Florida Real Estate Q&A Discussion Forum
Market News & Data
General Info
Real Estate Strategies
Landlording & Rental Properties
Real Estate Professionals
Financial, Tax, & Legal
Real Estate Classifieds
Reviews & Feedback
Updated over 6 years ago, 06/11/2018
NEGOTIATED SALES PRICE $754,498...and $98? Really?
Why would the price have not been negotiated up $2.00 to $754,500 or down $98.00 to $754,400, a round number?
Do you know how much chaos and extra time and effort throughout the loan process correcting the sales price and possible delays such a number can cause on the Mortgage side?
To all Investors: do yourselves and everyone on the mortgage as well as on the title side a huge favor and simply round your sales price up or down to the nearest round 100 number.
HOLY ****! How did this become a 4 page thread. Steve, I'm sorry man but while I get what you are saying ultimately your saying you have people that can't do their frigging job of paying some attention to detail and doing math. With calculators and computers, this should be a no brainer. Not to mention all the other areas where you are getting "uneven" numbers. How about this, I apply for a mortgage to you and I just round my income up from 85k to an even 100k?
I honestly think your making a mountain out of a mole hill. The lenders will simply input the number that is listed on the sales agreement. Whether it’s a zero, or an 8, they still need to make the key stroke. So I really don’t see any issue with it. It might seem easier for you to round it up, but they still enter all the numbers into the system, zero or not, this not saving any time or mistakes.
Again...ALL reply posts from NON Mortgage Industry people.
It's amazing how so many NON Mortgage Industry people are responding, who you could never convey to them about the chaos that goes on behind the scenes with so many idiots that these banks and lenders hire to help out with an overwhelming amount of loan applications coming in!
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
Why would the price have not been negotiated up $2.00 to $754,500 or down $98.00 to $754,400, a round number?
Do you know how much chaos and extra time and effort throughout the loan process correcting the sales price and possible delays such a number can cause on the Mortgage side?
To all Investors: do yourselves and everyone on the mortgage as well as on the title side a huge favor and simply round your sales price up or down to the nearest round 100 number.
Is this post for real?
Respectfully, does a one legged duck swim in a circle?
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
Respectfully, does a one legged duck swim in a circle?
Less duck watching could allow for more data entry...
Steve McRory Alright I’ll bite on this one.
I’ll answer as an engineer. I have one purpose as an engineer. Boil down design requirements to raw numbers I put on a drawing. I literally get paid to do only that every day (even if they are sometimes odd numbers).
As a loan officer/broker you offer one service make a loan to a person in an amount at or under what they are qualified for. If your CUSTOMER wants a loan for an odd amount it is your service to ensure it goes smoothly. That is what you get paid to do.
Originally posted by @Jonathan Pflueger:
Maybe Chris Mason or Joe Stretch (both lenders the CA Bay Area) wouldn't mind commenting here. I would be interested in hearing their opinions.
I too can see the value in making nice rounded offers - not sure if that value outweighs my own set of negotiating tactics - but it is something to consider. I feel that if I have the right team in place (this means a competent lender/broker) this shouldn't be a problem 99% of the time.
@Account Closed could work on his delivery. This stuff is only personal if we make it personal.
My non-round $0.02... I've never had issues with sales prices like $754,498. I'd expect the appraisal to come in at $755k. Loan amount will be rounded down to the nearest dollar by our software, so @ 80% LTV it would be $603,598, not $603,598.40. Most borrowers wouldn't even notice that $0.40 of additional down payment.
Only time I've had issues with non-round sales prices is when it's not rounded to the dollar. A few months back we had one that was $500,000.25 (or whatever it was, there was a quarter on the end). The assigned appraiser's software didn't support pennies, so the appraisal had the wrong sales price on it, which in turn meant the purchase price on the appraisal couldn't be made to line up with our software, which in turn (& absurdly) raised an automated fraud flag that had to be manually escalated as an "exception" bla bla bla. It was 3 or 4 days of internal pointless BS; we were otherwise ahead of schedule so it closed on time with zero days to spare (I like to be a little early when possible). The buyer/seller had ego involved, so the $0.25 couldn't be made to go away. Honestly I'd much rather have simply handed both parties a quarter and moved-on-dot-com than waste those business days and person-hours, but lenders handing out money outside of escrow to make deals happen (or happen faster/smoother) is illegal.
