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All Forum Posts by: Carlos Ptriawan

Carlos Ptriawan has started 84 posts and replied 7089 times.

Quote from @Cory J Thornton:
Quote from @James Hamling:

@Cory J Thornton at risk of being wrong, I'd say we are at the middle of the beginning of a paradigm shift. 

For generations, hell millennia, things operated on a simple system that there is some geographic feature, somewhere, that brings many together in 1 spot, that brings more, a city builds, grows, and get's to a size that a kind of "gravity" is made putting people and industry in a geographic "orbit" of that market center. 

But now.... 

COVID lockdown "crashed the system" so to say. And at exact same time forced the use of an alternative one, remote working. Dislocated staffing. And, very key, it forced it's use for an enduring time. So people and employers not only had to use it, they had to integrate it's use, get good at it, accept it into the fold. 

Than at same time we get massive social upheaval, which given population density was focused in those more dense populous areas. Social unrest, riots, lawlessness. Add to this all the social unrest and upheaval in school systems which again most prevalent in populous dense areas.... 

It's a "perfect storm" of factors all hitting together. 

Where a new paradigm seems to be coming to the front that "good old family living" is to be found in the satellite areas, a step beyond the traditional suburbs. That the "work life balance" is almost directly translating as a remote whatever working situation. 

Gov agencies keep integrating more and more with this. And the private sector fight against remote, that was a fart in the breeze for most part. People WANT remote working lifestyles. 

And this change of primary income requirements becoming transient, opens up a whole different world of how people locate themselves. 

I think we are very early in it. I think we only saw the first wave from this, and are now into consolidation and normalization, from which sustained growth will next come, if not already is here in early days of it. 

Where high speed internet exists, is now a viable living potential, and that's a LOT of places. 

before, there was a sizable cost to where one geographically located. We didn't just change that, we flipped it on it's head because if you can do a remote CA tech job, man-alive your going to be rewarded if live in a say a rural SD town. Like Living in South Africa but earning in dollars, currency conversion rich. 

This is very early to say but yes, I think one of the next "gold rush's" for investors is in the development/re-development of these communities. I don't know what to call them other than maybe a "Z-market" because it's really driving in power by the younger generations who are saying f-this to living by conventional "old" rules of things. 

MSA's still hold a gravity, but it's not what it once was, there is this force that now exists immune to such geographic gravity, if not working in reverse polarity to it.  

I don't see it changing back. I think we at the beginning. Remember when internet first came out (I just dated myself didn't I, lol). There was this big rush, then got real quiet. It's like the first "cool" rush of things, but then it took time for integration. And it was years, YEARS before it started getting to be something other then a novelty. And it's like I woke up one day and out of nowhere the internet was a requirement.... I see remote work going exact same way. And with it, housing location choice. 

Good schools, good internet, good food, good prices. I think that's the magic 4 factors. I know good food seems a bit weird, I think so, but it's what I see repeatedly in these "z-markets" forming. Apparently food is a really big deal to younger generations, I'm not sure they know stoves are for cooking not gadget storage, lol.  

@James Hamling I think you are correct. This is a great post reply! The hwy that allows access to rural communities will be improved rural internet and cell reception. I am seeing some restaurant operators open up locations in rural markets, and those eateries are doing well. 

Thank you for the thoughtfully constructed insights!

Discussed heavily here:
https://www.naiop.org/research-and-publications/magazine/202...  

Also looks like some cities are having different trajectory post-covid for urban vs suburban, in term of property value/demands:

Post: Hawaii or Florida

Carlos Ptriawan#1 Market Trends & Data ContributorPosted
  • Posts 7,162
  • Votes 4,416
Quote from @Henry T.:
Quote from @Elias Halvorson:
Quote from @Henry T.:

Hawaii - $17 for a gallon of milk. $10 loaf of bread. and very tenant friendly. Property taxes are relatively low. Nice beaches. High crime I think. Real estate seems to be its own market, unlike the rest of the US. For retirement, if you can afford it in a nice area, its hard to beat.

https://www.staradvertiser.com/2024/05/30/hawaii-news/honolu...    it’s safe I tell you! Lol

 Cool. look at all those people smiling. LOL. Those are the stories you get from a tourist mecca. I've lived there too.  Since Target arrived, you might be able to get milk cheaper.  It's ok, the place has its good and bad points.  I do like the beaches on weekdays around noon.


I am thinking of Househacking in multiple island  so I would not have issue with Airbnb STr regulation.

