Roofstock review. NEWBIES BEWARE!!

[JC Wu]

Looks like most of the reviews or case studies on Roofstock are about the closing process. I suppose since the vast majority of investors who’ve purchased properties from Roofstock use the properties as buy-and-hold rentals and Roofstock is a start-up that hasn’t been around for long, not a whole lot of investors have sold those properties. I got burnt on my way out when I tried to sell one acquired through Roofstock, which I’ve only kept for ~1.5 years. I wasted a lot of time and lost over 30K from this property. The only thing I gained is increased cancer risks from all that stress.

The short version of what happened:

A local flipper I befriended pointed out a serious undisclosed permitting issue he discovered from public record, which compelled me to sell the property at a discounted price to a local wholesaler instead of keeping it as a rental or selling on the MLS. The Roofstock inspection report made no mention of this issue. I have strong reasons to believe the seller chose not to disclose intentionally.

Due to the way the Roofstock purchase and sale agreement was drafted and certain provisions in Roofstock's Terms&Conditions that investors have to agree to but few actually read before using their website, the seller and Roofstock are well protected from liabilities, much better than a seller and brokers would in a typical MLS transaction scenario. As a result, I have very limited ways or no way of recourse.

Combined with some other things that have happened and my interactions with Roofstock, I feel that buying properties from Roofstock is like buying properties without a buyer’s agent, their “one stop for all” business model is inherently flawed, and the water is too deep for newbie buyers. The increased efficiency is achieved at the cost of buyers' best interests. 

Furthermore, despite Roofstock’s effort to find top providers to work with their investors, it looks like Roofstock struggles to bring all of them up to standards and keep them in check. The quality of service from different providers (title companies, PMs, inspectors) swing so widely that the good ones exceed my expectations, and the bad ones make me wonder how they stay in business or why hasn’t got taken out by the FTC. I’ve dealt with just as many bad ones as the good ones. In some cases, buyers have the options to pick the ones they prefer; in other cases just a hit or miss.

Last but not least, Roofstock advisors' excellent work ethics can’t compensate for their lack of knowledge of the local markets. On the other hand, lots of the sellers are institutional investors or local RE professionals, which inevitably shifts even more risks to newbie buyers.

This is a 1-star review for newbie buyers; 3-star review for seasoned buyers who know what to watch out for when evaluating deals; 5-star review for sellers, especially those who want to evade scrutinization from shrewd local brokers and failure-to-disclose-property-defects lawsuits.

Well, since I rate Roofstock 5 stars for sellers, why don't I just list it for sale on Roofstock? The simple answer is that the actual market rent ($900-965/mo) to list price ratio (ARV 120 -140K) would not be enticing to SFR buyers. The market rent Roofstock gave ($1025/mo) when I made the purchase was inflated btw.

I can post a long version to elaborate on the above-mentioned points if more than 10 people on BP are interested to know more. 

[JC Wu]

@Account Closed

It's interesting that both of you brought up notes. I've been investing in loans on Equity Multiple, which is a commercial RE crowdfunding site. I picked the short term ones (hold period < 1.5 yrs). Equity Multiple has a good track record and they seem to do a superb job at underwriting deals. The interest rates are around 10%. The deals are backed by collateral. So far so good. I get to invest alongside experienced institutional investors and a bunch of other retail investors. Completely hands off and skipping the "dirty" people. 

I realized that owning residential rentals isn't exactly a passive investment, even with property managers. Unfortunately, the PMs too often fall into the "dirty" people category. 

Doesn't have to be the Jacksonville market. It's just that I've already established good working relationships with some people in Jacksonville that I know are reliable. I can definitely enter other markets, it's just gonna take some extra digging and research to find the good ones to work with. 

A chunk of my assets is under Merrill Lynch management. My advisory team is great; they even got on a Forbes list last year. But the thing is, I don't want to completely rely on other people to manage my money, so I've been experimenting with a bunch of alternative investments, including some exotic ones, like marine vessel acquisition, law firm financing, lawsuit pre-settlement advances, etc. 

[Jay Hinrichs]

Originally posted by @JC Wu:

@Account Closed@Jay Hinrichs

It's interesting that both of you brought up notes. I've been investing in loans on Equity Multiple, which is a commercial RE crowdfunding site. I picked the short term ones (hold period < 1.5 yrs). Equity Multiple has a good track record and they seem to do a superb job at underwriting deals. The interest rates are around 10%. The deals are backed by collateral. So far so good. I get to invest alongside experienced institutional investors and a bunch of other retail investors. Completely hands off and skipping the "dirty" people. 

I realized that owning residential rentals isn't exactly a passive investment, even with property managers. Unfortunately, the PMs too often fall into the "dirty" people category. 

Doesn't have to be the Jacksonville market. It's just that I've already established good working relationships with some people in Jacksonville that I know are reliable. I can definitely enter other markets, it's just gonna take some extra digging and research to find the good ones to work with. 

A chunk of my assets is under Merrill Lynch management. My advisory team is great; they even got on a Forbes list last year. But the thing is, I don't want to completely rely on other people to manage my money, so I've been experimenting with a bunch of alternative investments, including some exotic ones, like marine vessel acquisition, law firm financing, lawsuit pre-settlement advances, etc. 

 you may want to consider investing then with some of the known top shelf syndicators if you want cash flow real estate. trying to buy low to mid range rentals probably not your bag.. it will be what it is.. inconsistent and for someone like you that is pretty detailed probably not an appropriate investment vehicle there is no real upside.

