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All Forum Posts by: Steve K.

Steve K. has started 29 posts and replied 2789 times.

Post: California to make "Solar "mandatory for new Homes!!!!!!

Steve K.#4 Investor Mindset ContributorPosted
  • Realtor
  • Boulder, CO
  • Posts 2,892
  • Votes 5,163
Originally posted by @Tanya F.:

Thank you @Andrew Smith and @Steve K. for being persistent in addressing the out-of-date and incorrect information ** on this and other similar threads.  There are plenty of ways people can save a lot of money with solar (and make a lot over the long term), but thanks to the repetition of the abundant misinformation, they refuse to believe it.

Our house had solar in the 1970's, so I've known its benefits for a long time! In the 70's solar was mainly for tree-hugging hippies, but not at our house. My dad is an engineer and was all about the technology development as long as I can remember.

There was a great cartoon about adopting solar in the last couple of weeks- few folks were interested in saving the planet, but perked up when they saw the dollar signs.  I wish I could find it.

** I'm a scientist and do this in my day job for the misinformation about GMOs and vaccines.

 Thanks for the recognition Tanya. This has been exasperating with all the outdated or just bad info being disseminated, batteries aren't big enough, "windmills" consume energy, solar is the only form of energy that receives govt. money, etc.... Apparently if you want a post with 200 comments, all you have to do is mention solar, but 50% or more of the posts will be straight out of left field.

I had forgotten how little the general public knows about solar, it's mainstream in my area and has been for a while plus working in the industry I'm dealing with folks who have at least a basic understanding. It seems a lot of people have their "solar talking point" from 10 years ago and still think it's relevant. New energy economy train has already left the station people, time to play catch up now.  

Post: California to make "Solar "mandatory for new Homes!!!!!!

Steve K.#4 Investor Mindset ContributorPosted
  • Realtor
  • Boulder, CO
  • Posts 2,892
  • Votes 5,163
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
Originally posted by @Steve K.:
Originally posted by @Andrew Smith:
Originally posted by @Steve K.:
Originally posted by @Seth Borman:

 Seth good point about remodels, I had forgotten about that thanks for bringing that back to my attention. I definitely see your point. Any addition over 500ft2 in my area triggers the dreaded "site plan review" process aka a ton more hoops to jump through. I want to add a bedroom on my primary and the list of things they want me to do would add about $10k to the project (and I already have solar, now they want me to add sprinklers but I have vaulted ceilings so that's not practical, they don't care) so I feel your pain on regulations in general.

Of course it causes a knee jerk reaction whenever home prices are increased in a region that has a major housing crisis but I think the thought process being applied here is more long term (and I frame it this way because as I have said I have mixed feelings about the mandate, so I can only present what I think the policy makers intentions are). The way proponents of the mandate frame it is as it relates to home pricing is that initial costs will increase but total cost of home ownership actually decreases due to reduced monthly operating expenses. So it's basically forcing people to become investors in a power plant on their roof as opposed to being locked into buying electricity from the utility with no return on their end, ever. Homes with solar save their occupants money whereas homes without solar keep a debt to the utility on the books each month indefinitely. Reduced operating expenses also theoretically reduces the rate of mortgage default and makes home ownership MORE affordable in the grand scheme because the electric bill is eliminated, which in CA as you know can be a significant monthly expense. At least that's what I assume the policy makers would say based on what I've read. I'm still learning about how this experiment is expected to work.

Let's face it, a large part of homelessness is due to people making poor personal decisions (in addition to a very long list of other factors beyond people's control of course to be fair, but still, many homeless people made bad life decisions). A solar mandate forces people to save money and removes the option for them to divert money they should use for their bills to buy luxury items. Many of us have tenants with a fancy flat screen TV and a blinged-out BMW who are behind several months on their electric bills. They wouldn't be behind on their bills if they didn't have those bills, because the electricity they use was provided by the solar panels on the roof. That's the idea anyway, and it wasn't my idea but I'm trying to present what I believe is the intention behind the mandate, take it or leave it.