Post: Hawaii or Florida

Carlos Ptriawan#1 Market Trends & Data ContributorPosted
  • Posts 7,162
  • Votes 4,416
Quote from @Henry T.:
Quote from @Elias Halvorson:
Quote from @Henry T.:

Hawaii - $17 for a gallon of milk. $10 loaf of bread. and very tenant friendly. Property taxes are relatively low. Nice beaches. High crime I think. Real estate seems to be its own market, unlike the rest of the US. For retirement, if you can afford it in a nice area, its hard to beat.

https://www.staradvertiser.com/2024/05/30/hawaii-news/honolu...    it’s safe I tell you! Lol

 Cool. look at all those people smiling. LOL. Those are the stories you get from a tourist mecca. I've lived there too.  Since Target arrived, you might be able to get milk cheaper.  It's ok, the place has its good and bad points.  I do like the beaches on weekdays around noon.


 lol actual problem is for locals and kamaina that lived there  over generation, the problem is not the expensive milk but more like Midwest income with California spending 

Quote from @Corey Conklin:
Quote from @Jay Hinrichs:

I suspect one major issue is price point.  JOBS dictate population .. so if someone can remote work and wants to live in a rural setting sure.. Schools are another big issue.. and as we age availability to health care.. I personally have lived in both.. Town in Northern CA of 4k and of course SiliconValley ( Cupertino).  What I saw with the small town most kids cant wait to leave.. they get board in small towns jobs are not available schooling etc.. Then like you they tire of big city and want to go back to their roots.. Or they never want to go back to small town living. Its  all personal preferences   finances  etc etc.
Working remote is a huge increase in value for small town living no doubt. There are plenty of jobs in small towns. They struggle to find people just like cities do. Small towns still need mechanics, plumbers, engineers, lawyers, etc. 

I agree that it is purely a preference. If you want something you will figure out the job and finances. If there is a will there is a way and I'm noticing a lot of people are willing their way out of cities.

 something like cupertino is actually more like a suburban than a city. In general Jay is right. But yes Cupertino is special case, it's all because of one men who made the town so affluent (meant Apple). Area like Cupertino,Los Gatos to Stanford is just a shadow of the American economy where tech titans is just moving from one zip code to another zip code in one geographical area (like apple in cupertino to nvidia in santa clara), these companies make real estate skyrockets although, in term of statistic, the population is decreasing by a lot.  it's job that dictates everything, it's easy to see why most companies are willing to move to austin and midwest as well. highly educated parent that had excellent job they want the highest quality school as well (hence they want their kid to study at local cupertino HS)... it's just the same thought process that keep eventually real estate more expensive and city boundary is also expanding. 

I would not surprise if 20 years from now the border of Austin will also developing. Driving for one hour is nothing.

Quote from @Leonard Rybak:

Hi all,

   Trying to brainstorm if this is a good or terrible idea. I would love to spend my retirement in Florida.  I am debating if I should buy a decently priced home in Florida using a mortgage, rent it out as soon as possible, and have a tenant(s) pay down my mortgage until I am ready to move in and have the mortgage either paid down or nearly paid down. Do you guys think this is a decent idea, or disaster waiting to happen.

My concerns are that vacancies, forcing me to spend my own income to pay down my current residence and the florida home. Also, I am scared a tenant cant damage the home and leave it unappealing for me to move into....and lasty, taxes or insurance can grow out of proportion leaving me not wanting to move their in the future.  What are your thoughts? 


 Price may increase when we retire , I am thinking the same hence I am buying it now not when I am retiring.

Quote from @Jay Hinrichs:
Quote from @Carlos Ptriawan:
Quote from @Jay Hinrichs:
Quote from @Carlos Ptriawan:
Quote from @Jay Hinrichs:
Quote from @Carlos Ptriawan:
Quote from @Cory J Thornton:

I have been thinking through housing, affordability, and the effect on what until the last few years have been dead markets. Any home with a decent commute to a decent market is not affordable. 

Over the last few years, and even now, I am seeing investors put their capital to work in areas that locals have previously ignored. 

It begs the question, in order to afford a rent, afford an investment property, or a primary home, will price start pushing people to forget the first three rules of Real Estate (location, location, location)? 

As a local example, a recent study showing the migration patterns of folks leaving Raleigh, the #6 city most likely to pick up those residents was Rocky Mount NC. Five years ago, this was not the case and even three years ago people were still highly suspect of that area (myself included). Now I'm starting to see people push much further out to 3-4 layers away from primary job markets completely sacrificing location for cost of ownership or cost of living. 