[Tony Kim]

Originally posted by @JC Wu:

@Nina M.@Jason G.@Heshel Mangel@Account Closed It took my entire president's day afternoon to write that last post. Hope it helps. Best of luck to you all and happy investing. :)

I appreciate you posting your story. I'm very sorry to hear what happened......and to be honest, your story made me really glad that I went with my turnkey company...which is about as close to 'set-it and forget-it' as possible. Their affiliated PM has also been best in class. The key is to find someone trustworthy, and I think I got lucky with the company I ended up with.

I can appreciate Roofstock's business model, but if I wanted to passively invest out of state, they would be the very last company I would use. And if I actually wanted to be less passive, Roofstock would again be the last company I would use because their listings aren't exactly what I would call good deals. If I'm going to play a more active role in the purchase, what's the point in paying the prices listed on Roofstock's platform? It would be much better to find someone local to the area and put together a deal with his/her help. I would only use Rootstock if I had a rental property that I wanted to unload

And although I'm happy with my TK provider, I'm pretty sure that will be the only one I purchase. Like you, I also invest in private placements and notes through various online sites like YieldStreet and Equity Multiple. The cash flow has been very good for both my TK as well as the syndicated deals, but only one of those has a good exit strategy along with potential for capital appreciation. The rest of my stuff is located locally here in Los Angeles and constitutes the largest portion of my portfolio by far.

[JC Wu]

@Tony Kim

Who's your TK provider? An LA TK provider that only serves locally? 

Roofstock is more like a "broker on steroid" rather than a true TK provider as another BP investor put it. I thought it's kinda fitting although not exactly. At the same time, I can't come up with a better description myself. 

I didn't have the balls (still don't) to invest in my local market - San Francisco Bay Area, which is one of the, if not THE most expensive market. I wasn't comfortable with putting too much at stake as a newbie, so I invested in cheap markets to just get my feet wet. Exactly like @Jay Hinrichs said, too inconsistent for someone like me. 

CrowdStreet is pretty good, too. I might invest in a self-storage facility deal next, which should serve me well during the impending recession -- the four Ds (divorce, dislocation, death, disaster). 

[Tony Kim]

Originally posted by @JC Wu:

@Tony Kim

Who's your TK provider? An LA TK provider that only serves locally? 

Roofstock is more like a "broker on steroid" rather than a true TK provider as another BP investor put it. I thought it's kinda fitting although not exactly. At the same time, I can't come up with a better description myself. 

I didn't have the balls (still don't) to invest in my local market - San Francisco Bay Area, which is one of the, if not THE most expensive market. I wasn't comfortable with putting too much at stake as a newbie, so I invested in cheap markets to just get my feet wet. Exactly like @Jay Hinrichs said, too inconsistent for someone like me. 

CrowdStreet is pretty good, too. I might invest in a self-storage facility deal next, which should serve me well during the impending recession -- the four Ds (divorce, dislocation, death, disaster). 

Ohio Cash Flow is my TK provider. They're based out of Toledo, OH.  Couldn't be happier with them. I don't use a TK provider for my local properties... For one, they don't exist. I buy and manage all of my local properties via my in-house staff, which consists of two people, my wife and I.  :) 

I don't blame you for feeling that way about SF. Prices are sky high and there is no relief in sight. Ever thought about investing in nearby gentrifying areas such as Richmond? That is my strategy for LA now that prices are sky high here too (though, not nearly as high as your neighborhood). I recently purchased a four-unit near USC/Exposition Park which is an area that is still relatively affordable but has been changing a lot. 

[JC Wu]

@Jack Bobeck

Thanks for your input. That just made me feel even better about my decision of getting rid of this property for good. 

I hope the flipper who told me the city of Jacksonville doesn't do a good job at enforcing permits doesn't actually skip on them. 

I too think the double-digit appreciation is a bit exaggerated. My Merrill Lynch advisor said her model predicts the market should be good for another two years, but nobody has the crystal ball. 

[Engelo Rumora]

Originally posted by @Tony Kim:

Originally posted by @JC Wu:

@Tony Kim

Who's your TK provider? An LA TK provider that only serves locally? 

Roofstock is more like a "broker on steroid" rather than a true TK provider as another BP investor put it. I thought it's kinda fitting although not exactly. At the same time, I can't come up with a better description myself. 

I didn't have the balls (still don't) to invest in my local market - San Francisco Bay Area, which is one of the, if not THE most expensive market. I wasn't comfortable with putting too much at stake as a newbie, so I invested in cheap markets to just get my feet wet. Exactly like @Jay Hinrichs said, too inconsistent for someone like me. 

CrowdStreet is pretty good, too. I might invest in a self-storage facility deal next, which should serve me well during the impending recession -- the four Ds (divorce, dislocation, death, disaster). 

