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Has anyone used WealthAbility?
Hi Everyone, I wanted to see if anyone has used WealthAbility by Tom Wheelwright. The amount they charge to analyze your information and give you a plan is pretty steep, so I wanted to see if anyone has used them and how happy you are with their services. Thanks in advance for any input.
@Donovan Feist was this agent a CPA or just a salesman? Seems odd they would custom quote you without really getting to know your situation in depth. There are many great tax planners out there and I'd suggest getting to know the actual people that will be working on your situation first and then evaluating what type of ROI you'll achieve on the investment in them
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CPA
Full disclosure I'm the salesperson from WealthAbility. If anyone has any questions about how we price our services feel free to reach out any time! We aim to be as transparent as possible. Also amen to @Greg O'Brien's comment about it being about ROI :-)
Hello All, I am new to the BP website. I have watched a lot of videos and listened to podcasts. I have also read a lot of Robert Kiyosaki's, Garrett Sutton's and @Tom Wheelwright books. My business partner and I have had a few calls with Joseph Sorge at WealthAbility. After almost a month of deliberation and discussion we have decided to enroll in the WealthAbility program.
Several people have posted different prices for different services provided. Not everyone will order the same cheeseburger, or even a burger at all. That's why most businesses offer different pricing structures. I cannot speak intelligently on all services and pricing that is offered at WealthAbility. But I can speak about what we have signed up for.
Our Initial Setup fee is $14,500. There are 2 of us signing up at the same time. So we are getting a discount off of that number. Included in that is 8 sessions with our WA team to develop both a proactive tax strategy and a wealth strategy. (This is where I see the most value.) Additionally, there will be quarterly meeting with our WA team that will run about $200 each. For each of our tax returns we will be charged $1,500 for business and $1,000 for personal. This will be a slight increase for what we are currently paying at our local CPA's office. I know that WA offers general bookkeeping services as well.
A quick note about our businesses. We own and operate a corporate aircraft management company. If someone or a business owns a corporate aircraft like a King Air or a LearJet, we manage the asset, conduct maintenance, provide pilot services and concierge services. I look at the WA model much like I view our model. Most people that buy a corporate aircraft without help, make very bad and mostly uneducated decisions. Kind of like what most people do with their taxes. And just like taxes, there is a wealth of information out there on the internet about aircraft. But who's to say that it's right or proper information? Just because one aircraft is right for one company, doesn't make it the right fit for another. All of my clients that came to me after they purchased an aircraft; I have spent years and tens of thousands of dollars trying to correct their mistakes in purchasing. Most of it in hidden maintenance issues. All of my clients that came to me before hand and had me involved in the purchase of their aircraft have all avoided those mistakes. I take credit for this because I am an aviation professional. What I am not is a tax professional.
I view the WA team and structure much like my own business. I have made many RE investing mistakes over the years. And each of the CPA's that I have had have all said that I should have set things up differently. My goal with the WA team is to avoid making the same mistakes that I have made in the past. And to have someone guide me through the process of setting up my RE purchases correctly from the start. All of my tax preparation in the past has all been reactionary and not proactive.
I know this has been lengthy and wordy. But I wanted to give my view point and reasoning as to why I see the value in the cost, and hopefully the ROI, in the WA team. Literally, we just signed up today. That said, I plan to post updates, good or bad, about my experience.
First of all, thank you and I’m honored that you have chosen to use the WealthAbility system and work with our CPAs. As you mentioned, the key to an effective tax strategy is to be proactive, and congratulations on getting on the path. Welcome aboard the team! They will take great care of you, I’ll look forward to hearing you on tonight’s WealthAbility Live call. Best – Tom.
Originally posted by @Shan Vincent:
I just got off the phone with Wealthability. I was not happy with the conversation. I am not interested in paying 15k for their services. I am looking for a CPA that owns rental properties and understands taxes and being a real estate professional vs. an agent and which way to file the taxes. If anyone has any recommendations please send them my way.
@Shan Vincent Following up on this thread as I am in the hunt for a CPA and can not afford Wealthability right now. Who did you end up going with, any recommendations? Thanks.
Hi Damon! I found a great CPA firm. The guys name is Kevin Gibb. He does taxes for friends of our that own hundreds of rentals. Here’s his number. (805) 300-2518
Thanks @Shan Vincent! Will reach out to see if he has room for another client. Much appreciated
Interesting thread. I just got a quote from Wealthability as, like most of you, I am a big tom fan and listen and read all his stuff. I don't know how some of you were quoted $15,000 to $20,000 for pretty simple stuff. I have four S-Corps (non real estate related) and two LLCs (one real estate and one not) and 13 houses, $350,000 in rent rolls, RE Pro status, doing a cost seg, etc and my quote was $11,750.