What do y'all think?

Is this something anyone else is noticing and if it is a trend, is there anything that will make it a short lived thing or is it going to continue longer term?


 This is very common.
Lets say suburban purchased 50 miles radius outside of city center. Milleneal would purchase 75mile radius, rand 75-150 miles are areas where it's bought by genz. because of the disparity in buying power, people is buying even further and further away. That's good area to invest.


CA is the poster child for this.. Myself growing up in Cupertino CA  ( SF Bay Area Apple headquarters ) no one starting out could afford a home there on average incomes.

So buyers spread out to places no one would have bought say 10 years before that.. East Palo Alto
Richmond  Vallejo  Livermore and beyond to the central Valley and 2 hour commutes.

for 70% of the country there is no affordability issue.. houses can be bought even todays interest rates for the same basic cost as rent..  

these cities all have housing that is on public Sewer Water and police protection and houses can be bought that are liveable ( not brand new ) for 100k to 200k

1. Detroit
2. Cleveland
3. Columbus/ Dayton
4. Baltimore city
5. Toledo
6. KC  both KS and MO
7. St. Louis
8. Milwaukee
9. Chicago
10. Smaller towns in S Carolina and N. Carolina
11. Many Parts of semi rural FLA.
12. Jackson MS
13. Birmingham AL
14. Memphis
15. Indy

Etc. Etc.

And any Midwestern city under 100k pop.. Now the question becomes where will buyers want to live the inventory is there its the buyers that are choosing the more expensive areas.. A lot of that has to do with Schools And other Social benefits and concerns.  Folks that have good credit and jobs they are picky so thats why your seeing new construction sell so well also.

 yes and it's also the same phenomena in Asia too. Recently, there's been a study about this market where the new city is rising. I think if we want to keep track of it, follow the builders and where Starbuck is opening their new store. 

Also people that can't live in east palo alto/livermore they move to central valley, that itself is also causing price to rise.


yes simply cross the bridge from Singapore to Malaysia and you will encounter the same situation.

 In Asia this is more noticeable because of higher population growth and also population density. Some city has about 15K per Kilometer pop. density and compare to Austin (highest growth) with 3K per sqm. 

Singapore is special because they're adding the size of the land by doing a land reclamation project. Similar like Dubai/UAE. 

I think the city in TX would also develop much faster than CA because TX has more relaxing regulations to build houses.


there is absolutely no question that development can sprawl quicker and bigger in Texas with their current zoning laws and availability of land compared to CA.  and keep in mind So Cal and Nor Cal have very different development criteria etc.. much tougher in N.. Ca that So Ca generally speaking accept along the coast with the CA coastal commission

 yes these are interesting because, in Nor Cal case home is not affordable because of the strictest regulation while the population is decreasing (while money flowing is increasing). In most Asian cities people move to outskirts of the city simply because of population growth alone while regulation is the most liberal.

TX is  good balance with a good population increase and less strict regulation.

It seems any normal city in US within 1 hour from a major MSA with a price below 300k is where younger families is going to invest.

Quote from @Jay Hinrichs:
Quote from @Carlos Ptriawan:
Quote from @Jay Hinrichs:
Quote from @Carlos Ptriawan:
Quote from @Cory J Thornton:

I have been thinking through housing, affordability, and the effect on what until the last few years have been dead markets. Any home with a decent commute to a decent market is not affordable. 

Over the last few years, and even now, I am seeing investors put their capital to work in areas that locals have previously ignored. 

It begs the question, in order to afford a rent, afford an investment property, or a primary home, will price start pushing people to forget the first three rules of Real Estate (location, location, location)? 

As a local example, a recent study showing the migration patterns of folks leaving Raleigh, the #6 city most likely to pick up those residents was Rocky Mount NC. Five years ago, this was not the case and even three years ago people were still highly suspect of that area (myself included). Now I'm starting to see people push much further out to 3-4 layers away from primary job markets completely sacrificing location for cost of ownership or cost of living. 

What do y'all think?

Is this something anyone else is noticing and if it is a trend, is there anything that will make it a short lived thing or is it going to continue longer term?


 This is very common.
Lets say suburban purchased 50 miles radius outside of city center. Milleneal would purchase 75mile radius, rand 75-150 miles are areas where it's bought by genz. because of the disparity in buying power, people is buying even further and further away. That's good area to invest.