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
Again...ALL reply posts from NON Mortgage Industry people.
It's amazing how so many NON Mortgage Industry people are responding, who you could never convey to them about the chaos that goes on behind the scenes with so many idiots that these banks and lenders hire to help out with an overwhelming amount of loan applications coming in!
Your original statement claims that these uneven numbers create problems that delay closings. Although I am not in the mortgage industry, I have closed on five mortgages since Dodd Frank. All those loans had uneven purchase prices. As I pointed out earlier, the taxes and insurance are also uneven numbers. All those numbers are being typed in by my mortgage broker and he is doing it accurately. Isn't all that submitted electronically to the underwriter or are you trying to tell me someone is retyping all that information in?
Your idea that silence of other mortgage brokers is agreement is illogical. Everyone I meet on BP is very open and willing to share information. I don't believe mortgage brokers would privately message you, thanking you, instead of just chiming in with their honest opinion. Another explanation of why mortgage brokers are silent is maybe they are busy processing loans.
I don't doubt that errors occur regularly, but it is YOUR job to check everything and make sure it is right BEFORE closing. Typos will occur regardless of if the purchase price ends in zero. They are typing in lots of other uneven numbers too. There is no logic in your claims which is why everyone is calling BS.
On a final note, you seriously wrote a letter to Obama complaining about this? You know that letter got thrown in the trash and it was a total waste of your time. Who even writes letters anymore...
Wow...hot topic! So, I'm a new poster here, but have worked in the mortgage industry for the past 18 years, as well as pursued my own RE investments (good and bad)... to previous points in the thread, I've always been fond of the thought that, after 2008, "Closing loans is a team sport"...it takes many hands to make a deal work in and around the actual loan. On the flip side, each new hand that touches the deal or the loan, increases the likelihood of a mistake. That said, most mistakes are fixable, but sometimes add a few days to the closing. Not deal breakers.
I'm currently an active retail mortgage originator, amongst a couple other things, but Its been my experience that working as a wholesale account executive from 2000 until 2016 and being on the backside of literally thousands of loan closings since the inception of the newest regulations that I can recall only one instance of a set back caused by cents on a transaction, but that was early on in the Dodd/Frank era and was the result of software, that was subsequently fixed by an addition 3 day waiting period, because that was the safest play for the lenders ***.
The take away here, again just in my opinion, is on the front side of the transaction, write the offer at whatever it takes to get the contract done, then hand it off to your favorite lender...they'll figure it out. :)
Originally posted by @Joe Stretch:
Wow...hot topic! So, I'm a new poster here, but have worked in the mortgage industry for the past 18 years, as well as pursued my own RE investments (good and bad)... to previous points in the thread, I've always been fond of the thought that, after 2008, "Closing loans is a team sport"...it takes many hands to make a deal work in and around the actual loan. On the flip side, each new hand that touches the deal or the loan, increases the likelihood of a mistake. That said, most mistakes are fixable, but sometimes add a few days to the closing. Not deal breakers.
I'm currently an active retail mortgage originator, amongst a couple other things, but Its been my experience that working as a wholesale account executive from 2000 until 2016 and being on the backside of literally thousands of loan closings since the inception of the newest regulations that I can recall only one instance of a set back caused by cents on a transaction, but that was early on in the Dodd/Frank era and was the result of software, that was subsequently fixed by an addition 3 day waiting period, because that was the safest play for the lenders ***.
The take away here, again just in my opinion, is on the front side of the transaction, write the offer at whatever it takes to get the contract done, then hand it off to your favorite lender...they'll figure it out. :)
Agreed on the team effort thing. It's probably one in a thousand that a home purchase is negotiated down to the pennies AND the appraisal order goes to an appraiser using software that doesn't support pennies.
Is it just me or was it how I wrote the original post?
The replies to my discussion are so far off that I'm thinking I may actual be the complete and total idiot.
Here's the post again, how should it have been written?
Dear investors,
It's annoying when you don't round to the nearest 100, please keep in mind my suffering next time you do this.