I think this mandate is looked at as a drastic measure even among the most ardent supporters of solar such as yours truly. Perhaps drastic measures are needed as we enter the new energy economy. It's not going to be easy to adjust as we move forward, big changes are coming to the way we produce and consume energy.  I plan to profit from the changes, crucify me for it if you like.  

@Brian Ploszay

@Rhonda Wilson

@Karen Margrave

@Andrew Smith

@Jay Hinrichs

 Personally I believe a carbon tax would have been far more appropriate than mandated solar. It would finally level playing fields in terms of fossil fuel and related energy production paying true cost of energy. That would be a much faster step towards eliminating subsidies too and preserve freedom for consumers to choose. Even with the decks stacked in favour of fossil fuels, solar is the energy of choice for exponentially increasing numbers of homeowners, States and utilities. Imagine what it could look like with a carbon tax to level the playing field some.

I agree whole heartedly. I actually see the mandate as somewhat of a nothing-burger compared to people's reactions to it. It doesn't really move the needle that much compared to the blowback from people who aren't looking at the whole picture. 

What I would prefer to see personally is an incentive for landlords to install solar on rental properties.

But it's easy to point to a piece of legislation and criticize it for not being more in line with whatever ancillary agenda people have. Ultimately complaining is the cancer of the soul. 

So let's accept the mandate, (builders will be fine learning how to slap a few panels down during a new build or a remodel, it's really not difficult, we're gonna be fine) and separately we can work towards other legislation to end homelessness, create a carbon tax, reduce reliance on government help for all forms of energy, provide incentives for solar on investment property, and whatever anyone else's pet issue is.

And Steve lets add in World Peace !!!

 Haha Jay how could I forget. We haven't had any solar wars yet, but I wouldn't rule it out. 

Post: California to make "Solar "mandatory for new Homes!!!!!!

Steve K.#4 Investor Mindset ContributorPosted
  • Realtor
  • Boulder, CO
  • Posts 2,892
  • Votes 5,163
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
Originally posted by @Andrew Smith:
Originally posted by @Steve K.:
Originally posted by @Seth Borman:

 Seth good point about remodels, I had forgotten about that thanks for bringing that back to my attention. I definitely see your point. Any addition over 500ft2 in my area triggers the dreaded "site plan review" process aka a ton more hoops to jump through. I want to add a bedroom on my primary and the list of things they want me to do would add about $10k to the project (and I already have solar, now they want me to add sprinklers but I have vaulted ceilings so that's not practical, they don't care) so I feel your pain on regulations in general.

Of course it causes a knee jerk reaction whenever home prices are increased in a region that has a major housing crisis but I think the thought process being applied here is more long term (and I frame it this way because as I have said I have mixed feelings about the mandate, so I can only present what I think the policy makers intentions are). The way proponents of the mandate frame it is as it relates to home pricing is that initial costs will increase but total cost of home ownership actually decreases due to reduced monthly operating expenses. So it's basically forcing people to become investors in a power plant on their roof as opposed to being locked into buying electricity from the utility with no return on their end, ever. Homes with solar save their occupants money whereas homes without solar keep a debt to the utility on the books each month indefinitely. Reduced operating expenses also theoretically reduces the rate of mortgage default and makes home ownership MORE affordable in the grand scheme because the electric bill is eliminated, which in CA as you know can be a significant monthly expense. At least that's what I assume the policy makers would say based on what I've read. I'm still learning about how this experiment is expected to work.

Let's face it, a large part of homelessness is due to people making poor personal decisions (in addition to a very long list of other factors beyond people's control of course to be fair, but still, many homeless people made bad life decisions). A solar mandate forces people to save money and removes the option for them to divert money they should use for their bills to buy luxury items. Many of us have tenants with a fancy flat screen TV and a blinged-out BMW who are behind several months on their electric bills. They wouldn't be behind on their bills if they didn't have those bills, because the electricity they use was provided by the solar panels on the roof. That's the idea anyway, and it wasn't my idea but I'm trying to present what I believe is the intention behind the mandate, take it or leave it.

I think this mandate is looked at as a drastic measure even among the most ardent supporters of solar such as yours truly. Perhaps drastic measures are needed as we enter the new energy economy. It's not going to be easy to adjust as we move forward, big changes are coming to the way we produce and consume energy.  I plan to profit from the changes, crucify me for it if you like.  