Ohio Cash Flow is my TK provider. They're based out of Toledo, OH.  Couldn't be happier with them. I don't use a TK provider for my local properties... For one, they don't exist. I buy and manage all of my local properties via my in-house staff, which consists of two people, my wife and I.  :) 

I don't blame you for feeling that way about SF. Prices are sky high and there is no relief in sight. Ever thought about investing in nearby gentrifying areas such as Richmond? That is my strategy for LA now that prices are sky high here too (though, not nearly as high as your neighborhood). I recently purchased a four-unit near USC/Exposition Park which is an area that is still relatively affordable but has been changing a lot. 

Hi Tony,

Thanks for the mention and kind words.

I'll pass them on to the team and I'm sure they will be delighted.

We are glad to have you on board.

Have a great day and speak soon :)

[Natalie Schanne]

@JC Wu - I’m sorry you lost money in your investment. It looks like you picked a good, appreciating market. Did you find out how much your wholesaler sold the property for (without doing anything about the permits) above your 107k?

Why didn’t you keep renting it through the property manager (doesn’t roofstock provide or recommend one?)? was a tenant in it? What’s the story with that? I would have thought everything was updated and you could rent it indefinitely after buying from roofstock.

I’m sorry you got some advice that really confused you and made you want to sell. I highly recommend you work with agents in the future. (We’re free to you as the buyer). I’ve bought several properties as-is, agreeing to take on the liability for previous work after a home inspection. The older a house is, it’s almost 100% likely it’ll have unpermitted work. Generally the city wants to check that it’s done right. Often they’ll waive any fees associated with the as-is condition of what you bought and only if they’re really mad at you will they make you back permit something and usually it’s like a $100-200 permit fee and an inspection and maybe another couple hundred dollars of quickie repairs. I love the idea of the permitting process (protects the consumer) but my local municipality can’t hire enough inspectors (low pay/stress/high experience requirements) so the wait time is 30 days to get your permit approved and 30 days more to schedule an inspection. All for adding an overhead light or two (generating the city approx $50 in fees) that’ll take the electrician an hour and costs you $200. So I understand why flippers work now and ask for forgiveness later. If the work is done well, (not necessarily with the most expensive materials) there should be no issues. My insurance company Usaa told me they wouldn’t deny claims for unpermitted work (probably unless it was like egregiously bad electrical that caused a fire or something.)

In New Jersey, this past year, they did away with roofing permits. I bought a $8000 new roof in 2018 from a 5 star local company and would have rather had a city inspection verifying everything was good but it wasn’t even available. So you being forced to sell because of your new unpermitted roof is a little wonky to me.

[Jay Hinrichs]

Originally posted by @JC Wu:

@Jack Bobeck

Thanks for your input. That just made me feel even better about my decision of getting rid of this property for good. 

I hope the flipper who told me the city of Jacksonville doesn't do a good job at enforcing permits doesn't actually skip on them. 

I too think the double-digit appreciation is a bit exaggerated. My Merrill Lynch advisor said her model predicts the market should be good for another two years, but nobody has the crystal ball. 

keep in mind houses that are in areas that are all rentals do not appreciate like owner occ  properties.. reason investors are buying cash flow value will only go as high as rent.. just like MF.. they only sell for given cash flow.. now if its an area were you have a few rentals and the rest are owner occ that's different but that generally is not the case in America at the 100k or so price points.  with some exceptions. 

[Jason G.]

Originally posted by @JC Wu:

Here’s the first half of the long story, focused on the permitting issue and this particular property. I can answer Jason’s remaining questions focused on Roofstock, the contractual terms, local broker’s insight, etc in a later post, probably in a few weeks, as this post is already verbose. I just used Jason’s questions as a template. The order of the questions has been rearranged for a better flow.

I have not reached out to Roofstock about this undisclosed permitting issue, because I don’t plan to seek recourse from them or the seller and there’s nothing left to be intervened. The reasons can be explained in details in the second half of the long story. Somebody from Roofstock relayed a vague message saying they’ll respond to my correspondence from a while back about a separate issue. I haven’t heard from them, they probably forgot about it, and I don’t feel like following up. It’s a thing of the past. I doubt it has anything to do with this permitting issue.

1. What market was this property in and what was the purchase price?

Jacksonville, Duval County, Florida. The seller bought the property in 2015 for 29K. I bought it in 2017 for 95K before taking into account the closing costs. The seller rehabbed the property, kept it as a rental for about a year and then sold to me. I sold it to the wholesaler in Feb 2019 for 107K. The property was built in 1956. Roofstock certified.

Here’re the market value estimates from different sources around the time I sold it:

Roofstock: 118K - 136K

Zillow: 134K

Redfin: 149K

The wholesaler’s (my buyer) Facebook ad comps: 150K

I entered the right market but bought the wrong property from the wrong seller. The Jacksonville market is pretty hot right now, and the property has appreciated quite a bit.

The 30K+ of loss I mentioned in the original post is the total amount lost from this property. I only accounted for about 5K of loss of profit from this permitting issue/sold at discount, but it could be anywhere between 5K to 40K. The other ~25K is related to tenant issues.

2. What was the undisclosed permitting issue that the local flipper discovered from the public record?

Full roof replacement. There’s a lot more to it, it’s not just about a roof. The ramifications that stemmed from it were complicated. The discovery of the unpermitted roof was the trigger.

