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All Forum Posts by: Spencer Sutton

Spencer Sutton has started 18 posts and replied 111 times.

Post: Turnkey Deal Gone Bad...

Spencer Sutton
Posted
  • Investor
  • Birmingham, AL
  • Posts 117
  • Votes 147

We had someone come to Birmingham from Miami over the weekend to check on five houses that he bought for ‘clients’.

Here’s a snapshot of the situation:

  • He’s owned these properties somewhere around a year
  • He’s never seen them in person until this past Saturday
  • His current property manager has been less than responsive
  • he owns a mix of “D” and “F” houses...one of them is a disaster and another one will become a disaster

As we drove his five properties, we had the opportunity to give this investor a real life education on the low-end Birmingham, Alabama rental market. We were brutally honest about what we found as well as our thoughts on how it could possibly be fixed.

This is what we found:

  1. House #1 - In an “F” neighborhood and is currently rented for $400 per month. IF/WHEN this tenant moves out, it’s going to be a mess. The property will be vandalized almost immediately and he will be left with a $10,000 to $20,000 rehab that he’ll never be able to recover from. We encouraged him to do whatever necessary to make sure the tenant is the happiest person in the neighborhood...KEEP THE TENANT!
  2. House #2 - In a “D” neighborhood and currently vacant. Just a few things on the outside of the house that we noticed and suggested he repair. He didn’t have keys for any of these houses so we weren’t able to get a look at what was going on inside.
  3. House #3 - In a “D+” neighborhood and the tenants were moving out on Saturday. The investor understood that they were being evicted because of non payment. When he saw them moving the washer and dryer out he said we should call the cops and report them because they were stealing….the only problem with that is that he has no idea what was provided in the lease and what wasn’t. Plus he had no proof of ownership so stopping the move out wouldn’t have done much good. It’s not a good situation.
  4. House #4 - In a “D” neighborhood and is currently rented for approximately $500/month.
  5. House #5 - In an “F” neighborhood and is vacant. We were able to get into this house because it has been completely destroyed. It was built around 1920, has 12ft ceilings and everything has been stolen from the home...including the cast iron bathtub which we’re sure was sold somewhere. Our opinion was that he could probably sell the house ‘as-is’ for 2k or he could put about 25k in it to have it rent ready. Either scenario is not good. He suggested that it be rehabbed in stages...the only problem with that is that it will be vandalized in the exact stages it’s rehabbed.

So what are the lessons?

  • Visit and walk the neighborhoods before you buy
  • Know and trust your turnkey provider
  • Understand and appreciate what it takes to find a good tenant
  • Know and trust your property manager

Any lessons I’m missing??

Post: Don't make these 5 mistakes buying your rentals....

Spencer Sutton
Posted
  • Investor
  • Birmingham, AL
  • Posts 117
  • Votes 147

I wrote a little more about this on this blog http://www.gkhouses.com/blog/dont-miss-these-5-tur...

Post: Don't make these 5 mistakes buying your rentals....

Spencer Sutton
Posted
  • Investor
  • Birmingham, AL
  • Posts 117
  • Votes 147

Thanks for the kind words everyone...it's important and healthy for the this community to inform each other of common pitfalls that can derail our goals!  

Please be sure to name any other common mistakes you see investors making in your markets....would love to know.

Post: Don't make these 5 mistakes buying your rentals....

Spencer Sutton
Posted
  • Investor
  • Birmingham, AL
  • Posts 117
  • Votes 147

Hey Heath...yes, I've heard ATL has gotten tougher!  

A couple of years ago there was talk about Norwood becoming the next hot area but it just hasn't materialized.  The homes are massive and built around the turn of the century...which means they're money pits.

It would be purely speculative to invest in that area...but if you have time and money anything is possible!

Post: Don't make these 5 mistakes buying your rentals....

Spencer Sutton
Posted
  • Investor
  • Birmingham, AL
  • Posts 117
  • Votes 147

I was on the phone yesterday with an investor from California who asked for our advice in analyzing a few wholesale deals he had been offered here in Birmingham, Alabama.

It's such a common conversation I thought it would be helpful to post it here so others might avoid the same mistakes he almost made when looking at C/D rentals in Birmingham.  

It's probably helpful to also note that what a lot of out of state investors are told is 'B' property is more like C/D...and some F.

Anyway...here are the mistakes a lot of out of state investors make.

#1 Mistake - Thinking that big lots make the property more valuable.  This couldn't be further from the truth.  In these areas big lots are a lawn maintenance nightmare and a tax liability.  Don't listen to anyone try to sell you on the 'value' of a bigger lot.  Tenants don't want a bigger yard to take care of and the lot value is worth $0 on the market.

#2 Mistake - Not understanding the different municipalities.  The person I spoke with yesterday from CA had actually been to Birmingham and been inside one of the houses he was considering buying.  Things were lining up for him and seemed like an ok deal on the surface.  What he didn't understand is that the municipality where this house is located is notoriously difficult to work with.  They are not landlord friendly and do their best to make it a difficult experience. Things like $50 landlord fee, $300 power deposit, electrical inspections that almost always result in more work, pulled permits, garbage fee, etc...  Understand where you're buying and build possible difficulties into your deal.

