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All Forum Posts by: Craig S.

Craig S. has started 31 posts and replied 108 times.

Post: Outsource Property Management 40+ Units Multifamily

Craig S.Posted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Cleveland, OH
  • Posts 110
  • Votes 13

We currently own around 40 multifamily units in Northeast Ohio. They range from a few duplexes, to a few 6-plexes, to a 12 unit apartment. They are all within 1-2 minutes of each-other (walkable distance), and we are about 80% complete with large scale renovations at all properties, including HVAC, windows, roof, siding, common areas, interior apartments, etc. Very solid properties with strong rents in the market.

We self-manage these currently (and have built a brand around this) and initially had thoughts about continuing to build the property management brand to manage exclusively our own multifamily-focused investments as we grow. We like this model, because we are able to manage everything exactly the way we see fit, with high quality standards, and close attention to detail. Building solid residents, stable rent payment history, and low maintenance (especially due to all the updated renovations across the portfolio). That is what we have accomplished so far.

However, the challenge is that we feel somewhat "limited" or stuck in this cold weather market. We have been considering relocating our family to a warmer climate (Florida, Texas, Arizona, South Carolina, etc.) and that would present the challenge of determining the best bath of managing our investments. While we are still unsure about relocating, as we have debated for years--how we'd handle our real estate investments is an important question we'd have to address if we did make the move. There is always the option of selling and then reinvesting in the local market where relocate, however we have also spent a lot of time with the recent renovations of these buildings over the last ~2 years, they are high quality, stable, optimized investments that we don't just want to get rid of, as they are the ideal cashflow investment. So selling is not really something we are interested in as a "solution". Buy and hold was always the goal, and still is ideally.

So the options we are considering is to potentially acquire 20-ish more units (to make the math work with a salary) and hire a full-time property manager in-house and continue to manage "as-is" (so we'd have boots on the ground locally), or we could outsource all management to a 3rd party property management company. Outsourcing to a PM sounds like the path of lease resistance, but not without its own challenges.

PROS of Outsourcing:

  • Hands-off management
  • Don't have to worry about things like having to manage local staff (1 PM and 1 maintenance person) or possible employee turnover, which could create short to mid-term challenges to manage if we were living in another state and had to handle until a replacement was found
  • Ability to focus on growth and acquisitions and not daily management
  • Ability to be almost a fully "digital" operation rather than a "brick and mortar" management--although that sounds odd as real estate is very tangible and one of the reasons we initially focused on this asset

      CONS of Outsourcing:

      • Afraid PM company won't be as cost-conscious with managing expenses and especially repair/maintenance costs
      • Overall concern with PM keeping up on the condition and quality of buildings as they are now
      • General concern that maintenance, including preventative maintenance items, will be not kept up as we do now
      • Obviously the cost incurred to the PM company and mark-up to have them manage maintenance/repairs they generally charge
      • Our largest concerns mainly come down to how overall property maintenance, repairs, and larger capital expenses will be managed (i.e. what if there is a large flood on the 3rd floor apartment that floods down to the 1st floor, will a PM company be able to successfully remediate that in as least of time as possible and for the lowest cost?) That happened to us before, and was successfully managed.

      We aren't too concerned with managing the administrative part of the business remotely, as we use software for this (Buildium), and are already fully digital as much as we can be with e-leasing, maintenance requests online, emails, all electronic payments from residents, etc. However, making sure the maintenance and overall quality of the apartments are maintained as we do now (or close to) remains our biggest concern. We fear that we could move away, outsource to a PM company, and come back in 3-5 years with properties that seem neglected or run down, or simply not managed anywhere near the quality standards that we maintain today. We would obviously come back at least annually to check-in on the properties--but you get the point.

      While all of these are assumptions, and also concerns based on feedback I've read online over the years, I wanted to reach out and see if anyone could help share some of their experiences if you have went through something similar. I know several investors who buy out of state properties (often site-unseen) and outsource PM services (and "love it"), however many times they are not as concerned with the general quality and maintenance concerns, and are more focused on financials/performance. While I agree, bottom line profits are one of the most important aspects to be concerned with, also extremely important are well managed properties, good tenants, and managing the capital improvements/expenses and maintenance of buildings. If maintenance/capex isn't successfully managed, the long term cost of neglected or overlooked maintenance/capex can be equally as detrimental to long term profits.