Based on the property’s price history and market value trends, I speculate it was in a run-down condition that needed a complete rehab when the seller acquired it in 2015. A 4-pt inspection I ordered for insurance purpose seems to confirm this. The 4-pt inspection report indicated that all the major systems were updated around 2015. I checked the permit history of this property on the City of Jacksonville Building Inspection Division website. It only shows two permits for this property: “roof permit pulled in 1991” and “existing building (not sure what that means) permit pulled in 2001”. I assume permits pulled before 1991 aren’t on electronic record. The website doesn’t show any permit pulled in 2015. After seeing this, I immediately started to wonder what other work performed in 2015 was also unpermitted.

On top of that, I was very concerned about the quality of the rehab work the seller did based on my knowledge of the seller’s shady and despicable conduct. The seller isn’t an individual, it’s a company that engages in all sorts of real estate activities. The seller did some other work for me after selling me the property, which turned out to be a total disaster. Looks like they even brazenly lied in writing against their own words from previous emails to rip me off a paltry couple hundred bucks. Later on, I found out they appeared to be committing fraud and doing illegal stuff.

I believe the seller is a plague on the local community, especially since it isn’t an affluent region, lots of the residents live paycheck to paycheck, numerous people complained about being ripped off. A lot of those people are financially vulnerable and lack resources to go against the seller. The seller also appears to be gaining unfair competitive advantage through cheating while many of its competitors earn recognition through hard work and serving the community.

I tried to warn others and posted online a screenshot of a consumer alert a website issued against the seller. The seller’s attorney sent me a threat letter before. I’m not a contentious type of person, but when my rights get infringed upon, I stand my ground and fight back to the end. I might have to anti-SLAPP and even sue them back for malicious prosecution or malicious use of process depending on what happens in the future. I sure hope the seller knows about the Streisand Effect and doesn’t act egregiously in the first place.

My logic goes, if the seller went so far to rip me off just a couple hundred bucks and they scam people, it would make sense for them to hire the cheapest labor, cut corners, use the cheapest material for the rehab in order to maximize their profit from the flip. It would also make sense for them to not pull permits to save on the permit application fees and finish the rehab asap without delay. Who knows how long the rehab work they did to this property would last, and when it’ll start to fall apart. But I do know that, when it starts to fall apart, I could be hit with some big-ticket items.

In hindsight, I should have hired a local inspector to do a super comprehensive and thorough inspection immediately after closing. In that way, If anything alarming came up and was too much for me to handle, I could benefit from the Roofstock 30-day money back guarantee and sell it right back to Roofstock. I don’t know if this is really feasible in practice though, and I certainly do not recommend abusing it. I think investors should only go for it if they really have solid reasons, otherwise, it’s just not a nice thing to do. Buyer’s remorse setting in is not a solid reason, for instance.

3. What was the cost of remedying the permitting issue should you have chosen to do so?

It is possible to permit after the fact. If I provide proof that I didn’t know about the issue, I might not even get fined. Laws regarding permits are local and vary from city to city. The cost of pulling one permit is usually only a couple hundred bucks.

Technically, a permit needs to be pulled for almost any major repair, like reroofing, repiping, rewiring, replacing HVAC system. But from what I’ve learned, the city of Jacksonville is stricter with certain types of repair work than others. For instance, they usually do not enforce swapping out a water heater without a permit, but they tend to make a bigger deal out of a full roof replacement without a permit.

But here is the catch. I risk opening a Pandora’s box by attempting to obtain a permit for the roof.

A code compliance inspector from the city would have to inspect the unpermitted structure and sign off on it. If the roof wasn’t installed properly, I might have to rip the entire thing off and redo with a permit. The roof is fairly new with a remaining useful life of as long as ten years according to the Roofstock inspection report. In addition, what if I attract unwanted attention to the other parts of the property that I strongly suspect aren’t permitted?  

I thought about hiring my own inspector to check out the property first to see whether it could pass a code compliance inspection, and then decide whether to contact the city or not. Here’s the problem. The inspector wouldn’t know for sure unless the floor gets busted up and drywall torn through.

The city of Jacksonville usually doesn’t do a good job at enforcing permits. I read some BP post discussions to get a better idea on permitting issues. A podcast guest on show #47, who’s also a broker, wrote that he had heard many horror stories where a buyer calls the city to get an idea of the city's attitude towards certain unpermitted structures, and the city says on the phone that everything is fine and after they buy the property they get hit with all these costs and fines. Since the guy was a podcast guest, I suppose he’s an expert. My takeaway from that post is do not count on the city to cut me some slack when they actually find out.

What about resale? Well, without me having to disclose, my then prospective buyers quickly found out on their own and interrogated me about it, asking it be reflected as a discount.

4. Why did you choose to sell the property vs keeping it as a buy and hold investment?

From my answers to the previous questions, you can tell that remedying the issue is tricky.

What about don’t remedy it and rent it out?

Insurance companies feel differently about unpermitted structures, many of which do not cover unpermitted structures or personal injuries caused by unpermitted structures. For those that don’t cover unpermitted structures, if the insured can prove that he/she had no prior knowledge and was not being negligent, the insurance company might still cover it. This is a grey area. To further complicate the matter, many insurance companies use wide blanket statements in the policy, so they have wiggle room to argue in court instead of telling people what exactly they insure or don’t insure.