@Brian Ploszay

@Rhonda Wilson

@Karen Margrave

@Andrew Smith

@Jay Hinrichs

 Personally I believe a carbon tax would have been far more appropriate than mandated solar. It would finally level playing fields in terms of fossil fuel and related energy production paying true cost of energy. That would be a much faster step towards eliminating subsidies too and preserve freedom for consumers to choose. Even with the decks stacked in favour of fossil fuels, solar is the energy of choice for exponentially increasing numbers of homeowners, States and utilities. Imagine what it could look like with a carbon tax to level the playing field some.

Being a Tesla family I don't want to pay for others gas habit LOL  but maybe just a chip in the car and you pay by the miles you drive ???? 

 Jay I think that would be achieved by less government help in what we pay at the pump, true cost of gasoline is in the neighborhood of $15/gallon. But if fuel costs weren't subsidized, cost of goods would skyrocket, nobody wants that. 

Post: California to make "Solar "mandatory for new Homes!!!!!!

Steve K.#4 Investor Mindset ContributorPosted
  • Realtor
  • Boulder, CO
  • Posts 2,892
  • Votes 5,163
Originally posted by @Karen Margrave:

@Andrew Smith  I did a little digging, thanks to all of you for pushing me to get up to speed.  PGE Credit for Surplus

 Don't worry Karen, even as solar professionals we have to constantly update ourselves literally every day. This industry is moving at a lightning fast pace it's hard to keep up with it. I'd be curious to see what the $50k system you were quoted before would cost with current pricing. If you let us know the size in watts Andrew and I could give you a rough updated cost per watt estimate.  

Post: California to make "Solar "mandatory for new Homes!!!!!!

Steve K.#4 Investor Mindset ContributorPosted
  • Realtor
  • Boulder, CO
  • Posts 2,892
  • Votes 5,163
Originally posted by @Andrew Smith:
Originally posted by @Steve K.:
Originally posted by @Seth Borman:

 Seth good point about remodels, I had forgotten about that thanks for bringing that back to my attention. I definitely see your point. Any addition over 500ft2 in my area triggers the dreaded "site plan review" process aka a ton more hoops to jump through. I want to add a bedroom on my primary and the list of things they want me to do would add about $10k to the project (and I already have solar, now they want me to add sprinklers but I have vaulted ceilings so that's not practical, they don't care) so I feel your pain on regulations in general.

Of course it causes a knee jerk reaction whenever home prices are increased in a region that has a major housing crisis but I think the thought process being applied here is more long term (and I frame it this way because as I have said I have mixed feelings about the mandate, so I can only present what I think the policy makers intentions are). The way proponents of the mandate frame it is as it relates to home pricing is that initial costs will increase but total cost of home ownership actually decreases due to reduced monthly operating expenses. So it's basically forcing people to become investors in a power plant on their roof as opposed to being locked into buying electricity from the utility with no return on their end, ever. Homes with solar save their occupants money whereas homes without solar keep a debt to the utility on the books each month indefinitely. Reduced operating expenses also theoretically reduces the rate of mortgage default and makes home ownership MORE affordable in the grand scheme because the electric bill is eliminated, which in CA as you know can be a significant monthly expense. At least that's what I assume the policy makers would say based on what I've read. I'm still learning about how this experiment is expected to work.

Let's face it, a large part of homelessness is due to people making poor personal decisions (in addition to a very long list of other factors beyond people's control of course to be fair, but still, many homeless people made bad life decisions). A solar mandate forces people to save money and removes the option for them to divert money they should use for their bills to buy luxury items. Many of us have tenants with a fancy flat screen TV and a blinged-out BMW who are behind several months on their electric bills. They wouldn't be behind on their bills if they didn't have those bills, because the electricity they use was provided by the solar panels on the roof. That's the idea anyway, and it wasn't my idea but I'm trying to present what I believe is the intention behind the mandate, take it or leave it.

