I know the term safe is a relatively subjective term when it comes to real estate but I am talking more along the line of what neighborhood/area can one stand to make a fairly significant gain with a 15-25K cosmetic rehab/update?

Maybe you should explore other ravenues.Also - I was looking at lots of multifams as well and found almost nothing would cash flow, until I started looking at low end neighborhoods.

I understand your frustration but have you looked to see on average how long it takes to sell a house in your neighborhood...the other possibility is that the price is too high...those are the first two things I would look at.

It's in a bad neighborhood.

And you go out and buy a old dump of a house but in a nice neighborhood.

So, I drove around the neighborhood looking for other homes for sale hoping to get a price range.

NO EXCEPTIONS.The house has a very high efficiencey A/C, extra attic insulation and solar reflecting screens on the windows to keep YOUR utility bills lower than the neighborhood average!

I've driven past most of them and have decided against most because of the price--kind of have to laugh, most of the ones I've not even looked at inside because of price/size/location/exterior condition/neighborhood have been priced similarly to better houses in better neighborhoods that look a lot better.

Investors normally use birddogs that are people with occupations that will bring them into contact with vacant properties (i.e. cablemen, utility company employees, newspaper delivery people, etc.).

In some markets there are little niche areas or neighborhoods that will cashflow.