Best State/City for Section 8

[MARK S KING]

Hello, any input on the best market for section 8? Looking for a way to analyze the highest allowance from Sec8 vs the lowest priced homes, wondering where you can get the most bang for your buck. I have heard the target is at least 400-500 per month net positive cash flow based on 20% down. Where are you seeing opportunities? Thank you!

[Alyssa Wright]

Hello Mark, 

I'm a real estate agent in Pennsylvania, specifically concentrating on the Western Pennslyvania market. I've been doing a lot of work with Section 8 housing recently as the Property Management Company I work under has been trying to turn more towards to Section 8 approved housing than standard rentals. The amount of people looking for Section 8 in my area right now is insane! In my experience, if you have a property accepting Section 8 in this area, you can expect to have a renter within the week; granted you market it correctly. 

I would be happy to provide some more information on my and the other agent's I work with experience with Section 8 in the Western Pennsylvania market if you'd like, but overall I highly recommend considering turning your eye to the Pittsburgh/Allegheny County market right now! 

[Bob Stevens]

Quote from @MARK S KING:

Hello, any input on the best market for section 8? Looking for a way to analyze the highest allowance from Sec8 vs the lowest priced homes, wondering where you can get the most bang for your buck. I have heard the target is at least 400-500 per month net positive cash flow based on 20% down. Where are you seeing opportunities? Thank you!

 So, it's been about a year how many did you get and where ? 

[Travis Biziorek]

Quote from @Samson Hall:

Quote from @James Wise:

Quote from @MARK S KING:

Hello, any input on the best market for section 8? Looking for a way to analyze the highest allowance from Sec8 vs the lowest priced homes, wondering where you can get the most bang for your buck. I have heard the target is at least 400-500 per month net positive cash flow based on 20% down. Where are you seeing opportunities? Thank you!

 Saw Cleveland was mentioned as a Section 8 destination for you. I've been killing it with Section 8 deals in Cleveland for over a decade. Some other areas in Ohio you may want to look into for Section 8 deals are Akron, Canton, Youngstown and Toledo. All of those markets have been good to me as well.

 I’m looking to get into section 8 in Ohio as well, do you think you could provide some numbers on one of your properties. CocRoi, Cashflow, and dscr would all be helpful as well as expenses

 Hey Samson, I have several S8 properties in Detroit and I'm extremely open with my numbers and performance of those over the years.

Happy to share if you're interested (or anyone else).

[Samson Hall]

Quote from @Travis Biziorek:

Quote from @Samson Hall:

Quote from @James Wise:

Quote from @MARK S KING:

Hello, any input on the best market for section 8? Looking for a way to analyze the highest allowance from Sec8 vs the lowest priced homes, wondering where you can get the most bang for your buck. I have heard the target is at least 400-500 per month net positive cash flow based on 20% down. Where are you seeing opportunities? Thank you!

 Saw Cleveland was mentioned as a Section 8 destination for you. I've been killing it with Section 8 deals in Cleveland for over a decade. Some other areas in Ohio you may want to look into for Section 8 deals are Akron, Canton, Youngstown and Toledo. All of those markets have been good to me as well.

 I’m looking to get into section 8 in Ohio as well, do you think you could provide some numbers on one of your properties. CocRoi, Cashflow, and dscr would all be helpful as well as expenses

 Hey Samson, I have several S8 properties in Detroit and I'm extremely open with my numbers and performance of those over the years.

Happy to share if you're interested (or anyone else).

That would be extremely helpful! If I may ask do you manage your properties yourself or do you have a PM

[James Wise]

Quote from @Samson Hall:

Quote from @James Wise:

Quote from @MARK S KING:

Hello, any input on the best market for section 8? Looking for a way to analyze the highest allowance from Sec8 vs the lowest priced homes, wondering where you can get the most bang for your buck. I have heard the target is at least 400-500 per month net positive cash flow based on 20% down. Where are you seeing opportunities? Thank you!

 Saw Cleveland was mentioned as a Section 8 destination for you. I've been killing it with Section 8 deals in Cleveland for over a decade. Some other areas in Ohio you may want to look into for Section 8 deals are Akron, Canton, Youngstown and Toledo. All of those markets have been good to me as well.

 I’m looking to get into section 8 in Ohio as well, do you think you could provide some numbers on one of your properties. CocRoi, Cashflow, and dscr would all be helpful as well as expenses

 I do that on my show everyday.