I love the idea of receiving a visual roadmap of my taxes and planning and where we want to go, I just don't know if I can justify it being worth almost $12,000. I still have to pay for the actual products to be established after that. I am currently getting quotes from a couple of local CPAs (based on the link shared here!) and from The RE CPA (who I also listen to and read) and another CPA I have found through the podcast circuit.
Hey guys,
I also just had a call with Joseph Sorge. I was quoted ~15k for the initial sign-up. I'm planning on moving forward for now since I had quite the tax bill in 2020 and 2021.
I read Tom's book and I'm familiar with the specific strategies I'd like to go after; however, I'm lacking in having the right 'team' actually implement these strategies. In addition, I'm sure many of these strategies involve quite a bit of nuance and I could definitely use some help executing.
I'm hopeful that Wealthability will be able to help me reduce my taxes while building a rental real estate portfolio. I'll update you guys on how the service is as the months and years progress.
-- Paul
@Tom Wheelwright I have been in contact with Joseph Sorge and I just asked about the do it yourself that people on here have mentioned is only $2k and he is trying to me it is $6k for me. If you are not doing anything but giving me access to this library why am I being charged 3 times the amount of everyone else. I understand what you said about the other stuff being based on how much work you are going to have to do. But on a do it yourself the price should be set.
I am feeling less and less comfortable giving this company a penny of yours.
My tax lady charges $250 for my business return each year. She is very good. I think I will stick with her.
@Jim Duncan
I can certainly have my team follow up with you to clarify. Sorry for any confusion.
@Tom Wheelwright and right after you post this I get this email from your company. After asking why he is charging me $6k for something everyone else in this group is saying is only $2k. Sounds to me as he is making up pricing based on income and that is why you ask for taxes.
Hi Jim,
The program that you are talking about is purely just information on how you can do it yourself.
The price I quoted you was for working with our CPA with the educational information included.
At this point, I don’t think you would be a good fit for our team and wish you the best of luck in your future endeavors.
Joseph Sorge
Client Relations Manager
Interesting to come across this thread. I went through the process with wealthability and paid about $50k. I'll admit I had to be patient but the CPA I'm working with did end up saving me way more than what I paid and was really fun to work with someone that geeked out over taxes and planning. We converted a big sale that saved almost seven figures in taxes, I wanted to buy them a Caribbean cruise after that one and felt like it was still worth the money it was very much a dollars and cents thing. Also the program leans heavily on educating yourself on taxes and accounting which I thought was valuable and helped me with some other businesses, thinking about how to set them up differently and work them into my life plan a bit more appropriately.
The filing fees are a bit on the high end I might not recommend them if you don't need a lot of attention to detail or otherwise wouldn't be saving a lot in taxes by investing in a more experienced CPA.
There are a few different threads about whether or not WealthAbility is "worth it" or people's experience with them and the process. Unfortunately most of it has a fairly negative tone. I read every comment and searched the internet for any other threads, so I felt comfortable with my decision to become a customer or not. Unfortunately, I didn't get very far with them. We did the same "sales calls" as all of you have explained. We were quoted $17,250. As most of you, we were a bit shell shocked by the price. But then the "SILENCE" began from them. I got two emails almost an hour after our phone call. One welcome email that had the contract to be signed and another providing a link to pay with your credit card. Naturally, I read through the contract and I couldn't find the "guarantee" that my sales rep kept telling me about. Basically he kept telling me that they provide a "Guarantee" that within the first tax year, they will get my 17k back, or they will refund my money. But I couldn't find that in the contract. So I naturally emailed them back to ask them about it and asked a couple other questions as well. NOTHING...just like most of you here...It was SILENT. it was super easy to get a hold of them before (during the sale), but now I've emailed 3 times and after almost two weeks NOTHING. I take that back, I just got a reminder that I haven't signed the contract (again "THE SALE").
I just don't know how Tom and his teams think that this is a good business model. Ask the person to pay a bunch of money upfront (in my case $17,250) and in return, we'll make it extremely hard for you to have access to your advisors and getting your questions answered in a timely manner.
Very disappointed.
I apologize for that experience Dan, our team will follow up with you immediately address your questions and point out our No Questions Asked Money Back Guarantee for you.
Glad to hear things went so well and we appreciate your business!
