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All Forum Posts by: Amy Hu

Amy Hu has started 26 posts and replied 111 times.

Post: Recommendations: Cleveland MFU Areas/Realtors

Amy HuPosted
  • Investor
  • Thousand Oaks, CA
  • Posts 126
  • Votes 47
Originally posted by @P.J. Bremner:

@Ahmad Kakar  It really depends on the strategy you are looking to deploy.  When I first started buying MFH in the Cleveland area, I only looked at B class areas and up.  As an out-of-state investor myself, my primary concern was getting an asset that would be steady/stable and had decent cash flow.  The numbers for Cleveland are very attractive on paper, but without the team or experience in place, I felt like my odds of losing my investment were much higher and decided to look at suburbs of Cleveland where cash flow is a bit less, but far safer.  Here are the areas that I personal look at on a daily basis:

Lakewood, Shaker Heights, Cleveland Heights, Parma, Berea, South Euclid.

I look in the other areas as well, but I'm MUCH more cautious.  When I see a property profile and the school districts are shown as 1 out of 10 for K-12, I slow down and look for reasons not to buy.  As the saying goes, "It's better to miss out on a good deal than close on a bad one".

I hope this helps!  As for the realtor reference, I'll be more than happy to share who I use.  I've had to fire 3 agents in the span of a year since I started investing out there and I must say, having a bad agent upfront can cost you tens of thousands of dollars, even at $100k price point.  I've bought 3 MFH so far and in contract for my 4th and finally found an awesome pair of agents that work together.  Make sure you get good references and be aware of any bias (people who personally benefit from you using their reference specifically).

agree with your strategy. better safe than sorry.

Shaker/cleveland heights have very high tax

mind sharing your realtor? thanks

Post: "real estate professional" designation

Amy HuPosted
  • Investor
  • Thousand Oaks, CA
  • Posts 126
  • Votes 47
Originally posted by @Jim Kennedy:

@Stephen Sawrie

I know, and I'm about to share, a LOT about this and how it is good for you. I have more than a dozen years of experience with real estate professionals under Internal Revenue Code section 469.  I spent time working at the Internal Revenue Service first as a tax examiner, then in the Criminal Investigation Division, where I learned to read and understand the tax code. Also, I am a CPA whose firm prepares hundreds of tax returns for real estate investors annually including real estate professionals. I myself am the investor/owner/operator along with my wife of residential and commercial properties in NJ and until recently, Texas, two. Anyway, here is where the benefits of being a real estate professional outweigh the risks and the labor involved:.

Before I give an example of where these rules really help, I wanted to review the rules of what you stated. You are correct in that you must work more than 750 hours a year, which is about 15 hours a week, but in addition you must spend more than 50% of your time performing real estate. For example, I had a client who worked 20 hours a week loading and unloading trucks at FedEx, and she managed eight properties full-time. She got audited, and we used her log to document that she spent more than 1092 hours a year, which is 21 hours a week for 52 weeks to year. I instructed her, like all clients in this category, to book the entire years worth of time, which ended up being closer to about 1600 hrs. She did it, but she wasn't happy about all the work until she learned why: the auditor studied the log and began to challenge some of the line items, and began to hack away at the hours to try to get it below 750. The auditor failed. She identified about 160 hours that she wanted to disqualify, but we were so way over 750. I could've spent hours arguing that they were all bona fide, but rather than run the bill up, I said, "okay, go ahead." When the auditor did that, my client was still well over the amount required.

So here is an example of where the code section 469 regulations work to the taxpayers advantage: my client, "Tom"  is a full-time real estate investor. By taking advantage of the loopholes that I taught him about cost segregation and component appreciation, every year his 30 or so rental properties generate a $48,000 loss. Because he is a full-time real estate investor, is not passive, this is how he feeds his family, so the risk of gain or loss is recognized in the current year. Yes, I enter a$48,000 loss for him and I'm comfortable with it. Why? I'm glad you asked. Here's why:

There is about $60,000 of depreciation in that $40,000 loss. Remember, depreciation is a paper expense – you don't really write a check for it. So as an IRS auditor, I wonder where the money comes from to pay the bills (follow the cash, follow the cash, follow the cash). If you take that $48,000 loss, and add back to $60,000, you are at positive $12,000, or $1000 per month. It passes the smell test with flying colors.

This is just background, though. Here's the payoff. Tom slips two houses a year and makes 70 or $80,000 of taxable gain. When you take that $80,000 of gain, and offset it with the $48,000 of deductible rental losses, it leaves him with $22,000 of taxable income. His itemized deductions and his dependency exemptions for his wife and daughter and up zeroing out his tax liability completely.

