All Forum Posts by: Andy Sturm

Sue I completely agree with your logic. I believe I will probably lean more towards Marks suggestion though. I feel I have no ground to stand on, so if i were to say we need to write up a new lease agreement that has a higher rent and no longer includes water she doesnt have to sign it. Then it really shows her she is in control. I dont think I have ground to evict her either so I have no real threat. She has about 7 months left on her lease. We are going to reduce her rent by $10 a month, because we can control rent but cannot control the water cost and billing. Hopefully this will make her feel good like she got something but we didnt give up too much. After her lease is up we will then correct the lease errors and resign if there has been zero issues since this. If there is anything else we will not resign and have her move out. 

I have done it with multi families. It is going to be based a lot on how your water provider bills you. They may install and read the meter for you if you install all the water lines. Our provider bills quarterly and the landlord is responsible for water. Tenants can receive courtesy bills in a single family that they pay but if they choose not to its on the landlord. Ill tell you how it worked for me.

Im from Cincinnati The utility company will only read their meter, so what we have to do is install sub meters after their meter. Check out Neptune Water Meters online, I use a Neptune T-10. It has the ability to have a thing called a touch pad sensor attached to it. This sensor is then hooked up on the outside of the home so a meter reader can read the meter without having to enter the property. A lot of times this sensor is sold with the meter. you can also physically read the meter. It has a dial on it similar to a cars odometer measured in cubic ft or gallons.

We have a company called Guardian water and power read our meters. They read the meters monthly, generate a bill, and mail it to the tenant. They dont actually collect the payment, but in the bill it tells the tenant they can mail theyre payment to our business address. Since we are responsible the tenant pays us and then we pay the water provider. This is not something we actually profit from. Guardian may not be in your area, but there might be a company like it.

The thing I would suggest is making sure your lease states that theyre responsible to pay the water bill and what specific repercussions are if they dont. 

The rest is just running water lines from the meter to your fixtures. This may be complicated and/or expensive but it self explanatory.

If your water provider will install and read an additional meter thats great. I would start with a call to them to help outline your next steps. Hope this helps!

The utility company wont install additional meters and doesn't read sub meters. Thats why we had to install our own sub meters and pay a company to read them and generate the bill. I didn't mention it but that $4.80 includes them going to the properties, reading the meters, generating bills, and sending them to the tenant. I thought that was a pretty inexpensive service.

I have used the hydro Jet multiple times. It is like a pressure jet that sprays in a cone inside the drain line. It can really tear through the roots. Have this done along with routine (every 6 months) preventative rootx. They jet and confirm the pipe is clear with a camera. Cost about $400 for the jet and camera but its totally worth it. Buy rootx online its not cheap and a plumber will up charge you. online its $25-$50 plumbers going to charge you $100 to put it in. Which consists of pouring it down a toilet and flushing. Good luck.

I have a 2 family that all the utilities have been sub metered so each tenant can be billed based on their individual consumption. The water provider will not read and bill sub meters. Therefore, we have a main meter that we as the landlord get billed for from the water company. We sub metered after the main meter for each unit. A private company reads the meters monthly and bills the tenants for us. The tenants pay us for the water not the company reading the meters and billing them, because we are the ones actually paying for their usage. They offer the service of receiving and distributing payments, but only if you have 27 or more units with them. 

One of the tenants has an issue with this. They want to be billed quarterly instead of monthly like the water company bills us. The company who reads the meters charges a fee of $4.80 to read the meters, that cost gets put on the tenant which she doesn't like. We also put a late fee of $10 if she is late. This is more than the water company would charge us if we were late and we have less opportunities to be late since we are billed quarterly. 

Submetering was new to us at this time and there is nothing written in her lease about her being responsible for the water bill. It was just set up just like you would set up utilities in a single family home. She just has realized she is sending the bill to the landlords and not a utility company and it has put a bad taste in her mouth. I believe she feels we are some how benefitting or making a profit which we are not. It ends up a wash every quarter.

Has anyone had any experience like this with a tenant? Im sure it would be helpful to have these things outlined in the lease but we do not. If she were in a single family and didn't pay her bill once the utility company would put a work order out to have the water shut off.  After three months could I begin to send her notices and shut her water off if she chooses not to pay? Can I evict her over not paying the water since it doesn't say in the lease I am paying for it or she is paying for it. Is there even grounds for eviction or do I actually have nothing and if she didn't want to pay the water bill, she doesn't have to? I have to continue to pay the bill because the other unit is on the same main meter. I could shut her unit off individually but Im pretty sure its illegal to just shut her water off even if she wasn't paying us for her portion. 

What I am looking for is some firm ground to stand on to push back a little on her. If I can evict her thats great. I dont plan on pursuing that, but at least I have some recourse.

Older homes especially in that time frame are most likely going to have stone foundation that leaks. This is very normal and even though it leaks it potentially is still fine. Also it is old enough that as long as you keep the gutters clean it will have settled all it is going to settle. Structurally old homes are very solid. The issue is going to be the plumbing drain lines and electrical. You may have some old knob and tube wiring. Even if the panels have been updated other wiring around the house may still be old. Get into the attics and pop off some cover plates on exterior walls to see what the wiring is like. Drain lines if they havent been replaced could be cast iron which cracks easy over time. You can usually have a plumbing company comer with a camera to check out the drain lines. If there is roots or clogs they can use a pressure jet to unclog the lines. Works well. Good luck with property!

If its not a high end unit a minimum approach would be to paint the wall with an oil based gloss paint. Its a very durable paint that can be cleaned easily.

If the tub spout has fine pressure it will most likely be sediment build up in the shower head. You can easily replace or clean it. If the tub spout is also having pressure issues it is going to be an issue with the valve/stems of the fixture. The stems and valves also may need to be removed, cleaned, and washers or O-rings replaced. Either way a professional will most likely be able to solve the issue without tearing open walls. It may be worth it to hire someone. The things I have suggested shouldn't take a plumber over an hour to address and solve.

Also if there is a pipe broken underground the leak would have to be after the meter for the water company to bill you for it. If the meter is in the house and the pipe is broke under the yard your meter wont be reflecting that leak. There are definitely meters in the ground in the front yard for example where the length after the meter to the house could leak and you would be billed for that.

Try just contacting the water supply company to understand why the bill is so high rather than just taking his word for it. Have them confirm the meter is working properly. You can compare the amount of gallons they're charging you for to what your meter actually reads. maybe there was a meter reading error. Your toilet leak could have potentially gotten worse but since you're used to it leaking you didn't notice. Good luck!