      I'd be curious to see how other's have successfully outsourced to 3rd party property management services, what your experiences have been, and how to go about finding the right PM company. Using 3rd party PM services would allow us to be much more focused on our lifestyle, investing in properties and markets that made the most sense (even if we aren't physically located there), and could set us up to be a true "digital" operation, rather than boots on the ground based company. But quality in management and maintenance is something we don't want to sacrifice in the process.

      Post: Appliance Maintenance Service For Apartments?

      Craig S.Posted
      • Rental Property Investor
      • Cleveland, OH
      • Posts 110
      • Votes 13

      For any of you multifamily/apartment owners out there, how do you manage your appliance maintenance and service requests?

      I got into the multifamily space to manage apartments and not appliances, but I noticed a decent percentage of the service calls I have been getting are related to some sort of appliance issue (and my appliances are only 1-3 years old, nothing seems built well these days). I have a clause in my lease stating that the tenants are responsible for repair and maintenance of the appliances, however, I am not sure that is the best thing to do. I want my tenants to have a great experience with our brand, and making them buy or repair appliances that we (the landlord) own may not cater to the "full service" apartment management experience that we want to offer. We tell tenants that it is "worry free living" in that all the lawn, maintenance, snow management, etc. is included. If a refrigerator breaks down after 6 months of them living in the unit, I can see how someone may feel it is unfair to buy a new replacement at full price, but not own it themselves.

      So I started thinking about having a 3rd party company cover all the maintenance and repair of all appliances. I have coin-operated laundry machines that the laundry company services and maintains (causing no headache for me), so I thought maybe there was a company or service out there that can do something similar for the rest of the appliances in my units.

      Do any of you use a service like this or are aware of any companies that offer this type of appliance maintenance/service program? I'd like to have some type of company where I could simply put a sticker on the side of all appliances and the tenants would call that company directly for any type of issues, allowing me to completely outsource all appliance maintenance, so I can focus on the real estate business itself and growing/scaling, not refrigerator fan motors going out:)

      Let me know your thoughts!

      Post: Due Diligence Checklist For Multifamily Land Acquisition?

      Craig S.Posted
      • Rental Property Investor
      • Cleveland, OH
      • Posts 110
      • Votes 13

      Anyone?

      Post: How much to charge tenant for pet deposit fee?

      Craig S.Posted
      • Rental Property Investor
      • Cleveland, OH
      • Posts 110
      • Votes 13

      Hi @Mahauijue Mack,

      There have been many great replies here, but just wanted to add in one more for your consideration. I typically charge a one time $250 non-refundable pet FEE (not a deposit), plus $25 per month per pet. The $250 fee covers "up to 2 pets". My standard weight limit is 35 pounds per pet. I also have a list of "restricted breeds". If someone has a pet that is on my restricted breed list, then it is an automatic no-go. A German Shepard is currently on my list of restricted breeds FYI. However, lets say the dog was a Golden Retriever for sake of this conversation, however it was over my 35 pound weight limit (say it's 70 pounds). In this case, the dog is double my weight limit--so I would generally charge either double the monthly pet rent ($50/month instead of $25/month), or I might increase the one-time non-refundable pet fee from $250 to $500 for example. The thought here is that since the dog is double the size, it can do double the damage/wear and tear. Depending on the size/weight of the pet (if it is above my standard 35 lbs), I may charge a different fee, but regardless, if it is over my weight limit and I still want to consider it, I always charge more.

      Hope this helps.

      Post: Due Diligence Checklist For Multifamily Land Acquisition?

      Craig S.Posted
      • Rental Property Investor
      • Cleveland, OH
      • Posts 110
      • Votes 13

      Hello,

      I am interested in acquiring a parcel of land (3.4 acres) for a multifamily construction project. It is currently zoned multifamily with 27 total units density. I am interested in submitting an offer, or at least a letter of intent, to the property owner.

      This is my first raw land acquisition and I want to make sure I do proper due diligence before I proceed with an acquisition. Does anyone have a sample due diligence checklist of items I would need to verify before I submit a hard offer/purchase agreement? I know I need to verify sewer/utilities, easements, setbacks, soil feasibility, floodplain, density, zoning, etc. but I am not sure if that list is 100% comprehensive of what I should verify? I want to make sure I do a comprehensive review and verify all relevant items necessary before I pony up with a purchase.

      I have had a few conversations with people locally that say a Civil Engineer (there is a specific company I was referred to) that could likely do most of the research for me on the above-mentioned items/checklist. But, I wanted to check with some other professionals on BP to see if you could guide me in the right direction or confirm my thoughts on what I need to do for next steps. Again, just want to make sure I do a comprehensive due diligence check and am not missing something important.

      Any advice is greatly appreciated!

