do our due diligence in investigating and educating ourselves on our purchases. I very knowingly purchased a C/D class property with the expectation that this is way different than purchasing an A or B class property. The tenant base isn’t different the amount of money spent on rehab and the result are different. I won’t go as far as to say that I haven’t had any problems with Oceanpointe, but they have rectified every situation that has arisen to my satisfaction. For everyone to jump on one persons bandwagon without doing their own homework is asinine.

 It's not anyone's "bandwagon", it's a letter from the Office of the Indiana Attorney General stating that Oceanpointe's license has been permanently revoked. You can speculate about opinions but this is fact.

[Ryan B.]

Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:

Originally posted by @Ryan B.:

As I read the complaint and the letter, the action was taken against Bert personally.  Bert isn't the only person involved with Oceanpointe who holds a real estate license (well, I guess he didn't really have one).  I don't think this shuts them down.  

 Maybe not  but it certainly is not a ringing endorsement of the company LOL... if you just look at the ACTUAL REAL investors that pop on here and have had nightmare scenarios how anyone can sweep this under the rug and think its all groovy  well  

 I don't disagree and I wasn't trying to minimize it.  I was just trying to be clear as to what I saw as the actual proceeding and the likelihood of it causing any sort of end to operations of Oceanpointe.  (such that anyone currently using them may expect to be scrambling soon).  But just as it doesn't do anything to endorse them, I think it would also be wrong to say that this is some proof that there is malfeasance coming from Oceanpointe towards investors/property owners.  Rather than the complaint being related to anything relating to treatment of property owners, the complaint seems specifically restricted to matters relating to the license application process and a lack of candor there.  

So, I don't mean to defend or condemn them, I'm just trying to explain what appears to have transpired. 

[Jay Hinrichs]

Originally posted by @Charlotte Johnson:

I have invested through Morris invest and work with Oceanpointe. The issues with communication are being resolved and make sense after speaking with one of the office personnel. While I was on the line with her she explained that calls go unanswered because they are on the phone with other clients. I have emailed questions and always get an answer. As far as people being concerned about the properties this is mind blowing to me when we as the investors have a responsibility to do our due diligence in investigating and educating ourselves on our purchases. I very knowingly purchased a C/D class property with the expectation that this is way different than purchasing an A or B class property. The tenant base isn’t different the amount of money spent on rehab and the result are different. I won’t go as far as to say that I haven’t had any problems with Oceanpointe, but they have rectified every situation that has arisen to my satisfaction. For everyone to jump on one persons bandwagon without doing their own homework is asinine.

 Charlotte  the issue comes from Morris marketing materials.. he states these are not C D class that the tenant base is easier to manage than A class  .. that lots of doctors live in the homes etc etc.

then you have people buy them rehab not done.. scope of work not even close to what would be needed to fix these low end homes.. etc etc..

And even you state I bought a morris home when really its not he is just a marketer who hooked up with a company that is selling low end rentals.. :) 

but hey you are right its up to the buyer.. unfortunately with the sales tactic Morris used.. IE cant talk to you for 3 months because we are so busy.. you pick a property call back 2 hours later and OH that's sold.. sorry.. so you pick the next thing that comes up..   and no you can't come look at them.. its just bunc really and well going to be a lot of people lose a lot of money not knowing what they did not know .

[Charlotte Johnson]

It’s all about doing your homework. If you see the picture of the house then search an address you can easily tell they aren’t A class properties. Kind of like asking a car salesman for accident info when he tells you a car is perfect. It’s your money invest wisely, I know the home I purchased was owned by ocean pointe not Morris invest this is obvious when you look up the property cards on addresses, but Morris invest was my avenue to purchase the home. Opinions are opinions but our choices are also our choices. A simple google search reveals neighborhood info or you can buy the house spur of moment with no insight and Be upset with the sales person for your lack of research.

[Charlotte Johnson]

Overall, we are pleased with our purchase. There have been a few minor Bumps along the way which we expected when we began investing, but we have been pleased with our return and working with the Morris invest and Oceanpointe teams. I’m glad to see our leap into investing is paying off. 

[Jay Hinrichs]

Originally posted by @Charlotte Johnson:

Overall, we are pleased with our purchase. There have been a few minor Bumps along the way which we expected when we began investing, but we have been pleased with our return and working with the Morris invest and Oceanpointe teams. I’m glad to see our leap into investing is paying off. 

 now I know what others meant when they would say hey look at this person there first post is to talk about a how great a company is that is having issues on BP .. and here it is.. your profile is not complete not picture no nothing. so what comes to mind of course is SCHILL