[Samson Hall]

Quote from @James Wise:

Quote from @Samson Hall:

Quote from @James Wise:

Quote from @MARK S KING:

Hello, any input on the best market for section 8? Looking for a way to analyze the highest allowance from Sec8 vs the lowest priced homes, wondering where you can get the most bang for your buck. I have heard the target is at least 400-500 per month net positive cash flow based on 20% down. Where are you seeing opportunities? Thank you!

 Saw Cleveland was mentioned as a Section 8 destination for you. I've been killing it with Section 8 deals in Cleveland for over a decade. Some other areas in Ohio you may want to look into for Section 8 deals are Akron, Canton, Youngstown and Toledo. All of those markets have been good to me as well.

 I’m looking to get into section 8 in Ohio as well, do you think you could provide some numbers on one of your properties. CocRoi, Cashflow, and dscr would all be helpful as well as expenses

 I do that on my show everyday.

Subscribing rn, lol.

[Travis Biziorek]

Quote from @Samson Hall:

Quote from @Travis Biziorek:

Quote from @Samson Hall:

Quote from @James Wise:

Quote from @MARK S KING:

Hello, any input on the best market for section 8? Looking for a way to analyze the highest allowance from Sec8 vs the lowest priced homes, wondering where you can get the most bang for your buck. I have heard the target is at least 400-500 per month net positive cash flow based on 20% down. Where are you seeing opportunities? Thank you!

 Saw Cleveland was mentioned as a Section 8 destination for you. I've been killing it with Section 8 deals in Cleveland for over a decade. Some other areas in Ohio you may want to look into for Section 8 deals are Akron, Canton, Youngstown and Toledo. All of those markets have been good to me as well.

 I’m looking to get into section 8 in Ohio as well, do you think you could provide some numbers on one of your properties. CocRoi, Cashflow, and dscr would all be helpful as well as expenses

 Hey Samson, I have several S8 properties in Detroit and I'm extremely open with my numbers and performance of those over the years.

Happy to share if you're interested (or anyone else).

That would be extremely helpful! If I may ask do you manage your properties yourself or do you have a PM

 A mix of the two. I self-manage some and have our company's internal PM manage some. 

[Brian Jackson]

Just bought a 4plex in Akron, OH for $115,000. It brings in $3300 a month in rent.

[Regina Blake]

Hi, as an Ohio Realtor, I would definitely say Ohio is the place to be for investing in real estate. If anyone have any questions, please contact me. I look forward to speaking with you soon. Thank you!

Regina Blake-Ohio Realtor

[Michael Smythe]

@Samson Hall, @Maria Bolivar, @Gurleen B., @Gavin Horkheimer

People, let's be real - there's no FREE LUNCH with Section 8!

Let's look at some of the info posted here logically:

1) 7,000 approved S8 voucher holders with nowhere to go
Highly unlikely to be true. 
---Probably also includes the S8 wait list for vouchers since who wouldn't want free rent?
---Also, we deal with a LOT of S8 tenants. At least 25% we will NOT rent to because they have a history of causing thousands of dollars of damage to the properties they rent!

2) The lowest purchase price versus highest S8 rental amount
You can buy a house for $20k in Detroit and probably several other Midwest cities.
---You'll have to spend thousands to bring it up to S8 standards to pass their annual inspection.
---They'll be in Class D "ghetto" neighborhoods where it will be difficult to find an S8 voucher holder that wants to live there.
---So, yes the numbers will look great on paper, but reality will be way different!
---Go to @James Wise, Holton-Wise youtube channel to watch numerous episodes of S8 rentals gone bad!

Section 8 can be a great TOOL for an investor if used wisely. 

It is not a solution you can just throw all your money at to get rich quick.

[Tyler Borowy]

Quote from @Dave Brown:

I've found that the payment standards are sometimes quite a bit higher than what I'm seeing as actual rent for an area.  In these scenarios - does affordable housing tend to go with the actual market rent? Or do they allow closer to what is listed in the payment standard rate?  I'm worried about buying my first section 8 investment - and the rent being much lower than what is advertised on the section 8 payment standard.  thanks! 

The market-rate housing is made affordable by having a landlord that accepts Housing Choice Vouchers (aka Section 8) and charges a market rent that is below the payment standard.

Public housing authorities (PHAs) typically set the payment standards based on HUD's fair market rents (FMRs) at the county level of geography. Payment standards are 90% to 110% of FMR unless an exception is granted. A rule change in 2016 requires PHAs in specified metropolitan areas to use small area fair market rents (SAFMRs). Many of the metros discussed in this post, including Detroit, Columbus and Cleveland, will be affected by this change starting in 2025 (link). Therefore, the zip code in which the property is located will determine the payment standard, not the county's FMR.