Think about that for a minute: this guy makes $80,000 of cash profit for two flips and pays no income tax on it whatsoever. Not a bad lifestyle!

What if he gets audited? I know he's a target, so I showed him how to keep an investors log to document his time spent, and he books his time, day by day, property by property, 15 min. by 15 min. I suggested he buys some tax deductible speech recognition software, and as he makes his notes thru the course of the day, he later dictates them into a gigantic word document, when he gets home and at the end of the year he sends it to me along with his tax information that he e-mails up. He lives in Florida, and I am located in southern New Jersey. 

And, for the record, to further tighten down the documentation and decrease his risk of negative audit outcomes, he uses a list that I provided him of 64 things that are personal property upon which we celebrate the depreciation. Each one of these things is fully substantiated by a private letter ruling, a revenue ruling, regulation section, or a court case.

Is it a lot of work for him? He hates recordkeeping, but keeps his log religiously because he knows it will save income tax on $70-80,000 every year. This will be his 11th year of filing like this with me, and there's been no audits by the IRS by correspondence or by personal visit. being prepared ahead of time? It's just one of the things that I hammer away with all the time, not just in real estate or tax planning but in all phases of my life: the 5P's of the Marines teach us "prior planning prevents poor performance"

I have other clients who are real estate professionals, and the more properties you have, the bigger the loss you can legitimately generate.Hope that helps.

Jim Kennedy

Thanks Jim! 

This is really helpful! mind sharing what speech recognition software?

Post: Real Estate Professional - how to achieve 750 hours?

Amy HuPosted
  • Investor
  • Thousand Oaks, CA
  • Posts 126
  • Votes 47
Originally posted by @Steven Hamilton II:

Johann Jells,
Matt Devincenzo,
Aaron Mazzrillo, License is irrelevant.
Tin Lam,
J Scott.
Dave T,
Jon Klaus,

A license is irrelevant. I have represented many clients before who were audited due to RE professional. You have to be putting in the hours. There are MANY part time realtors who hold a license just for convenience.

A LOG IS A MUST!! With Google Calendar, and a call track program that can save you a ton right there. Every phone call I receive or am on it put on my calendar automatically.

-Steven

Mind sharing what call track program do you use or recommend? thanks

Post: How to put 750 hours to qualify as real estate pro for tax

Amy HuPosted
  • Investor
  • Thousand Oaks, CA
  • Posts 126
  • Votes 47
Originally posted by @Carl Fischer:

@Amy Hu

Do you have a website? Do you keep a log of your hours? Do you have any business licenses? Are you deducting a home office? Do you have office/business expenses? South reimbursement? Business credit cards? Business cards?  Travel expenses to out of state properties? Real estate license as mentioned would also help. Irs wants documentation. If you go to court can you prove you have a business and how many hours you work in it. Managing a PM is work in many cases. Document what you do and talk to your accountant. @Brandon Hall is a national cpa that works primarily with real estate investors check with him. I don’t think it will be that hard. 

Thanks Carl. Very helpful suggestions.

I'll log my hours. It'll be way more than 750 hours this year. I'll also keep all communication, documents, travel expenses, purchase records.

I'm trying to find specific instructions on what qualifies IRS' time requirement. No results found through Google research.

I'd appreciate any help on this.  Some items I think should qualify, such as:

time spent monitoring rehab progress/talking to contractor

time spent talking to vendors & placing orders

time spent talking to PM/CPA/attorney regarding my properties;

time spent reviewing statements/invoices

time spent preparing mortgage application,  tax filing

time spent writing contracts with contractors, PM, equity partners etc

Some items I'm not sure. Do they count?

1. Time spent visiting properties for acquisition

2. time spent talking to agent/broker about potential acquisition/sale

3. time spent talking to lender on funding deals

4. time spent raising private money to fund deals

5. time spent interviewing contractors/PM/CPA/attorney/inspector

6. time spent communicating with equity partners

I also feel research for potential acquisition should count. It's a pity IRS doesn't allow!

Post: How to put 750 hours to qualify as real estate pro for tax

Amy HuPosted
  • Investor
  • Thousand Oaks, CA
  • Posts 126
  • Votes 47
Originally posted by @Steven Hamilton II:
Originally posted by @Amy Hu:

My husband is working full time. I'm housewife taking care of our child and rental properties.

We have 5 SFR and one apartment building out of state, managed by PM. We bought the apartment building vacant last year and since then put a lot of money in it for rehab. last year we had $78k passive loss. Our AGI is over 150k.

