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All Forum Posts by: Bill Rich

Bill Rich has started 1 posts and replied 112 times.

Post: Conventional vs FHA

Bill RichPosted
  • Lender
  • Marlton, NJ
  • Posts 126
  • Votes 44

Wayne, yes the property may or may not be advertised as a HUD $100 down candidate you can very easily submit the offer making it a $100 down loan even when it's not marketed as such. I've done several times on HUD properties around the country with my mortgage clients. Sometimes the buyers agents aren't well versed on REO and that's where I can help from the mortgage side with buyers.

Post: Conventional vs FHA

Bill RichPosted
  • Lender
  • Marlton, NJ
  • Posts 126
  • Votes 44

Hi Jay

In my experience I can tell you this scenario screams 203k and that the seller needs to be educated on the loan options available. If indeed it is a HUD home it could be the asset manager that is making this go conventional for they are looking for a fast close. If it is a HUD sale it would be listed on the HUD HomeStore and there would be reasons why the financing type is selected. I have seen scenarios where they only will accept a conventional loan and then will allow it to be changed to renovation financing once it's confirmed by the inspector it needs to be a renovation loan (I know, it makes no sense but then again no one has ever accused the federal government of using common sense eithe lol).

One thing to note HUD also allows for $100 down versus the standard 3.5% thats required.

I licensed in Tennessee and would be happy to help your friend. 

Post: [Calc Review] Help me analyze this deal

Bill RichPosted
  • Lender
  • Marlton, NJ
  • Posts 126
  • Votes 44
Originally posted by @Dennis M.:

All the banks in northwestern pa I have contacted require 12 months . I know there are exceptions and I’ve heard people on here speak of 6 months but that’s not the norm I’m seeing . It is my understanding when a lender does 6 months they won’t offer the full arv only arv based on what it was purchased at .

 Dennis

If your having a hard time finding the financing you need give me a call. Mortgage guidelines allow for full cash out off of full appraised value after 6 months. 

Post: [Calc Review] Help me analyze this deal

Bill RichPosted
  • Lender
  • Marlton, NJ
  • Posts 126
  • Votes 44

@Joe White Thank you!

@Dennis M. the seasoning requirement is actually 6 months not 12 months, just an FYI

@Julie Tonioni unfortunately if you are indeed trying to pull additional cash out above and beyond what you purchased the home for then you would need to have owned the property for 6 months.  This is a Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac guideline and a guideline that 99% of the mortgage industry follows.  You can do delayed financing which allows you to recoup the money you put into the home for the purchase and rehab.  You can however start the application process, get everything in place (loan approval, appraisal etc) so that once the 6 month mark hits you can close immediately once the 6 month mark hits.  I have done this a few times for clients in this position in the past.  Essentially process the entire application and close on day 181 (6 months x 30 days = 180 days). I hope this helps a little and if you have any questions please feel free to reach out to me.  I am licensed in CT and would be happy to help you.  

Originally posted by @Shaun Weekes:
Originally posted by @Bill Rich:
Originally posted by @Shaun Weekes:
Originally posted by @Ana Coello:

Hi Isaac,

A 203k loan is a type of FHA loan. The great benefit of it is the low down payment of 3.5% but it does have the mortgage insurance premium that you have to add to your loan. Also, insurance rates tend to be higher for FHA loans than conventional loans.

You are also stuck with the private mortgage insurance forever on an FHA loan. The 20% down works on conventional loans only.

There are conventional rehab loans as well. We just got one. We pay 5% down and can get the pmi taken off after paying 20% down. The interest rate is higher than an FHA loan. It is also higher than a regular conventional loan. Since it is a REHAB loan you will pay the price. Good thing is that you can refinance out of it after 6 payments (check with your lender) into a loan with lower interest.

When we compared the 203k with a conventional rehab loan for the same amount of loan. We were able to have more money for the rehab with the conventional one and still stay at the same monthly payments. I would suggest working with a lender who does both and asking him/her to run both scenarios so you can see the breakdown of everything. 

This isn't 100% accurate. FHA and VA rates are always going to be lower than Conventional rates. When you add PMI then they tend to be higher. Also, FHA will allow PMI to be dropped after 11 years if you do the following. Put down more than 10% or have a loan that has a 15-year term or less.

It's imperative that you use a loan officer or broker that has experience in investment type loans and knows all the guidelines to give you the best and most accurate information.

FHA loans are expensive but in a lot of cases they out preform conventional loans because they're easier to qualify for, require less down payment. Now with 203K you must live in the unit as opposed to Fannie Mae Home-style where you can use this for investment purposes.

I hope this helps and have a good one.

I have to be honest with you Shawn, FHA rates are actually higher in most cases then that of conventional loans.

 When you look at the par rate for an FHA loan and Par rates for Conventional loans the lenders, we do business with have FHA rates lower. You're a lender so check out one of your favorite lenders and compare yourself. If you find a lender that has a higher par rate for FHA than their conventional rates send me over that rate sheet. I really would like to see it.

Now when you add UFMIP and Monthly MIP then it's a different story. But if you had a buyer that wanted to pay the Up-Front Mortgage Insurance Premium and put down 10% or more after 11 years based on Friday’s rates, they could have a rate of 3.375% on a 30-year fixed loan. Most people won't pay that 1.75% up front so this rarely happens.

