All Forum Posts by: David Dachtera

You can view it that way, if you want. Bob had a credit score of 520 when he came to the group despite being an independent business person. Scott was about to lose his home in foreclosure. Jean lost a majorly well paying job.

It never hurts to have business savvy, and if you don't have it, the Renatus classes can help you, but won't do it for you.

Just remember that you are what we call a "silver spooner". You grew up in the top 5%. The rest of us earned what little we have and everything we lost.

Notice also that you're still "nay-saying", fault finding, etc. We tend to find what we're looking for. Instead of looking for the worst, why not look for the best?

@J Scott,

"But, it requires work, and it seems like you'd rather just argue than put in the work."

You're talking about yourself, Jason. I don't come here to argue, you and Jan Hinrichs do. Then, I have to come in behind you, clean up your mess, correct the falsehoods you put forth and set the record straight. It must really gall you that all you can do is be negative, nay-say and call Renatus something it isn't.

So, for the broader audience, let me translate your last post:

"Dachtera is a 'low-time' investor. His opinions and knowledge are worthless. Listen to me (J Scott) because I'm good, I'm great, I'm experienced, I have a following, people seek me out for my tutelage and mentorship and pay money to read my e-book."

OH! I get it now, you're looking for testimonials!

Well, they're on the MyRenatus website, but since I can't post the link here, I'll have to tell my group's stories in my own words.

Let's start with Bob Tierney, one of the partners who founded the suburban Chicago group. He was a remodeling contractor who got tired of making $10,000 or less on a job while the investors who hired him to work on their investment properties profited hundreds of thousands. He has not only established himself as a sought-after expert on historic restoration - the City of Elgin has given him multiple grants to restore not only his own home but two investment properties in his neighborhood - he is continuing to do historic restorations in upscale suburbs northwest of Chicago. His most recent remodel sold for $110K profit to a buyer who is an experienced investor and is now part of the group.

Then, there's Scott Huminsky - 25-year construction carpenter out of work due to the crash. He was about to lose his home when he bought his education. During the following 13 months, he studied his classes and took the "Building Business Credit" class that Bob Tierney teaches. He founded his business entity, got $85K in business credit and used $81K of it to acquire his first rehab. The roof had been leaking for years - the mold was inches thick in the drywall and ceiling fans looked like upside-down tulips (the pictures are on the web somewhere, I think). He put $105K into it, paid himself $22K during the rehab, held an open house when it was done and received an offer of $569K that very day. Net profit: $133K. His second project was in the historic district of Joliet, IL known as "the Cathedral Area". Net profit there $85K. He is currently working with a VA related program to provide housing for homeless veterans near where they receive treatment for injuries, PTSD, etc. When finished, his business will have government-guaranteed income of $18K a month for 15 years.

Jean Powers - former executive, laid off from a $300K+/ year job. Took her classes and she and her partners recently acquired a portfolio of 35 tax-delinquent properties for $31K. Two have redeemed, she sold two (without rehab or fix!) for $175K total. She plans on making circa. $5 Million total when the entire portfolio has been liquidated.

So... does THAT satisfy your requirements?

... or is it more important to you to argue, bash Renatus, call out @Doug Leedy and myself for not meeting your expectations, nay-say, be negative, ...

If you're going to keep harping, "...but what have YOU done?", go read my profile. The answers are there. Someone else mentioned transparency - that's about as transparent as it gets.

Well, not quite. Remember: the gov't can print more money anytime it wants. 

Even the licensing classes for professionals in all fields involve an up-front expense with "no accountability".

I like to compare the Renatus tuition to a full two years of college classes in pursuit of a degree. Interesting thing, though: college doesn't teach you how to be successful, college teaches you how to be a W2 employee. Corporations, PACs and SIGs expend buku-bux to keep it that way.

The question of " to be or not to be" a licensed agent? I've heard a lot on both sides of that topic. I'm sure it's an individual choice when someone sees an advantage either way. I actually took an IL licensing class and passed it, but never sat for the state test.

At one point, I did take classes and pass the state test to be an insurance "producer". I was recruited into Primerica, which is a TRUE MLM. Had to pay a third-party company for the classes and had to pay the state to sit for the test.

@Greg Jones,

Yes, once you are certified, you are called a "mentor" - you are expected to be proficient enough with what it takes to get to that point that you can either help a new person yourself, or still their questions down so a three-way call with your own mentor would not be a waste of that mentor's time.

It is also expected that you are taking your classes and learning how to mentor new investors as they start up their real estate investing business. (Kinda like BP, no?)

As to accountability, there is the judicial branch. We live in a lawsuit-happy society - don't think for one minute that someone with an axe to grind won't sue everyone from their "mentor" to Bob Snyder and Renatus.