I think this mandate is looked at as a drastic measure even among the most ardent supporters of solar such as yours truly. Perhaps drastic measures are needed as we enter the new energy economy. It's not going to be easy to adjust as we move forward, big changes are coming to the way we produce and consume energy.  I plan to profit from the changes, crucify me for it if you like.  

@Brian Ploszay

@Rhonda Wilson

@Karen Margrave

@Andrew Smith

@Jay Hinrichs

 Personally I believe a carbon tax would have been far more appropriate than mandated solar. It would finally level playing fields in terms of fossil fuel and related energy production paying true cost of energy. That would be a much faster step towards eliminating subsidies too and preserve freedom for consumers to choose. Even with the decks stacked in favour of fossil fuels, solar is the energy of choice for exponentially increasing numbers of homeowners, States and utilities. Imagine what it could look like with a carbon tax to level the playing field some.

I agree whole heartedly. I actually see the mandate as somewhat of a nothing-burger compared to people's reactions to it. It doesn't really move the needle that much compared to the blowback from people who aren't looking at the whole picture. 

What I would prefer to see personally is an incentive for landlords to install solar on rental properties.

But it's easy to point to a piece of legislation and criticize it for not being more in line with whatever ancillary agenda people have. Ultimately complaining is the cancer of the soul. 

So let's accept the mandate, (builders will be fine learning how to slap a few panels down during a new build or a remodel, it's really not difficult, we're gonna be fine) and separately we can work towards other legislation to end homelessness, create a carbon tax, reduce reliance on government help for all forms of energy, provide incentives for solar on investment property, and whatever anyone else's pet issue is.

Post: California to make "Solar "mandatory for new Homes!!!!!!

Steve K.#4 Investor Mindset ContributorPosted
  • Realtor
  • Boulder, CO
  • Posts 2,892
  • Votes 5,163
Originally posted by @David K.:

Government is too entrenched in California business. 

What if Joe home buyer does not want a solar panel - due to the extra maintainance costs or for other reasons?

I purchased high effeciency gas units only to find they are FAR more expensive to maintain than regular ones.  I paid MORE for the high efficiency ones than regular gas units which were not that much less efficient. 

Let the market decide - it never works well when government gets into business. 

I agree government should get out of the energy business but we might differ on which forms of energy they should stop supporting first. I'd like to see the subsidies for coal, nuclear, and gas go away first. Solar and wind are the two forms of energy that have potential to exist without government subsidies.  

Post: California to make "Solar "mandatory for new Homes!!!!!!

Steve K.#4 Investor Mindset ContributorPosted
  • Realtor
  • Boulder, CO
  • Posts 2,892
  • Votes 5,163
Originally posted by @Seth Borman:

 Seth good point about remodels, I had forgotten about that thanks for bringing that back to my attention. I definitely see your point. Any addition over 500ft2 in my area triggers the dreaded "site plan review" process aka a ton more hoops to jump through. I want to add a bedroom on my primary and the list of things they want me to do would add about $10k to the project (and I already have solar, now they want me to add sprinklers but I have vaulted ceilings so that's not practical, they don't care) so I feel your pain on regulations in general.

Of course it causes a knee jerk reaction whenever home prices are increased in a region that has a major housing crisis but I think the thought process being applied here is more long term (and I frame it this way because as I have said I have mixed feelings about the mandate, so I can only present what I think the policy makers intentions are). The way proponents of the mandate frame it is as it relates to home pricing is that initial costs will increase but total cost of home ownership actually decreases due to reduced monthly operating expenses. So it's basically forcing people to become investors in a power plant on their roof as opposed to being locked into buying electricity from the utility with no return on their end, ever. Homes with solar save their occupants money whereas homes without solar keep a debt to the utility on the books each month indefinitely. Reduced operating expenses also theoretically reduces the rate of mortgage default and makes home ownership MORE affordable in the grand scheme because the electric bill is eliminated, which in CA as you know can be a significant monthly expense. At least that's what I assume the policy makers would say based on what I've read. I'm still learning about how this experiment is expected to work.