As Arsen mentioned and using Detroit, this city is "street to street" with regards to quality/condition, so this rule change could affect your asking rent. Keep an eye on the SAFMRs for your target zip code and see if there are nearby comparables to gauge market rents. Your comps and any adjustments to them for size, condition and features should help you set your rent, at least until you have connections to local committees or housing authority contacts that could provide practice-based guidance (sounds like a great tip from @Arsen Atanasovski).

It is also worth noting that PHAs undertake Rent Reasonableness studies (link to PDF), which "ensure that rents charged by owners to Housing Choice Voucher (HCV) program participants are reasonable. The PHA must compare the rent for the voucher unit to rents for similar unassisted units in the marketplace." This is where I think it's important to improve condition and curb appeal, because that condition/upgrade premium could be used as support for an asking rent that is closer to the payment standard if nearby comps are lower quality and have lower rents.

[Elise Bickel Tauber]

I'm an investor and agent in Western PA (Greater Pittsburgh market). I am biased but I think Pittsburgh is one of the best section 8 markets currently.I've been doing section 8 rentals since 2010 as a property manager. It has had its highs and lows in Western PA. For example, a few years back they were really be stingy with approving for top approval rents because landlords were trying to get top rents but their places were barely passing hability standards so they were approving section 8 but at lower rents. More recently they seem to be just trying to get as many section 8 renters into places as possible. 

Section 8 here has a predetermined rent amount (max allowance) for each property depending on if it is a house, apartment, townhouse, etc and what utilities the landlord pays versus the tenant. Depending on the areas you choose you can have fantastic cash flow. What @Alyssa Wright stated is correct. If you have a clean, properly marketed unit you can get an approved section 8 tenant within 7-10 days. It does take about 30 days for section 8 to send out an inspector and approve the unit for move-in but all in all it can be a pretty quick process. They have actually shut down new section 8 applicants for people who want to get on section 8 because there are so many existing renters who are looking for housing and so few landlords that want to do it. Because of this, it isn't uncommon for a section 8 tenant to move into a unit and stay 3, 5, 7 years or longer. 

Hope that helps!

[Oliver Martinez]

Quote from @Arsen Atanasovski:

Detroit hands down!

 Is Detroit section 8 still doing well? I heard they arent paying their landlords. Is this true?

[Oliver Martinez]

Quote from @Brian Jackson:

Just bought a 4plex in Akron, OH for $115,000. It brings in $3300 a month in rent.

 where did you find the listing?

[Oliver Martinez]

Quote from @Travis Biziorek:

Quote from @Samson Hall:

Quote from @James Wise:

Quote from @MARK S KING:

Hello, any input on the best market for section 8? Looking for a way to analyze the highest allowance from Sec8 vs the lowest priced homes, wondering where you can get the most bang for your buck. I have heard the target is at least 400-500 per month net positive cash flow based on 20% down. Where are you seeing opportunities? Thank you!

 Saw Cleveland was mentioned as a Section 8 destination for you. I've been killing it with Section 8 deals in Cleveland for over a decade. Some other areas in Ohio you may want to look into for Section 8 deals are Akron, Canton, Youngstown and Toledo. All of those markets have been good to me as well.

 I’m looking to get into section 8 in Ohio as well, do you think you could provide some numbers on one of your properties. CocRoi, Cashflow, and dscr would all be helpful as well as expenses

 Hey Samson, I have several S8 properties in Detroit and I'm extremely open with my numbers and performance of those over the years.

Happy to share if you're interested (or anyone else).

 Hey Travis, can we set up some time to chat? Text message? I am interested in investing in detroit

[Travis Biziorek]

Quote from @Oliver Martinez:

Quote from @Travis Biziorek:

Quote from @Samson Hall:

Quote from @James Wise:

Quote from @MARK S KING:

Hello, any input on the best market for section 8? Looking for a way to analyze the highest allowance from Sec8 vs the lowest priced homes, wondering where you can get the most bang for your buck. I have heard the target is at least 400-500 per month net positive cash flow based on 20% down. Where are you seeing opportunities? Thank you!

 Saw Cleveland was mentioned as a Section 8 destination for you. I've been killing it with Section 8 deals in Cleveland for over a decade. Some other areas in Ohio you may want to look into for Section 8 deals are Akron, Canton, Youngstown and Toledo. All of those markets have been good to me as well.