The roof is at the mercy of mother nature, which hasn’t been very merciful to Jacksonville in recent years. During the short duration of my ownership, Jacksonville was under the influence of a category 5 hurricane and a category 4 hurricane: Irma in 2017 and Michael in 2018. I can imagine during a hurricane, the tenants huddle under the roof while the roof gets battered. If the roof wasn’t installed to meet safety standards, and crashes down, severely injures or kills the tenants, and the insurance company denies my claim, I’d be screwed.

I emailed my insurance agent, asking whether my insurer would deny a claim in this hypothetical scenario, she emailed back and said, “To answer your question about SFIC approving or denying a claim, I really can’t answer that question. The necessary steps to follow would be that a claim is filed by the insured via a call to the insurance claims department and then an investigation would be conducted by an insurance claims adjuster who would then make a decision as to whether the claim would be paid or not.”

My potential liability is further increased by my decision of not putting the property under an LLC when I bought it.

What about don’t remedy it and leave it vacant?

I thought about leaving it vacant and wait for it to appreciate over the next one to two years and then sell. You’ll find quite a few online articles that depict a very rosy outlook for the Jacksonville market, forecasting double-digit appreciation for 2019.

However, I think leaving a property vacant for too long is risky. During vacancy, I have to incur some costs, such as property tax, property management fees, insurance, and possibly property damages from break-ins. The community rating is only 2.5 star according to Roofstock. Moreover, I feel that the market is at its peak right now. Some brokers and flippers I’ve talked to share my sentiment. Who knows when the next recession will hit. One thing is for sure, once I detect some telltale signs, it’d be too late to act.

In conclusion, if I couldn’t remedy the issue, couldn’t use it as a rental without remedying the issue, couldn’t just hold a vacant property for years, then the only logical option left was to sell, to just get it off my back.

5. Why did you choose to sell the property to a wholesaler vs selling it on MLS?

Sell on the MLS:

When the home gets listed on the MLS, it would likely get hundreds or even thousands of views. I'd risk attracting unwanted attention to this permitting issue, and then it's the Pandora's box scenario again. Some nosy people might even rat me out to the code-compliance folks. Imagine the city sends out a code compliance inspector and orders me to do all those invasive things to the property, while it's on the market. That can't be good. Also, a buyer might request the issue to be remedied, which could hamper closing.

Sell to wholesaler:

Selling to the wholesaler as-is was more discreet and no hassle with repair requests.

I put my contact info on the public record when I bought the property, so I received unsolicited postcards in the mail from local wholesalers. I just called about a dozen of them, figured out they use the same formula to run numbers, their offers came close, I picked the second highest offer (the highest seemed a bit shady).

Here’re some other pros of selling to wholesalers: no agent commissions paid, buyer pays all cash, buyer pays all closing costs, no financing contingency, short inspection contingency (the wholesaler actually just walked the property before making an offer and that counted as the inspection), quick closing.

The cons of selling to wholesalers:

They offer below market value -- the 70% rule.

Many wholesalers got a bad rep. They basically practice real estate without a license.

The wholesaler eventually assigned the contract to another buyer and the title company did a double closing. Basically, the wholesaler flipped the contract/PSA and charged the end buyer an assignment fee.

In retrospect, I should have gone on several Jacksonville wholesaler’s Facebook pages to find out whom they market properties to, then compile my own buyer list and directly contact those end buyers. I could probably have walked away with a couple thousand dollars more.

6. What due diligence did you personally do prior to executing the PSA?

This is the first property I bought from Roofstock, and the first property I bought in my entire life, so I was a brand new newbie. My due diligence can be divided into two parts: on Roofstock and on the property.

My due diligence on Roofstock:

I looked up the founders. My logic went, if the founders/leaders are legitimate, the company and employees should also be good. I found out that the Roofstock CEO went to Stanford. A close family member of mine also went to Stanford. I myself worked on a Stanford research team. Roofstock CDO went to LSE. My family member’s co-founder also went to LSE, then to Stanford. The Roofstock CDO worked at Merrill Lynch for years; I’ve been a Merrill Lynch wealth management client for years. My family member’s startup also serves investors, but from a different sector. Some of Roofstock’s VC investors even approached my family member for the next funding round. These are hardly any real connection, but I have the tendency of trusting people who share things in common with me. I believe everybody has that tendency more or less.

I’m not a trusting person at all, but I trusted Roofstock. I believed and expected Roofstock to possess a sense of honor, integrity, decency, and abide by a set of moral and ethical rules. If I didn’t think highly of Roofstock, I wouldn’t have bought a second property from them about a year later.

My logic also went, if Roofstock is legitimate, the providers they recommend or certify should also be good, especially since Roofstock claims on their website that “we’ve found providers you can count on,” “rigorous certification means you can focus on your investment strategy rather than due diligence.” I assumed Roofstock had done more than enough due diligence on the providers for me, so I did not do much on my part besides checking out a few online reviews, which turned out to be a grave mistake. Roofstock providers is a juicy story for another day. Again, I think Roofstock tries hard to find the best ones, but it’s difficult for any business, not just Roofstock, to simultaneously juggle that many types of providers in that many states in that many communities. I gotta give Roofstock credit for finding the goods ones I’ve worked with though.