@Tom Wheelwright Hi Tom, I spoke to your team just recently yesterday 9/16/2021. The price they quoted to me just to get a strategy session going is $18,750 for 5 to 7 year tax strategy, which is quite a bit of money to spend without any guarantees that I will actually agree with the strategy presented to me which they stated will take almost 3 to 4 months to prepare. Plus there is an additional $2,500 per year for quarterly strategy meetings, $1,997 for roadmap, and the retainer for personal return is $1,000 and for business return is $1,500, those numbers can climb higher even. Why don't you use a bit different model where your potential clients can pay perhaps $250 (or a bit more if reasonable but no more than $500) for an hour meeting to talk to a real CPA who has been trained by you and determine whether or not they can save me money on taxes such as capital gains or ordinary income or passive income by forming structures that makes sense for using up various deductions and write-offs to the fullest extent to off-set the various sources of income and let them show me how they can eliminate my taxes down to minimal to zero in that quick session, it is like a preview session to what is possible given my actual data. Once they show me the savings and possibilities, I will be excited to use your service and pay the fees as it will make more financial sense for a return on investment. My main issue with the current way your sales team is handling onboarding to Wealthability is that such a large amount of funds are being asked up-front without any hope of a refund if things do not work out and are not up to par. If you or a trained CPA on your team can get on the phone with me for an hour to explain how certain things will be done based on the questions I submitted to your team, it would be an easier decision for me to make to join your program.
@Adam Mazhar Full disclosure: I manage services for WealthAbility and have shared your feedback with Tom. He suggested I share some background on how our system came to be and why we do things the way we do. Hopefully it may prove helpful.
First of all, thank you for reaching out and considering WealthAbility. Tom, and all of us at WealthAbility, have heard your suggestion many times over the years. We’ve found that focusing on specific transactions and questions doesn’t deliver clients the same results that a holistic approach to wealth and tax strategy does. If you’re looking for a referral to a CPA who will prep your tax return and bill you by the hour for tax advice, we’re the first to admit we’re not the best resource.
We start by looking at a prospective client’s current facts, activity, and complexity in combination with an understanding of what they’re looking to achieve. From there we aim to identify the best possible fit with a tax advisor in our network and then get started on a flat fee basis for that process. This is admittedly unusual but we’ve found it really helps both the CPA and the client engage more, and communicate more in the process of designing a comprehensive strategy for both lowering taxes and analyzing all options a client may want to consider.
To your point:
“Wealthability is that such a large amount of funds are being asked up-front without any hope of a refund if things do not work out and are not up to par.”
This is not correct, and I am sorry you had this impression. We offer a no questions asked, 30-day money-back guarantee for this exact reason. We have found this is usually enough time to allow a client to get comfortable with the process and really see our value both short- and long-term. If it’s not for you, there is a risk-free exit strategy. This is a big risk for WealthAbility and the CPA, which we hope counter-balances the commitment a client takes up-front. Also this benefits both parties since the CPA really shouldn’t have interest in continuing with a client to whom they can’t provide value anyway.
I also apologize if there was confusion on pricing; it sounds like you had a lot of numbers thrown at you. We have a single, flat fee that covers the creation of your entire Wealth and Tax strategy plus the completion of your first year’s tax return. Keep in mind each person’s tax situation is unique, and fees after a strategy is created are dependent upon each client’s specific needs. Again, we have found the 30 day guarantee can help alleviate this fear since it gives the team time to understand those variables and communicate them to the client.
If you have any additional questions, please contact me directly. I’d be happy to meet with you at your convenience to explain pricing further.
Thanks Adam!
@Brad L Doran Hi Brad, thanks for your response and please say thanks to Tom for me to help clarify some of the points you covered in your post. I will DM you on bigger pockets to discuss a few items, thanks!
@Rich Hupper my understanding is that once you make the leap to commercial real estate. E.g Multifamily greater than 4, is when banks no longer look for personal guarantee's. I have read that acquiring bank loans in some ways actually gets easier as the bank cares about the NOI, CAP rate etc as the basis for the loan and not the individual behind the company seeking the loan. I have no experience yet with this. It (large multifamily) is however on my roadmap to start doing soon...
I am enjoying the conversation thread however all comments are 8 plus months old.
I was presented a similar to Russel Maxey in the above thread. However I received a $31k proposal. I have several corporations, commercial and residential properties. My challenge in addition to the upfront cost is that I help entrepreneurs get started then roll their companies out to operate and help them build wealth strategies. If I had 3 of my successful entrepreneurs in the program for the price quoted I would just move forward.
Also I have yet to hear anyone say I did this 2 years ago and it was the best investment I ever made.
@Lawrence McNutt - Hi Lawrence we'd be happy to provide a reference and some testimonials, we'll reach out on that. You're correct the replies and feedback on here are somewhat aged for the most part. As always thank you for the consideration we're always appreciative. Have a happy holiday!
Hello Brad, please refer them. I am seeing a much lower cost for the people posting here, than what I am being proposed.
@Lawrence McNutt - We'll have a representative reach out. Thanks!