It's interesting to note that Renatus has an A+ rating with the BBB and is *NOT* BBB "accredited" - meaning Renatus did not pay for it's rating: it EARNED that rating through it's relationship with its customers.

...and yes, I KNOW the BBB is a private entity and not related to any branch of the government or governmental body. It's still held in high regard by consumers and businesses alike, despite its being what it is.

Actually, Jay - and I deleted this from an earlier post before I committed it to the web - If anything, Renatus is an "inverted pyramid". The newcomers at the bottom are the ones who make the most money (the direct opposite of an MLM "pyramid" where the ones at the "bottom" make the least). Of course, if you actually knew anything about Renatus, you would already know that.

I'm not sure what it would take to satisfy you, Jason and all the denizens of BP who seem so determined to keep people away from the success they come to BP to seek.

Jason keeps asking for specifics.

What do you seek, Jason, that I did not include in my post from Aug 15, 07:20 PM? There, I contrasted Renatus with the gurus. What beyond that would it take?

Do you REALLY want someone to post the entire 5-hour initial exposure on line (15 minute briefing, the introductory presentation and the Q&A follow-up ... circa 40MB of text, circa. 9GB of video)? Can you suggest an appropriate area of BP to post such material? (It's educational in nature. So, the marketing area is inappropriate. Actually, there is already an established way to view those recordings; but, ...)

Would it kill either or both of you to take the time to learn first-hand and actually know what you're talking about instead of uninformed speculation - attend the presentation and follow-up: 2 evenings out of your life if you have access to the live presentations, or five hours of your time if you took the whole of the recorded material in one sitting?

...or would you have to go out afterward and commit suicide once you discover just how badly you've been behaving?

The hardest words for any person to speak or write in correspondence: "I'm sorry - I was wrong". It takes a big, BIG person to make such an admission. Are there any "big" people on BP?

I said it before, and I will say it with my dying breath: so long as the attacks continue, the defense will continue. The power to stop it rests SOLELY with you, Jason, Jay and the others. You stopped it once before - and earned my respect. Pity you had to lose it by taking it up again instead of leaving it lay.

I'm going to apologize to others reading this thread at this point - my patience with this is worn well past the breaking point.

Let's take the contrast a step further...

Let's say I'm a newbie. Tell me where on BP I would find a curriculum or a syllabus of forum and/or blogs posts to review to learn about:

• The fundamentals of Real Estate Investing (terminology, ethics, etc.)?
• Wholesaling
• Setting up my corporate entities for the best tax advantage and asset protection?
• Creative ways to acquire properties to resell or to assign contracts?
• Marketing wholesale and other properties to buyers? Marketing deals to potential partners / financiers?
• How to use Self-Directed retirement plans to invest and/or raise private money?
• Things to watch out for?
• How to manage your personal and business credit?

@Doug Leedy: If you look at your Essentials curriculum, you'll see where I got those, with the exception that wholesaling is not in the Essentials track. It's in the Advanced Classes.

The third item on that list is actually a two-day class: Tax and Legal, I & II. The last one is a new addition. I've had the live presentations from the instructor being in our suburban Chicago location, but I haven't take the new class yet.

So, where on BP would I find something telling me where to find all of those? Of the posts it would lead me to, how many of the posters make $1 million a year doing each one? (that is, the poster is qualified to teach others about their topic / expertise) In the case of the third item, which posters are tax and business attorneys and are also CPAs and tax accountants in active practice? (The instructor of that class holds all of those designations.)

Jay (and any other licensed RE / title / escrow professionals reading this post): do YOU know about the CFPB / RESPA settlement procedure changes coming Oct 1? We just learned about them yesterday at the workshop - three hours worth.

There is, of course, one other key topic. As I mentioned to Wendell in my reply to his post last night, "The hard part about real estate is not money or education - it's entrepreneurship."

@Wendell De Guzman,

Speaking from experience in the job market...

I once asked the people in my outplacement group why anyone would get laid off and go look for another job to get laid off from ... These days, "job" and "security" in the same sentence constitutes an oxymoron.

That said, the job market for some folks remains quite challenging. Michael didn't mention his age or his skills, but for some folks their career field has all but vanished.

The hard part about real estate is not money or education - it's entrepreneurship. It's something one must "bring to the table" for the most part. Some folks can learn it which is why I do motivational speaking. Others seem to have been born with it. The rest may never get it.

@Jay Hinrichs: "I know the business from the back end as good if not better than you."

Interesting you should say that.

We had our monthly workshop today. The instructor was our title, escrow, closing and commercial real estate guy. He's one of those who didn't go the "rags to riches" route, though he did express consternation about his student debts from when he was in college. He owns a title company, is an escrow officer and maintains a real estate agent license. In the course of his presentation today, he happened to mention, and this almost a direct quote - I don't have my notes handy - that by his estimation 80% of the related Renatus education is *NOT* found in ANY of his licensing or continuing ed. classes, though he thought it probably should be.