      Post: Do you accept cosigners and/or guarantors?

      Craig S.Posted
      • Rental Property Investor
      • Cleveland, OH
      • Posts 110
      • Votes 13

      @Jim Adrian, I totally agree with you on what a credit score is. My question was: Do you rely on a co-signer to relieve those concerns and essentially replace the tenants bad credit, or in what situations would you use/allow a co-signer? My questions here are not really around how to read a tenants ability to pay on their own, but more around what situations do you find a co-signer to be acceptable?

      You provided a good example whereas you have a minimum score standard regardless (500) and then you also look at a combination of a low score vs. bad debt. 

      Are there any situations where you would allow a tenant with a lot of debt AND a low score? Or is that basically a knockout for you and you need limited debt to qualify?

      Post: Do you accept cosigners and/or guarantors?

      Craig S.Posted
      • Rental Property Investor
      • Cleveland, OH
      • Posts 110
      • Votes 13

      Thanks for the replies everyone. I agree with the comments made, such as “If she’s can’t pay her bills why would she pay her rent?”  By looking at her credit report, it is clear to me she’d probably have issues paying her rent, but that’s where I didn’t know how much you all rely on a co-signer for. Do you only accept tenants if you “think” they can pay their bills and just as an extra safety precaution you get a co-signer? Or are there cases where you don’t think the tenant will be able to pay their bills (because their credit score/report is bad) so you allow a co-signer to fill that void? My thought is that if I don’t think a tenant can pay their bills all on their own, why would I want them living in my unit? However, I have not used co-signers before and was curious in what cases other experienced landlords would allow this.

      So basically the question is: do you use a co-signer as a replacement for bad credit, or only as an extra safety net in cases where the credit is marginal and you aren’t 100% confident in the tenants ability to pay rent on their own but you “think” they “should” be able to?

      Post: Do you accept cosigners and/or guarantors?

      Craig S.Posted
      • Rental Property Investor
      • Cleveland, OH
      • Posts 110
      • Votes 13

      Hi @Soh Tanaka,

      Thanks for the reply. Based on my potential tenants information I described (450 credit score, many collections accounts, late payments, etc. within her credit report) is this someone that you would turn away or allow a co-signer? The hard thing for me is that she makes six figures and everything else about her seems good but credit history looks horrible. 

      Post: Do you accept cosigners and/or guarantors?

      Craig S.Posted
      • Rental Property Investor
      • Cleveland, OH
      • Posts 110
      • Votes 13

      Hello,

      I am scaling my rental business and have previously not accepted any co-signers or guarantors simply because I didn't have enough units to fill and so I could afford to be more picky. However, as I have acquired more units and grown, I want to make sure I am not turning away too many people and leaving a unit vacant for too long because my rental standards are too strict.

      I would like to see how many of you accept co-signers/guarantors and in what situations? I would not consider a co-signer/guarantor if the primary tenant's income was insufficient or if they had other unfavorable traits that I thought they would be a disaster tenant living in the unit (like a prior eviction, criminal record, etc.) -- co-signers cannot help those things. I currently have a potential tenant who makes good income and everything seems good about her, however her credit score is horrible (about 450) and many derogatory credit accounts. She explained the story of how it happened due to a divorce, etc. however you never know what to believe.

      I am curious as to if you allow a co-signer/guarantor, or if you are more strict and simply have no exceptions. If you have 5 units or less, your opinion may not be as relevant to me because it is easy to be picky with few units. I guess I am interested to hear from people who either have experience managing or owning yourself more than 10 units and can understand my question from a scalability perspective. I am considering keeping my policy and not allowing co-signers/guarantors under any circumstances and just keep looking until I find a better tenant to meet my standards on their own. But I also don't want to walk away from potentially good tenants. At the same time, I have read many posts on BP regarding co-signers and there seems to be more bad than good.

      Looking forward to hear your thoughts, thanks!

      Post: Lease Agreement Question - New Property Purchase

      Craig S.Posted
      • Rental Property Investor
      • Cleveland, OH
      • Posts 110
      • Votes 13

      @Christopher Morin - I agree with you and I think I am ok to reduce term length assuming I have mutual consent. An attorney I talked to previously didn't have a firm answer on this, whether consideration required extending the term, or if term was irrelevant. His point was that since the tenant already has a lease on the unit, having them sign a lease with a shorter term may not be giving something of value, and thus not consideration. But he mentioned he was just being very cautious and didn't want to give me a firm answer without digging deeper--which is why I wanted to see if anyone else had ran into this question before.