 I’m looking to get into section 8 in Ohio as well, do you think you could provide some numbers on one of your properties. CocRoi, Cashflow, and dscr would all be helpful as well as expenses

 Hey Samson, I have several S8 properties in Detroit and I'm extremely open with my numbers and performance of those over the years.

Happy to share if you're interested (or anyone else).

 Hey Travis, can we set up some time to chat? Text message? I am interested in investing in detroit

 Absolutely! I'll shoot you a DM with my info.

[Travis Biziorek]

Quote from @Oliver Martinez:

Quote from @Arsen Atanasovski:

Detroit hands down!

 Is Detroit section 8 still doing well? I heard they arent paying their landlords. Is this true?

 Yes, they are still paying their landlords.

I have several S8 tenants in Detroit. Payments like clockwork every month.

[Michael Smythe]

@Oliver Martinez please define "well"...

Local Housing Commissions are still paying on time for the most part. Once in awhile, some internal person makes a mistake and there is a slight delay.

The bigger problem is screening S8 tenants to get one that pays THEIR part of the rent on time and takes decent care of the property.

We just had eviction court today with a tenant not paying their rent portion AND deliberately causing damages, so their home failed the S8 inspection. Fortunately for us, we require our ServiceTechs to video their repairs, which we were able to show in court. 

[Bob Stevens]

Quote from @Michael Smythe:

@Oliver Martinez please define "well"...

Local Housing Commissions are still paying on time for the most part. Once in awhile, some internal person makes a mistake and there is a slight delay.

The bigger problem is screening S8 tenants to get one that pays THEIR part of the rent on time and takes decent care of the property.

We just had eviction court today with a tenant not paying their rent portion AND deliberately causing damages, so their home failed the S8 inspection. Fortunately for us, we require our ServiceTechs to video their repairs, which we were able to show in court. 

 You and I both are aware what its like working in the lower income areas. Its ALL about screening. I have had sec 8 tenants for years and years. Most of them keep the props in better condition then cash tenants, as they are aware they can " loose their free ride "
Keep crushing it 

[Regina Blake]

Hi, I am an Ohio Realtor and interested in investing in Ohio that would be a great choice. Please feel free to contact me if you have any questions. Thank You!

Regina Blake-Ohio Realtor 

[Bob Stevens]

Quote from @MARK S KING:

Hello, any input on the best market for section 8? Looking for a way to analyze the highest allowance from Sec8 vs the lowest priced homes, wondering where you can get the most bang for your buck. I have heard the target is at least 400-500 per month net positive cash flow based on 20% down. Where are you seeing opportunities? Thank you!

 Not sure there is a BEST , however I just got 875 for a 2 br all in 60k, and 850 for 1 br in ,my apartment building in East Cleveland, so 20% net caps pretty good

[Brian Jackson]

Quote from @Bob Stevens:

Quote from @MARK S KING:

Hello, any input on the best market for section 8? Looking for a way to analyze the highest allowance from Sec8 vs the lowest priced homes, wondering where you can get the most bang for your buck. I have heard the target is at least 400-500 per month net positive cash flow based on 20% down. Where are you seeing opportunities? Thank you!

 Not sure there is a BEST , however I just got 875 for a 2 br all in 60k, and 850 for 1 br in ,my apartment building in East Cleveland, so 20% net caps pretty good

 You should be able to get a lot more than $875 for a 2 bedroom S8 property.

[Bob Stevens]

Quote from @Brian Jackson:

Quote from @Bob Stevens:

Quote from @MARK S KING:

Hello, any input on the best market for section 8? Looking for a way to analyze the highest allowance from Sec8 vs the lowest priced homes, wondering where you can get the most bang for your buck. I have heard the target is at least 400-500 per month net positive cash flow based on 20% down. Where are you seeing opportunities? Thank you!

 Not sure there is a BEST , however I just got 875 for a 2 br all in 60k, and 850 for 1 br in ,my apartment building in East Cleveland, so 20% net caps pretty good

 You should be able to get a lot more than $875 for a 2 bedroom S8 property.

Not on Dove Ave, but this was last year. I now should be able to get it to 950ish as I got 950 for a 2 br top floor duplex in N Collinwood . Hey not complaining I was all in under 50k, so great ROI,

[Regina Blake]

Hi, I am an Ohio Realtor and if you have any questions, please feel free to contact me. Thanks!

Regina Blake-Ohio Realtor

[Regina Blake]

Hi, as a Realtor, I would definitely tell you that Ohio is a great place to invest in real estate. If you have any questions, please feel free to contact me. Thanks!

Regina Blake-Ohio Realtor