In a study group a few weeks ago, a local multi-family broker who has been in the business for 25 years said that when he came to the group he thought he knew it all and didn't need the classes - until he took the classes and found out how much he didn't know. In his own words (edited for "television"), "I found out I didn't know spit!"

I know I won't sway you, it's not my intent. I just want to keep the record straight. Until you've experienced something, best not to bad-mouth it with no first-hand experience.

I outlined our value versus "the gurus" in an earlier post. If it doesn't get deleted, I'll let it stand as testimony.

...and yes - I have experience with "the gurus", first-hand. I'm always open to learning, where ever I might find it (even in this forum thread!).

By the way...

When I say "Community Volunteer", let me describe what that entailed on this workshop day...

I arrived at the office in time to make coffee and discover that we had no creamer and that our supply of hand-towels for the restrooms was depleted. So, I got the coffee pots going, and went to a local grocery store for supplies (out of my own pocket!), came back, loaded seven bags of garbage into my trunk (the dumpster is on the far corner of the office complex lot), unloaded them, came back, washed up, put out more pastries for the guests to have with their coffee, made the rounds and verified the air conditioning was on all around, attended the morning session ducking out twice to make sure there was enough coffee and creamer for the guests, helped set up for the catered lunch, networked a bit during lunch, took out three more bags of garbage during and after lunch, put out a fresh pot of coffee for afternoon break, and afterward cleaned up the coffee pots and took another 15 bags of garbage out and half a dozen cardboard boxes (I drive a 2007 Ford Focus) before heading home.

...all on a volunteer basis. You can bet no one buzzing around a guru event does all that (that's what the hotel staff are for!).

@Jay Hinrichs,

Oh, you made your point alright, though probably NOT the point you intended.

It's a shame you're that cynical. Personally, I find negativity counter-productive. Your mileage, of course, may vary, although in my experience, successful people are inherently positive and up beat.

If you're active on Facebook, search for Jermaine Massey and send him a friend request. Then, ask him about his transition from self-employed financial advisor to living in his car to achieving success. Other instructors are on social media, also. Verify with them what they went through. Jay can give you the names (yes - I'm going to make you work for it! ...so you learn).

Again, the marketing side of Renatus is -NOT- MLM never has been, never will be, no matter how many people say otherwise.

...and if anyone wonders why I and others remark about the anti-paid-education bias on BP, here's your evidence, in Jay's own words.

@Karen Cook,

Just to clarify, the marketing side is entirely optional - you don't HAVE to "sign up" anyone, though if you do, the rewards are not inconsequential. Many people use the marketing side to create an "earn while you learn" opportunity for themselves.

Hello, Michael,

I don't remember seeing an email about an update to this thread. Then again, my memory is so bad I could plan my own surprise party!

Homeless, jobless , bankrupt and bad credit is where most of the Renatus instructors started out. One of them also had the added burden of a pregnant wife who couldn't keep anything on her stomach. They were living in their car at the time. He's now one of our multi-family experts, and yes - he used the marketing side of Renatus to save his family's lives.

I agree, there is often too much emphasis on the marketing side and not enough on the education - especially in cases such as yours where you need to generate income quickly. It could be argued - quite validly - that wholesaling would work just as well, yet you still need to know how to do that in your state / county / city, etc.

In answer to the question of what differentiates Renatus from the "gurus", I can offer only this...

Gurus:

• Gurus come to town to sell. Period. Then, they're off to the next city.
• They sell you a 3-day "bootcamp" which is really a 3-day upsell to a more expensive product.
• They have no local support group - you're left to your local REIAs, BP, etc.
• They offer no financing to get you into their education
• They don't let you network with other investors at their free (marketing) events
• They don't let your record the material presented - you're left only to your own notes.

Renatus:

• Weekly Presentation is local by local investors speaking from their own experience. Some groups hold monthly workshops featuring a Renatus instructor for a day.
• There's nothing for sale at the weekly presentations, and the education is real - no selling allowed. Instructors must make at least $1M/yr doing what they teach.
• There are local Renatus groups in 11 major cities with more on the way, 5 in Metro Chicago alone. Recorded webinars are available as well.
• 100% acceptance financing is available with no credit check (20% down, 18% for three years). This can help you rebuild bad credit if you make timely payments. Other funding options are available, also, for those with income and qualifying credit.
• Networking is how we do business with each other and is always encouraged and enabled.
• Classes are available on-line 24/7 - you can repeat any class or portion of a class as many times as you want during your availability period. The top package provides lifetime access. Audio is downloadable and be kept.
• The Chicago Renatus group has study groups to help students understand their classes. Other groups and cities are following our lead.
  

If the moderators don't delete this post, I hope this helps clear up some of the confusion around this topic.