Originally posted by @Joe Stretch:
write the offer at whatever it takes to get the contract done, then hand it off to your favorite lender...they'll figure it out. :)
4 pages summarized in one beautifully articulate albeit why-did-we-have-to-do-all-this-to-get-here quote.
Okay to pile on as unlike "others" reading / watching, as a Florida Mortgage Broker, I can take it as I'm not thin skinned.
Please inform me, without holding back, where I'm wrong and/or out of line with my thoughts on this topic
Please tell me how I can improve the delivery of knowledge on this topic, so these facts might be more widely accepted.
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
Is it just me or was it how I wrote the original post?
The replies to my discussion are so far off that I'm thinking I may actual be the complete and total idiot.
certainly one of these 2.....
jk jk jk
maybe you're speaking about some nuanced part of lending that no one reading this thread understands or can relate to. Now, I'm an underwriter for a commercial bank, but it's quite different than mortgages.
Based on what you've said though, it SEEMS that this is a LENDER PROBLEM and part of your job. Inconvenient maybe, I don't dispute that, and maybe the suggestion you're making to everyone will truly help all parties, but it doesn't sound that way by the way you're describing it. It just sounds like you're telling every investor they are doing something wrong and no one so far in this thread has come to your aid. Your insistence on having people re-read the post over and over again and you complete lack of discussion other than "I'm right and you're all wrong" has earned you some very deserving ribbing.
maybe try to re-explain? I thought you were just venting but the side-splitting adventure you have committed here today seems otherwise. maybe provide a better example or context so we can come to a middle ground.
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
@Aaron K., offer and acceptance has been around for thousands of years.
But this Post Dodd Frank Act, HVCC, TRID mortgage industry has only been around for about 10yrs. and is why so many mortgage industry people bailed out and became realtors. Many, with having a Mortgage industry background, have had an unfair advantage.
Discussions on topics like this are very beneficial for BP Investors to follow as it can bring light to the mindset of many who still apply their outdated and antiquated strategies.
I'll bet everyone reading this topic will for now on (when possible) will round up or down though!
No we will not. As many others have said I will find a lender who is mentally capable of handling my offer of an oddball number if thats how it works out.
Dad gummit @Alexander Felice from Las Vegas, will you please let me get a word in edgewise?
Listen to me...
Now I forgot what I was going to say
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
Again, NO Mortgage industry people (who are under Dodd Frank Act, and private lenders loaning on non TRID , investment properties no included) are responding.
Why, because they ALL know I'm right, they just want to avoid the backlash posting it.
And, also likely because they are all working right now too.
What in the world are you smoking?
@Derrick E., like Forrest Gump said, I am not a smart man.
What was the other...Stupid is as stupid does? That would be me!
So from here on... out, everyone please always call me and refer to me as... Forrest Gump.
But getting back to the discussion, why so much "resistance" to such a simple action?
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
@Derrick E., like Forrest Gump said, I am not a smart man.
What was the other...Stupid is as stupid does? That would be me!
So from here on... out, everyone please always call me and refer to me as... Forrest Gump.
But getting back to the discussion, why so much "resistance" to such a simple action?
the "simple" action solves a problem that the buyer never sees; plus it requires additional work for a gain of what exactly?
If I get a bid accepted at whatever the price is I'm going to do as little as possible to open that back up for negotiations. Now, if it comes down to credit back for something.... maybe we round it to the nearest 100 or whatever, but that's only because there's another issue affecting price.
Plus the paperwork to change the price..... waste of time for everyone.
@Account Closed Not sure why I'm saying this as it's already been said over and over again again.. You're basically telling investors to adjust their pricing strategy so you (the lender) are less likely to make a mistake. It's like the cashier at Burger King getting mad because someone wanted no onions on their burger, which just increased the likelihood the order will be wrong because it's not "standard." An "oddball" offer is more likely to be accepted. Therefore, by making it "non-oddball" you are less likely to get an offer accepted and therefore close a deal. Let's say, hypothetically, that one should actually have to worry about this... a delayed deal is better than no deal.
This is the most hilarious 5 page thread I have ever read. I'd like to put in my $.02 worth but Id have to round up and my opinion isnt actually worth $1.00!!