My due diligence on the property:

I checked out amenities around the property on Google Map. Grocery stores, day care centers, parks, restaurants, shopping malls, distance to downtown, major highways, etc. I checked Zillow and Redfin for price histories. I also checked citydatadotcom for the demographics of the population, the average income, and a bunch of other things pertaining to the local community as a whole. I went on homedisclosuredotcom to check for hazards, noise level, criminal offenders nearby, etc. And of course, all the documents in the Roofstock diligence vault. The Roofstock closing coordinator actually emailed me all the docs in a zip folder saying, “Please see attached a zip file of all the documents from the Diligence Vault.” Docs included are inspection report, house canary value report, insurance quote, but no disclosure form. Not embedded in the PSA either.

At the time of purchase, my biggest concern was actually the registered sex offender neighbor. The lease I inherited indicated there was only one female tenant. I was concerned about her safety and whether the resale value would be adversely affected by a neighbor like that. It turned out the sex offender was the least of my concern. It also turned out the tenant had unauthorized occupants living with her all along. Apparently, I fixated on the wrong issues.

As a rather clueless newbie, it never occurred to me that I should check permit record. Seller didn’t mention it, neither did Roofstock. Nobody reminded me to check. It kinda just slipped through the crack. I suspect there are other things I should have checked but didn’t know to check, and still don’t know to check. Maybe I dodged some bullets without even knowing about it by cashing out on this property.

I eventually realized that the onus of due diligence ultimately falls on the buyer, although it looks like failing to investigate permits is a common form of malpractice committed by buyers' agents for MLS transactions. I definitely should have done extensive research on the seller. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that the other property I bought from Roofstock will remain good to me.

Writing reviews brings me closure, but more importantly, I hope by sharing my experience, you newbies out there can avoid paying some tuition. It’s not fun to be the one going through all that, and it certainly could have been a lot worse.

To be continued……..

The entire post is filled with speculation and concerns based on unknowns and not underlying established facts.  You appear naturally to default to decision making based upon emotions and speculation on what worst case scenarios may be.  As others have recommended, working with a real estate agent or investing in real estate outside of direct ownership may be options for you to consider moving forward.

[JC Wu]

Originally posted by @Natalie Schanne:

@JC Wu - I’m sorry you lost money in your investment. It looks like you picked a good, appreciating market. Did you find out how much your wholesaler sold the property for (without doing anything about the permits) above your 107k?

Why didn’t you keep renting it through the property manager (doesn’t roofstock provide or recommend one?)? was a tenant in it? What’s the story with that? I would have thought everything was updated and you could rent it indefinitely after buying from roofstock.

I’m sorry you got some advice that really confused you and made you want to sell. I highly recommend you work with agents in the future. (We’re free to you as the buyer). I’ve bought several properties as-is, agreeing to take on the liability for previous work after a home inspection. The older a house is, it’s almost 100% likely it’ll have unpermitted work. Generally the city wants to check that it’s done right. Often they’ll waive any fees associated with the as-is condition of what you bought and only if they’re really mad at you will they make you back permit something and usually it’s like a $100-200 permit fee and an inspection and maybe another couple hundred dollars of quickie repairs. I love the idea of the permitting process (protects the consumer) but my local municipality can’t hire enough inspectors (low pay/stress/high experience requirements) so the wait time is 30 days to get your permit approved and 30 days more to schedule an inspection. All for adding an overhead light or two (generating the city approx $50 in fees) that’ll take the electrician an hour and costs you $200. So I understand why flippers work now and ask for forgiveness later. If the work is done well, (not necessarily with the most expensive materials) there should be no issues. My insurance company Usaa told me they wouldn’t deny claims for unpermitted work (probably unless it was like egregiously bad electrical that caused a fire or something.)

In New Jersey, this past year, they did away with roofing permits. I bought a $8000 new roof in 2018 from a 5 star local company and would have rather had a city inspection verifying everything was good but it wasn’t even available. So you being forced to sell because of your new unpermitted roof is a little wonky to me.

Thanks for sharing your insight. It is very helpful. 

The wholesaler sold it to the end buyer for 117K. The end buyer paid all closing costs; they're located in Israel; they plan to do some light remodeling and then list it for sale on the MLS. Looks like the end buyer bought into the market value being over 150K (after remodeling).

The Roofstock certified property manager screwed me over and got fired. I can't share the details yet. Then I hired a local PM I found on my own, not affiliated with Roofstock - transparent fee structure, tech-savvy, run by responsible ppl on top of their games. 

The inherited tenant (from the seller&Roofstock) along with the illegal human and animal occupants got evicted, trashed the property, left a whole ecosystem of vermins behind. I then spent around 13K on rent ready repairs before listing the property for rent. 

The first tenant of my first rental got evicted. Fun huh? 

The property was in bad shape when the tenant left. The HVAC filter hadn't been changed for over two years. Food and trash were left rotting. The flooring detached from the bottom of the wall. Some doors were dangling. That's another reason why I suspect the quality of the rehab work the seller did was poor. 

When I bought the property from Roofstock, the "current rent" was $950, with a green arrow next to it pointing up, meaning the "market rent" was higher. The "market rent" indicated was $1025. Roofstock has updated and revised their website over time, so it doesn't display like that anymore. Now I understand it was just an estimate. 