CA is the poster child for this.. Myself growing up in Cupertino CA  ( SF Bay Area Apple headquarters ) no one starting out could afford a home there on average incomes.

So buyers spread out to places no one would have bought say 10 years before that.. East Palo Alto
Richmond  Vallejo  Livermore and beyond to the central Valley and 2 hour commutes.

for 70% of the country there is no affordability issue.. houses can be bought even todays interest rates for the same basic cost as rent..  

these cities all have housing that is on public Sewer Water and police protection and houses can be bought that are liveable ( not brand new ) for 100k to 200k

1. Detroit
2. Cleveland
3. Columbus/ Dayton
4. Baltimore city
5. Toledo
6. KC  both KS and MO
7. St. Louis
8. Milwaukee
9. Chicago
10. Smaller towns in S Carolina and N. Carolina
11. Many Parts of semi rural FLA.
12. Jackson MS
13. Birmingham AL
14. Memphis
15. Indy

Etc. Etc.

And any Midwestern city under 100k pop.. Now the question becomes where will buyers want to live the inventory is there its the buyers that are choosing the more expensive areas.. A lot of that has to do with Schools And other Social benefits and concerns.  Folks that have good credit and jobs they are picky so thats why your seeing new construction sell so well also.

 yes and it's also the same phenomena in Asia too. Recently, there's been a study about this market where the new city is rising. I think if we want to keep track of it, follow the builders and where Starbuck is opening their new store. 

Also people that can't live in east palo alto/livermore they move to central valley, that itself is also causing price to rise.


yes simply cross the bridge from Singapore to Malaysia and you will encounter the same situation.

 In Asia this is more noticeable because of higher population growth and also population density. Some city has about 15K per Kilometer pop. density and compare to Austin (highest growth) with 3K per sqm. 

Singapore is special because they're adding the size of the land by doing a land reclamation project. Similar like Dubai/UAE. 

I think the city in TX would also develop much faster than CA because TX has more relaxing regulations to build houses.

Post: Hawaii or Florida

Carlos Ptriawan#1 Market Trends & Data ContributorPosted
  • Posts 7,162
  • Votes 4,416
Quote from @Eric Justice:
Quote from @Carlos Ptriawan:
Quote from @Eric Justice:
Quote from @Eric Justice:
Quote from @Elias Halvorson:
Quote from @Eric Justice:
Quote from @Elias Halvorson:
Quote from @Eric Justice:
Quote from @Elias Halvorson:
Quote from @Eric Justice:
Quote from @Elias Halvorson:
Quote from @Eric Justice:
Quote from @Elias Halvorson:

For me, when you factor in insurance, the FL market is just not where I want to be. I sold 4 cheap rentals in Gulfport/Buloxi this past year because I got sick of the hurricanes and carrying insurance pretty much eliminated almost all cashflow. 

Pay all cash? Where you gonna live braddah, Waianae? As you likely know, the average 3/2 here is $1.1M. I know you have a finance background and to each their own, but leveraging debt is a much faster way. 

Haha I looked on Zillow and saw some apartments  in Kailua for $135,000-$155,000. 

 Eric - Google Hawaii Leasehold properties. 

You’re referring to estates? 

 I’m not seeing any condos/townhomes for under 200k, but this townhome at just under 300k is a leasehold. https://www.redfin.com/HI/Kailua/539-Keolu-Dr-96734/unit-C/h...


 Oh, well I am seeing properties at the price. I’m not looking to lease. Thanks man! 


I think we are talking past each other. My point was You won’t find non-leasehold properties in Kailua for 133-150k. Period. Whatever you’re seeing for that price are Leasehold properties, not fee simple. 

Oh, I get what you’re saying now. If I pass for it with all cash, then it’s fee simple absolute. 

No, that's not what I mean. I'd encourage you to research leasehold properties. Bottomline you're buying the house/condo, but don't own the land. It doesn't matter if you pay all cash or get financing, a leasehold property is a leasehold property. You will have to pay the lease fee monthly as well as the mortgage, any taxes &insurance, as well as HOA/condo dues.

own the land too but it depends on the property type. 

Freehold interest


 Aren't you already live in Oahu ?


 No. 