I lend direct so I lend off my companies own rate sheets, and conventional rates are better for me.   Par rate for a 30 year fixed conventional is around 4.25%-4.375%.

Overall both the FHA 203K and the Fannie Mae HomeStyle are great programs. IMO one is not necessarily better than the other. Its really more about what is the best fit for the individual (credit score, DTI, down payment, etc.). One key thing that no one thinks about with FHA loans (all FHA loans, not just 203Ks) is the self-sufficiency rule, which applies to 3 and 4 family homes. In order to pass the self-sufficiency test, you'll need to prove that 75% of the rental income you're likely to receive (including the unit you would occupy) will exceed the full monthly mortgage payment. That means calculating both the monthly rental income and the monthly mortgage payments.

In order to figure out the numbers, you’ll first need to get an appraiser to value the rental potential of the property at market rates. In other words, the appraiser will tell you how much rent you can expect to charge at the going rate (not at historical or actual rates).

Even more critical than the appraisal, however, is the loan calculation. In fact, correctly calculating the cost of the loan is the single most important step in the qualification process, determining how much the FHA will be willing to cover and, therefore, how much you will be able to finance.

Included in that monthly mortgage calculation are the following costs:

  • Principal
  • Interest
  • Taxes
  • Mortgage insurance
  • Homeowner’s insurance

At the end of the day, your loan officer should be able to crunch these numbers properly to ensure you do not find yourself in a bad situation. You will be amazed at how many FHA experts do not know about this rule and it comes to light AFTER the contract has been written, monies paid for inspections and appraisal completed.

Originally posted by @Shaun Weekes:
Originally posted by @Ana Coello:

Hi Isaac,

A 203k loan is a type of FHA loan. The great benefit of it is the low down payment of 3.5% but it does have the mortgage insurance premium that you have to add to your loan. Also, insurance rates tend to be higher for FHA loans than conventional loans.

You are also stuck with the private mortgage insurance forever on an FHA loan. The 20% down works on conventional loans only.

There are conventional rehab loans as well. We just got one. We pay 5% down and can get the pmi taken off after paying 20% down. The interest rate is higher than an FHA loan. It is also higher than a regular conventional loan. Since it is a REHAB loan you will pay the price. Good thing is that you can refinance out of it after 6 payments (check with your lender) into a loan with lower interest.

When we compared the 203k with a conventional rehab loan for the same amount of loan. We were able to have more money for the rehab with the conventional one and still stay at the same monthly payments. I would suggest working with a lender who does both and asking him/her to run both scenarios so you can see the breakdown of everything. 

This isn't 100% accurate. FHA and VA rates are always going to be lower than Conventional rates. When you add PMI then they tend to be higher. Also, FHA will allow PMI to be dropped after 11 years if you do the following. Put down more than 10% or have a loan that has a 15-year term or less.

It's imperative that you use a loan officer or broker that has experience in investment type loans and knows all the guidelines to give you the best and most accurate information.

FHA loans are expensive but in a lot of cases they out preform conventional loans because they're easier to qualify for, require less down payment. Now with 203K you must live in the unit as opposed to Fannie Mae Home-style where you can use this for investment purposes.

I hope this helps and have a good one.

I have to be honest with you Shawn, FHA rates are actually higher in most cases then that of conventional loans.

Post: Any cons to using 203k Loan?

Bill RichPosted
  • Lender
  • Marlton, NJ
  • Posts 126
  • Votes 44
Originally posted by @Nate Bell:

@Bill Rich, I went through the 203K process 8 years ago, I’m doing another one now, and what he is saying was/ is true for me. The lenders are detached from the process, contractors need to be paid, and the owner ends up making up the difference. And, yes, if you don’t have a dumpster or doorknob accounted for, it’s an out of pocket cost, or a bunch of paperwork. Anyone entering a 203K should have 20% of the project cost available to spend at will and the MAY get it back as a change order at the end.

Hi Nate 

I am sorry that your experience has been less then excellent. Unfortunately there are lenders out there who do not take a hands on approach to these loans AFTER closing. Its important to work with a lender who handles the entire process in-house and one who understands the complexity of the loans and has the know-how to complete the project, not just get the loan closed. For example my team actually handles the draws and works with the the borrower (you), the GC and HUD consultant (when there is one) from the beginning until the very end. My draw admin sits right next me so I know that we handle this the proper way. If you ever have any questions please let me know. If you are already working with a lender and have closed I wont be able to help too much because you are unfortunately stuck with how they process the draws.

Post: Any cons to using 203k Loan?

Bill RichPosted
  • Lender
  • Marlton, NJ
  • Posts 126
  • Votes 44

@Account Closed actually with a 203K you are required to have begun the work within 30 days of closing and you are required to have it completed within 6 months of closing. FHA will grant extensions due to extenuating circumstances.

Post: Any cons to using 203k Loan?

Bill RichPosted
  • Lender
  • Marlton, NJ
  • Posts 126
  • Votes 44

@Brunno Goncalves I have to be completely honest, your lender is not being true to the loan. At no time ever should you be paying money upfront as the borrower.....EVER.  This is not how the 203K or HomeStyle work.  We do not allow the borrower to pay anything upfront for we facilitate a draw when funds are needed.