Anyway, the property was listed for rent at $1095 at first, nobody interested; I reduced it to $1025, still nobody interested; I reduced it again to $965, applications finally began to slowly trickle in but kept getting declined. By the time the property went under contract, there was not even a single approved application. It was listed for rent till it went under contract - it sat on the market for 81 days. 

The property was vacant for so long that the vermins starved to death. Didn't even need a treatment. 

The bad tenants, the eviction, the fact that the prospects' applications kept getting declined (low-quality tenant pool), the property sat on the market for rent for months, the neglected HVAC, the actual low market rent all contributed to my decision to sell. The permitting issue was the main concern, the trigger, but not the only reason. 

[JC Wu]

Here’s the second half of the long story focused on Roofstock. Sorry about the delay, I've been busy moving to San Francisco. Thank you all for taking the time to read my posts and leave public and private comments/messages. I appreciate you impart your knowledge and share your wisdom with me. I’m glad that quite a few investors find my posts helpful.

Did you require the seller to complete the disclosure form prior to executing the PSA?

No. I believe Roofstock sends disclosure forms to sellers to complete prior to listing the properties on their website.

A disclosure form was embedded in the PSA for my other property (in Charlotte, NC) acquired through Roofstock.

The two Roofstock PSAs I signed were different in terms of the content and format, perhaps due to different states have different requirements, or Roofstock revises the PSA over time, or both.

Why don’t I seek recourse?

First of all, there’s a difference between “loss of profit” and “loss of principal/original amount invested.” Even though I got screwed over by the seller, the evicted tenant and illegal occupants, the Roofstock certified PM, undisclosed material fact, sell after only owning for ~1.5 years, I managed to barely break even - appreciation saved my ***.

The property damages and various other costs were offset by rent and capital gain from the sell. The loss of profit is as high as 60K, but little loss of principal amount. If I made that profit, great; if I didn’t, not the end of the world.

Running into problems isn’t always a bad thing. I find myself learn the most when I’m forced to face and tackle problems. I had a bad feeling about this whole thing when I was in the middle of this ordeal. Now it’s over and I look back, I consider it an overall positive experience.

The main reason is that I don’t feel like jumping over tall hurdles.

Did you retain an attorney upon discovering the permitting issue?

Investors have to click to agree to the Terms & Conditions before gaining access to the service and certain features of the website. An attorney looked over the Roofstock Terms & Conditions, pointed out the Indemnity, Limitation of Liability, Arbitration Notice, and Arbitration of Disputes sections. The document is publicly available at the bottom of the Roofstock website, next to "privacy policy."  I can't copy and paste the terms here. 

So those are the hurdles. Doesn’t mean I have zero chance of jumping over; doesn’t mean the provisions are always enforceable. I just don’t think it’s worth the time and effort. If I suffered considerable loss of the principal amount, then I would be more motivated to make the effort.

Some people are ok with arbitration as the method of resolving disputes, but some find waiving their right to go to court when things go wrong offputting.

For MLS transactions, can licensed realtors and brokers be absolved of legal responsibilities, professional duties, and liability for misrepresentations made in conjunction with the sale of residential real estate by language contained in contracts?

According to the Florida attorney general, the answer is NO.

The FL attorney general website says:

“A licensed real estate broker or salesperson cannot be relieved of a professional duty or shielded from liability for a violation of the professional practices act by language contained in a sales agreement between a seller and a buyer of real estate. Any provision of a contract that purports to remove a real estate broker's or salesperson's liability for misrepresentation or other wrongdoing undermines public confidence in a regulated profession and is contrary to public policy and, therefore, void.”

The Florida Association of Realtors once came up with a version of PSA that contained Indemnity provisions without the approval by the Florida Bar. It circulated among realtors. Then the attorney general published a letter on their website to clear it up.

I consulted a Florida broker and a California broker about this. Their opinions are in line with what the attorney general office put out.

On a side note, Indemnity and Limitation of Liability clauses aren't something novel that Roofstock came up with on their own. Lots of legitimate companies insert these types of clauses into their Terms & Conditions - if they could, they would.

It’s my fault that I didn’t read the Terms & Conditions before registering a Roofstock account. That document has been publicly available all along. I just never read Terms & Conditions before using websites, apps or software updates. And I never will.

Click-by-agree contracts:

Out of curiosity, I looked up how many people actually read Terms & Conditions or terms of service agreements. I found a study conducted by the University of Connecticut. They created a fake social networking site called Name Drop, and wrote up a terms and services agreement for users to agree to before signing up. In the agreement, they included that users give up their first born child as payment, and that anything users shared would be passed along to the National Security Agency. A whopping 98% of participants agreed.

A Deloitte survey of 2,000 American consumers found that 91% of people consent to legal terms and services conditions without reading them. For younger people ages 18-34, the rate is 97%.

I suppose under specific circumstances, Roofstock might offer to reimburse a lot more than the capped amount stated in the Terms & Conditions. If they do that, whoever receives the reimbursements should be very grateful. They put the provisions in there doesn’t mean they strictly follow them.

More on me rating Roofstock 1 star for newbie buyers, 3 stars for experienced buyers, 5 stars for sellers:

I consulted a Jacksonville licensed broker on the permitting issue, without mentioning Roofstock. He brought up something that resonated with my personal experience. See the attached screenshot of the email. He wasn’t talking about Roofstock, but I think it applies to Roofstock and many of its sellers. This broker along with the realtors he’s hired have done thousands of RE transactions in Florida over the years.

