Direct mail: lists and mailing to trusts?

[Dave Boswell]

Hi, I just recently joined bigger pockets. Man, this site is amazing .. wish I would have discovered it years ago. I have been house flipping for several years now in the Sacramento area. Mainly we have been doing short sales, and finding deals through the MLS and other business connections. Obviously the deals are drying up on the MLS these days so I've finally started my direct mail campaign and I have several questions.

First, my main list is high equity, absentee owners in my area. I would like to also get a list for vacant/substandard homes and recent landlords who went through evictions, but I'm finding these lists a lil tougher to get a hold of. The county says they don't have em. Any recommendation on how to get my hands on these lists for a reasonable price?

Second, what is the verdict on mailing to trusts? Is it worth sending a letter to family trusts, revoc, or irrevoc trusts?

[Antonio Coleman]

Yo @Dave Boswell Direct mail is an powerful piece of platform that I think is under used. I say one of the best ways to do direct mail is by building your own list from doing online and offline marketing. Get that website up and ruling and start capturing leads. 

[Brian G.]

@Dave Boswell welcome to the site. If you are a flipper then you are ahead of many. Most of the vacant homes lists will be produced once you start your direct mail campaign (returned mail). Depending on competition this could be your and only your list (love the exclusivity). Make sure to have a grandfather list based on desired high equity. This way you know the returned mail is from a qualified property. Regarding evictions, you can take your absentee owners and start looking up their names at the online court records. Tedious but once again this is almost exclusive (hard is easy and easy is hard). Then Trusts, well here is tough to pinpoint how to reach trustees vs. beneficiaries and the group is (in my opinion) more sophisticated/difficult to deal with. Some could be your own competition (investors) trying to circumvent due-on sale clauses from creditors (a more complicated topic). I am better employing my marketing dollars somewhere else... As a side note, you should never stop looking at the MLS, many investors are placing propeties there at discount levels that could make you money. If no linked yet make sure your realtor sets you up with a live feed directly to your inbox. Wake up early, run your number, walk-through by 8am and place your offer by 9am. All the best and "work-hard-play-hard"...

[Matt Morgan]

list source.com is also a great way to customize what you want to see. Good luck @Dave Boswell

[Dave Boswell]

thank you everyone for the response and feedback

@Brian G.thanks for answering my questions it definitely gave me clarity and direction.

[Richard Anthony]

I definitely recommend mailing to family trusts. I have bought three homes in the last year by direct mail to trusts and have one in escrow currently just waiting for all the paperwork to get lined up correctly. The potential deal is worth the price of a stamp in my opinion.

[Brian G.]

@Richard Anthony sounds like trusts are taking traction for you. In my area these days  (more often than not) a loan is in place and equity is almost non-existent. During your due diligence, what are the factors in your opinion that are causing for these properties to be placed in a trust? How does that looks like (root cause)? You might not know the answer but in your opinion, is it mainly due to family/estate planning? Are the beneficiaries usually aligned and in agreement with the trustees? Or are there differences between them as to how to dispose the real estate? Is this (more often than not) a roadblock for you, or not? This is why I love biggerpockets, there is always a place for strategies to work. Maybe your insight could also assist @Dave Boswell. I know there are several types of trusts, I just wanted to get you general overview on it. Regards,

[Richard Anthony]

@Brian G. Everything I mail to I cross reference to the property records to see when the property was purchased and for how much compared to what I think the home is worth today. If I think there may be equity then I will market to them. For instance one house I bought was in a revocable living trust that the husband and wife vested the property in 15 years ago, it was a rental property. The husband since passed away and the tenant moved out. I think it was the same tenant after 15 years and she left it quite a mess. The wife didn't want to deal with it and basically gave it away. 

Another instance the parents left the property in trust to the children with one executor, they all had to discuss the price I offered and agreed to sell.

The trust will allow the property to pass to the heirs without going through probate, at least in my experiences, which makes it a beneficial tool. I have my personal residence in a trust. 

[Rick H.]

If the question is to include trust-owned property in your campaigns, I'd say yes.

I think a better question has more to do with the triggers that people who have done some estate planning respond to. 

I'm not the big fan of mailing to absentee owners without either a massive multi-media campaign which hit pain-specific triggers with matching USP's or a data list overlay such as default, tax default, deceased, etc. 

Had lunch today with a friend who mails large 20K piece drops and knows how to measure his responses and ROI. Impressive logic.

Another approach that I prefer is to segment lists into sub-lists and nano-niches and spend more, not less, in reaching exactly the ideal prospect with the perfect message arriving at the right time after a sequence of touches has conditioned them to be predisposed to buy. 

Sound far fetched? Not when well planned and executed.

[Chuck W.]

I think driving neighborhoods looking for distressed properties and mailing the owner can be good. And MLS has been a good source for me as well.

[Kim Stofan]

Thanks for this thread.  I had a question about mailing to a property that is titled in a trust...

I found a vacant home next door to my friend's house.  He told me that the owner had past away recently.  I found that the property is in owned in a trust.  Should I mail to the actual property address, the address of the trust, or both?    Thanks ahead of time!

[Benjamin Cowles]

Originally posted by @Kim Stofan:

Thanks for this thread.  I had a question about mailing to a property that is titled in a trust...

I found a vacant home next door to my friend's house.  He told me that the owner had past away recently.  I found that the property is in owned in a trust.  Should I mail to the actual property address, the address of the trust, or both?    Thanks ahead of time!

 I'm curious about this too. I've been mailing to trusts myself to the subject property not considering no one lives there but someone has to pick up the mail at some point right? Otherwise you're suggesting going a step further and tracking down the members of the trust to mail to them directly. I'd like to see what others do

[Michael Giamanco]

Was just driving for dollars this weekend and 6 of the 9 properties I wrote down are in a trust. This is my list and I'm gonna mail it! lol It's small but worth a shot.

[Dave Ato]

Is anyone still having success with direct mail marketing to trust.

[Will Stahl]

Does anyone use a specific type of letter when mailing to trusts?

[David Ato]

yellow letter

[Michael Quarles]

I'm using the naked yellow letter. I am loving the price point and ROI.

[David Ato]

Do you mail to absentee owners or trusts. I mail alot to tax sale foreclosure?