I put a lot of time managing the rehab. Also I'm planning to partner up with friends to acquire more rental properties. 

But what counts into that 750 hours? It seems that researching for properties doesn't count. What about time spent seeking investor as syndication sponsor? time spent selling property?

Will it help if I get real estate license and practice as agent in my state? thanks

 If you bought it vacant, then many of the expenses may have in fact been acquisition costs to be added to basis or depreciated separately. 100% bonus depreciation was available on certain improvements or items PURCHASED AND PLACED IN SERVICE after 9/27/17.

The 750 have to be in Development or redevelopment, Construction or reconstruction, acquisition or conversion, rental, management or operation, leasing, brokerage. You have to spend more than 50% of your time in in the real property business and spend at least 750 hours in real estate. 

Many do not qualify and having a PM does not help your case.

You may want to read up on IRC 469 and review the IRS's Audit Technique guide. https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-mssp/pal.pdf

thanks. I'll read. 

Post: How to put 750 hours to qualify as real estate pro for tax

Amy HuPosted
  • Investor
  • Thousand Oaks, CA
  • Posts 126
  • Votes 47
Originally posted by @Wayne Brooks:

Yep, was thinking the same thing......”bought a vacant building....$78k in passive losses”—those repair costs aren’t currently deductible, get added to the basis.

78k is passive loss, rehab cost 200k+, also loss carried from previous year

gonna find a way to qualify

Post: How to put 750 hours to qualify as real estate pro for tax

Amy HuPosted
  • Investor
  • Thousand Oaks, CA
  • Posts 126
  • Votes 47

My husband is working full time. I'm housewife taking care of our child and rental properties.

We have 5 SFR and one apartment building out of state, managed by PM. We bought the apartment building vacant last year and since then put a lot of money in it for rehab. last year we had $78k passive loss. Our AGI is over 150k.

I put a lot of time managing the rehab. Also I'm planning to partner up with friends to acquire more rental properties. 

But what counts into that 750 hours? It seems that researching for properties doesn't count. What about time spent seeking investor as syndication sponsor? time spent selling property?

Will it help if I get real estate license and practice as agent in my state? thanks

Post: Saving You Some Time: MultiFamily Millions by Lindahl Boot Notes

Amy HuPosted
  • Investor
  • Thousand Oaks, CA
  • Posts 126
  • Votes 47

well done! Thanks for sharing

Post: I am looking for property management software.

Amy HuPosted
  • Investor
  • Thousand Oaks, CA
  • Posts 126
  • Votes 47
Originally posted by @Jorge Garifuna:

My wife and I have been self-managing for about 3 years from a google sheet that I created and have improved over time. 

We currently have about 8 properties and each property has its own tab to track income and expenses. There is a dashboard tab to see the most relevant information about each unit from a single section, along with color-coded current rental status with yearly summaries. 

There are also tabs to manage issues, leases, marketing and city charges among other things. 

I am a software developer by profession and most of my real estate investment fund comes from creating enterprise and web applications for well known companies as a consultant. 

I currently run 3 cash flow positive businesses from google sheets and one more that will start producing within 6 months. This last one is a long term project that takes 3 years to become cash flow positive. 

The reason I run these businesses from google sheet is because they work for me and is fast to make changes as I learn about the businesses that I try. 

I've thought about creating a webapp out of the real estate google sheet I've been using for 3 years. Some reasons I haven't done it yet: 1) my existing process works great for my purpose and cash is flowing in. 2) When I semi-retire in a few years, I'd like to have the flexibility to either hand over the property management function to another company or relocate to anywhere in the world without having tp worry about paying web hosting fees. 

I recognize that with only 3 years of experience in real estate investment, there's still so much more to learn about the business. My only strategy so far has been to buy and hold and cash flow from day 1 and from reading your posts here, there are many other ways to go about doing this and I'm more than willing to keep learning. 

If this community feels that there are pain points in the property management software out there and is willing to provide desired requirements to ease the pain, I could consider putting the software together that would benefit most as long as there is enough support :)

If this concept generates enough interest, we could probably start by doing a google hangout to showcase what I have now, while gathering your feedback to tweak the process so that we're all in the same page before developing the first version of the webapp(not google sheet). After the first version is released, you get to try it to see how it works for your case and provide feedback for the next iteration of the software. The idea would be to have a piece of software that easily helps in most cases, while quickly iterating to improve on those things that are needed. 

I'm interested in your google sheets or webapp. Please keep me updated

Post: LA/CLE Casual Meet Up at EP/LP

Amy HuPosted
  • Investor
  • Thousand Oaks, CA
  • Posts 126
  • Votes 47

keep updated pls.