Here's my take:
- The condo in FL Beach is suitable for people who live in the East Coast, especially financial pro.
The problem with the condo in FL is the HOA assessment/fee and property insurance.
- Hawaii in general is very suitable for people from the Bay Area or socal as there's only 2-3 hours time difference. When I wake up at 5am I can still attend meetings in the morning CA time.
- Hawaii property tax and insurance is considerably "okay"
- Each Florida city has its own different trajectory in terms of appreciation, but HI appreciation depends on island and the town.
- With most job now is being done remotely, especially in tech, Hawaii is becoming a viable choice.
- However, the thing that makes Hawaii very doable is that the cost of flying is cheap, from CA one way the cost is $90-$200 depending on the season. 
- Every Hawaiian Island is very different from one to another, and between towns is also a bit different. So it depends on what kind of lifestyle and vibes you want (or even what beach you want to see every day) . They have Waikiki for more "modern" Hawaii, rustic Kauai or very traditional Hawaiian fishing "village" like in Milo'ili.
- Some Hawaiian towns are quite affordable and the living cost is not much different than LA or Bay Area.

- But I think what makes the difference between Hawaii and Florida is that in Florida you still live in mainland.  This makes everything different especially for work and/or infrastructure considerations. Another thing that's also very different due to geographical location is the fertility of the land.......for me it's important. lol

Post: Hawaii or Florida

Carlos Ptriawan#1 Market Trends & Data ContributorPosted
  • Posts 7,162
  • Votes 4,416
Quote from @Eric Justice:
Quote from @Eric Justice:
Quote from @Elias Halvorson:
Quote from @Eric Justice:
Quote from @Elias Halvorson:
Quote from @Eric Justice:
Quote from @Elias Halvorson:
Quote from @Eric Justice:
Quote from @Elias Halvorson:
Quote from @Eric Justice:
Quote from @Elias Halvorson:

For me, when you factor in insurance, the FL market is just not where I want to be. I sold 4 cheap rentals in Gulfport/Buloxi this past year because I got sick of the hurricanes and carrying insurance pretty much eliminated almost all cashflow. 

Pay all cash? Where you gonna live braddah, Waianae? As you likely know, the average 3/2 here is $1.1M. I know you have a finance background and to each their own, but leveraging debt is a much faster way. 

Haha I looked on Zillow and saw some apartments  in Kailua for $135,000-$155,000. 

 Eric - Google Hawaii Leasehold properties. 

You’re referring to estates? 

 I’m not seeing any condos/townhomes for under 200k, but this townhome at just under 300k is a leasehold. https://www.redfin.com/HI/Kailua/539-Keolu-Dr-96734/unit-C/h...


 Oh, well I am seeing properties at the price. I’m not looking to lease. Thanks man! 


I think we are talking past each other. My point was You won’t find non-leasehold properties in Kailua for 133-150k. Period. Whatever you’re seeing for that price are Leasehold properties, not fee simple. 

Oh, I get what you’re saying now. If I pass for it with all cash, then it’s fee simple absolute. 

No, that's not what I mean. I'd encourage you to research leasehold properties. Bottomline you're buying the house/condo, but don't own the land. It doesn't matter if you pay all cash or get financing, a leasehold property is a leasehold property. You will have to pay the lease fee monthly as well as the mortgage, any taxes &insurance, as well as HOA/condo dues.

own the land too but it depends on the property type. 

Freehold interest


 Aren't you already live in Oahu ?

Quote from @Erica Calella:
Quote from @Matthew Gentile:
Quote from @Erica Calella:

I have an MBA and I work in Corporate Real Estate. It's helped me tremendously... just the case studies you cover alone are helpful in the corporate work environment. The only people who have ever told me that an MBA was a waste of time and money are the ones who never pursued one (I'm not exaggerating when I say that).

However I didn't pursue my MBA because I wanted to climb the corporate ladder. I was feeling stuck at the time and needed inspiration to help me "find my calling." My grad school experience did just that for me. My experience has also beneffited me as I embark on my personal real estate investment journey as well. My soft skills and ability to communicate and strategize on the fly have increased in ways I didn't think possible for me.

So yeah, 100% worth it if you can make it happen, but like anything else in life, you will only get out of it what you put it. Good luck!!


 Erica, that was my sentiment as well. 

I agree with everyone on pros and cons for sure. It's the only education I've been told is worth getting when conducting business in a W2 or entrepreneur. It opens up some doors and I think the cost with some online programs is not outrageous. I personally feel like it will only aid me and even if not at baseline the cost is off set by the open doors in my opinion. Thanks for sharing your story.

You're welcome!! As I read my post after sharing it, I realized that one thing my graduate degree did NOT help improve is my grammar.. haha :) 

 you have AI grammarly for that, no big deal lol