Let's face it, a large part of homelessness is due to people making poor personal decisions (in addition to a very long list of other factors beyond people's control of course to be fair, but still, many homeless people made bad life decisions). A solar mandate forces people to save money and removes the option for them to divert money they should use for their bills to buy luxury items. Many of us have tenants with a fancy flat screen TV and a blinged-out BMW who are behind several months on their electric bills. They wouldn't be behind on their bills if they didn't have those bills, because the electricity they use was provided by the solar panels on the roof. That's the idea anyway, and it wasn't my idea but I'm trying to present what I believe is the intention behind the mandate, take it or leave it.

I think this mandate is looked at as a drastic measure even among the most ardent supporters of solar such as yours truly. Perhaps drastic measures are needed as we enter the new energy economy. It's not going to be easy to adjust as we move forward, big changes are coming to the way we produce and consume energy.  I plan to profit from the changes, crucify me for it if you like.  

@Brian Ploszay

@Rhonda Wilson

@Karen Margrave

@Andrew Smith

@Jay Hinrichs

Post: California to make "Solar "mandatory for new Homes!!!!!!

Steve K.#4 Investor Mindset ContributorPosted
  • Realtor
  • Boulder, CO
  • Posts 2,892
  • Votes 5,163
Originally posted by @Adam Blachnio:
Originally posted by @Steve K.:
Originally posted by @Adam Blachnio:

so the panels and batteries as a whole should have some kind of government incentive in tax deduction or similar ✔️

 There has been a 30% tax credit on solar equipment since 2005. Batteries are no longer used 99% of the time. 

So how the exces of energy can be stored for more house-demand-time?

 Net metering: meter reverses during the day when surplus energy is being produced, credits those kilowatt hours to the account for later use when sun isn't shining. 

Post: California to make "Solar "mandatory for new Homes!!!!!!

Steve K.#4 Investor Mindset ContributorPosted
  • Realtor
  • Boulder, CO
  • Posts 2,892
  • Votes 5,163
Originally posted by @Adam Blachnio:

so the panels and batteries as a whole should have some kind of government incentive in tax deduction or similar ✔️

 There has been a 30% tax credit on solar equipment since 2005. Batteries are no longer used 99% of the time. 

Post: California to make "Solar "mandatory for new Homes!!!!!!

Steve K.#4 Investor Mindset ContributorPosted
  • Realtor
  • Boulder, CO
  • Posts 2,892
  • Votes 5,163
Originally posted by @Andrew Smith:
Originally posted by @Steve K.:

Care to clarify, you’re not a fan of SunPower? They’re pricey but sweet, some people just gotta have the top of the line gear and don’t mind paying for it. I’ve got Silfabs on my roof, North American made baby!

 Plenty are North American made baby! My favourite for bang-for-the-buck are Hanwa, but also really like LG and Panasonic. No doubt Sunpower are a quality panel. Their problem is that all their eggs are in that basket and are much more sensitive to conditions in solar. That led to them hitting financial trouble and are now owned, ironically, by French oil company Total.

Hanwa, LG, Panasonic are all huge conglomerates. If LG have issues in one area it does not threaten the company as a whole to anything like the same degree as Sunpower.

The American made thing is interesting. Most people consider BMW/Honda/Toyota to be non-American companies yet they employ many thousands of Americans and contribute to the US economy more than say Ford assembling South of the Border. Which is really American made. Hanwa have set up to produce 1.6 GW of panels annually in Georgia!!

I don't like the price of Sunpower either but definitely recognize they're a great panel.

I’m enjoying my Silfabs, paid off in less than a year (tagged 21 onto an order for 8 MW so less than wholesale pricing on the mods, spliced together some remnant racking, installed them with some solar bros on a Saturday and had our master wire them up for me to return a favor so total out of pocket was under $4k before ITC for a 6kW system). My last house had Evergreen panels: truly American owned/ American made. Loved that string ribbon technology, super tight power tolerance for the time and zero waste manufacturing the cells. I guess that was 70’s technology essentially, only 12% efficient but the fuel source was free so efficiency didn’t bother me one bit. It’s funny when folks get hung up on efficiancy withe something that doesn’t require fuel. My truck is only 20% efficient and I have to keep putting gas in it! But I still drive it. Simpler times back then, when American made meant 100% American and Fords weren’t made in Mexico.