#3 Mistake - Believing that all houses appreciate.  It's extremely doubtful you will see appreciation in these areas. Your only hope is that it will stabilize and not drop any further.  If anything will drive appreciation, it will be an increase of rents for the area over time along with a solid neighborhood.  

#4 Mistake - Trusting a contractor you don't know.  This investor was quoted $9,800 for the rehab work on this 10k house.  Sounds good...but how in the world do you know? His justification to me was that this contractor used to work on million dollar houses in Birmingham and Atlanta.  That left me scratching my head asking, 'What in the world is he doing working on these houses now?'  It's also important to note that if the quote is below $10,000, he does not have to be a certified homebuilder and won't have to pull permits in certain municipalities.  This contractor is likely not licensed or insured and we've seen many walk off without finishing the job.  Do your homework, talk to other landlords he/she has worked with, talk to property managers they may have worked with and find out if they are state certified...also take a look at some of their work if you can.

#5 Mistake - Not understanding how 'white elephants' will deter good tenants from renting.  What's a 'white elephant'?  Anything that takes away from the generic appeal of the rental house.  That could be a busy street, burned out or abandoned houses in the neighborhood, railroad tracks, industrial areas, steep hill/driveway, near the interstate, next to a graveyard, funky layout, high ceilings, etc... You want to buy cookie cutter houses for your rentals.  There's a reason national homebuilders have certain floor plans that they sell over and over and over....

There are great opportunities in Birmingham for rental property. Do your homework, find people you trust and you'll do well.

That's it for now...hope it's helpful.

Post: Birmingham, Alabama Turnkey Deals

Spencer Sutton
Posted
  • Investor
  • Birmingham, AL
  • Posts 117
  • Votes 147

I'll put a post up here once the ebook is done along with a link where you can download it.

Post: Birmingham, Alabama Turnkey Deals

Spencer Sutton
Posted
  • Investor
  • Birmingham, AL
  • Posts 117
  • Votes 147

Hey J, 

We are actually not going to only highlight the negative. 

Truth be known, there are some good deals to be had that can provide a good investment for out of state investors.

I've bought and sold a lot of houses in Birmingham (over 150) but they were all wholesale. Matthew has sold some turnkey deals in the past.  We'll be completely transparent about anything we've done in the past as well as anything we're involved in currently.

I still own rentals (some good, some bad) in Birmingham and we've learned a lot over the past 12 years in the market and think it could help investors who don't live here.

Thanks for the comment and I'll send you an email when we're done so you can check it out first!

Post: Birmingham, Alabama Turnkey Deals

Spencer Sutton
Posted
  • Investor
  • Birmingham, AL
  • Posts 117
  • Votes 147

Hey guys/gals,

We're working on an ebook about the Birmingham, Alabama turnkey business.  We will be highlighting deals, real world examples and be 100% transparent.  

The reason I'm posting here is that I wanted to know if there was anything YOU (specifically out of state investors looking at Birmingham) want to know...questions you want answered, etc....

We field calls from investors every week at our office asking us about the market, rental houses and even specific deals they've been presented.

Because we're not a turnkey company but manage over 1,000 houses in the city, we've got information that could be valuable to you all if we knew what you needed.

So, feel free to ask anything and if something comes up that should be included in the ebook, we'll do it.  

Right now the working title is "10 Things Turn Key Providers in Birmingham AL Don’t Want You to Know".  We're considering breaking it into two books.

Let me know if this is something you'd be interested in reading.

Post: Deals to analyze in Birmingham

Spencer Sutton
Posted
  • Investor
  • Birmingham, AL
  • Posts 117
  • Votes 147

I just got the rough draft from Matthew (gkhouses.com owner) yesterday and I'll be working on finishing that one along with one I'm writing with a 35 year veteran about how to keep a tenant 20 years.  

I'll post something on BP when we're done and make it available to anyone who's interested.

Post: Deals to analyze in Birmingham

Spencer Sutton
Posted
  • Investor
  • Birmingham, AL
  • Posts 117
  • Votes 147

Joey,

I've been buying/selling and managing rental property in Birmingham since 2003.  I have to tell you that those prices are too high. 

There's a lot I could say about turnkey here in Birmingham but I'll save that for another time.  I sat down with out of state investors the other day looking to place 900k in Birmingham and after looking at the list of properties they were presented to buy from a 'turnkey' expert, I had to tell them the truth about that junk list.

Instinctively they thought something was wrong when they visited and saw burned down houses on the same street and a lot of vacant properties.

I'm not saying these houses you're looking at are junk...but what I am saying is you need to be crystal clear on the neighborhood, the condition of the houses and the type of tenant placed in the house.

All it takes is a couple of months of slow pay, then no pay and then you've got an eviction on your hands. In Alabama that takes 3 months.

Investors lose money on turns...and that's money you can't get back from another tenant. The goal is to buy a great house, get it in great condition and have a disciplined underwriting process. The way you make money in this business is to keep a tenant for 10 to 20 years.

I'm actually working on an ebook now about Birmingham's turnkey business and how investors really make money in this business.

I'll step off my soap box now...sorry for rambling on.