I’m not discussing the terms in the PSAs I signed since I’m not supposed to. I’m talking about the blank one that anyone with a Roofstock account can see by clicking on a random property on their website. I can’t copy and paste specifics here because technically you need to have a Roofstock account to access documents in the diligence vaults.

For those of you who have a Roofstock account, refer to paragraph 18 on page 6 of the October 2017 version of the PSA.

So yeah, if you’re a seller, newbie or experienced, Roofstock has you back and you’re well shielded from liability.

I’d like to point out that, although I really don’t think Roofstock is suitable for newbie buyers, it is a fine website for seasoned buyers. After all, the wholesaler that bought my property was comfortable with buying “as-is” and doesn’t go after sellers later on after closing. Although, the wholesaler inspected the property in person twice, once before making the offer and once right before closing; whereas most Roofstock investors don’t get a chance to walk the properties before closing.

I'd also like to point out that Roofstock recently launched this patent-pending new platform called "Roofstock One" that allows investors to invest in SFR more passively outside of direct ownership. I think it makes more sense for newbie investors - less risk, less operation, more baskets for your eggs, low investment capital, etc. They've also added new programs such as bus tours and "bring your own property." Roofstock keeps refining their business model and it should become more and more sophisticated over time. I haven't tried any of the new stuff as I'm wary after what happened.

My rating is based on my limited personal experience with Roofstock. Although I consider the broker a trustworthy expert, what he wrote is just his personal opinion. Take it with a grain of salt and exercise your own judgment.

Roofstock closing coordinators:

I’d say if you’ve never bought a property in your life, the Roofstock closing coordinators may be helpful. They connect you to their affiliated providers - title companies, lenders, insurance agents, PMs - so you don’t need to search on your own.

I’d rather spend some time on finding my own providers. Just one example briefly, when I closed on my second Roofstock property, it took 2 months, multiple follow up emails and my complaint being escalated to the Roofstock director to receive the title insurance. To be fair, closing on the first Roofstock property went smoothly.

Although my closing coordinator was always responsive and was willing to address my questions and concerns whenever I reached out to her, she didn’t proactively make sure I got everything in the first place. I had to discover the issue and tell her what was missing. If that was my first closing and I didn’t know what to expect, I’d be screwed.

The title insurance example is just one of the five things that this Roofstock affiliated title company messed up. Some of those Roofstock providers each deserves their own separate thread if I have to write in details - stories for another day again. This post is about Roofstock.

Roofstock advisors:

I feel that my Roofstock advisor’s expertise stops at the macro market level. When I inquired about a particular property, he would often send me links to articles that discuss for example the “Memphis market” or the “Pittsburgh market.” Sometimes, I had already read the articles from my own Google search.

What I really wanted to know were things like "where are the bad pockets with rampant illicit activities," "what regulations and laws the local governments might implement or enact that could affect future property value and cause demographic shifts," "what infrastructure construction is underway," "is the FEMA map accurate and do the local insurance companies agree with it," "if the property is near an airport, is it in noisy flight paths," etc. Sure I can find some of the info online through time-consuming and extensive research, but the sources of the info could be outdated and inaccurate.

At least to me, my Roofstock advisor never demonstrated knowledge at the micro level. He’s knowledgeable about Roofstock though, to be fair. I was also impressed by his work ethic. He would promptly respond to my emails late at night, including weekends.

To sum it up, he’s always willing to help, always there to help, but unable to help as much as I’d like him to. I suppose the mediocre local realtors don’t even know the answers to some of those questions, let alone Roofstock advisors.

Assuming the Roofstock advisors only work from their fancy Silicon Valley office and have never spent a considerable amount of time in or even never been to those out-of-state markets, how can their expertise compete with that of the local brokers’ who’ve built their lives there? My assumption could be wrong. Who knows, maybe there are adventurous folks who’ve lived, worked, or invested in all 19 states serving as their advisors.

When it comes time to sell those properties, the majority of prospective buyers will be locals (unless sell on platforms tailored to RE investors), likely represented by local realtors who scrutinize the properties in person and guard the buyers’ interests - the cards would probably be stacked against the sellers who’ve never seen the properties with their own eyes and lacked guidance from experts with equal amount of knowledge when they bought the properties. Some out-of-state investors have local connections, or they themselves possess knowledge of the local markets, then it’d be a completely different story of course. This is another reason why I think Roofstock works fine for seasoned buyers.

Interestingly, many local PM companies have investment advisors on the team. If you give them a ring, they may even take a look at your inspection reports and share their opinions on whether the properties you’re interested in make good investments. The tricky part is conflict of interest - by far, I haven’t encountered a PM investment advisor that advised me against buying a property of my interest. Not sure if it’s because I’m good at identifying opportunities or they just want me on board to profit out of me.

There’s a lot of stuff I still haven’t touched on. I try to avoid writing lengthy essays. 

THE END…..

[JC Wu]

@Susan Little@Tony Kim@Natalie Schanne@Jason G.@Jay Hinrichs@Engelo Rumora@Account Closed 

Not sure if people can see my update without being @ed. If you got two emails, sorry about that. Looks like I can only @ people who've left public comments under this thread. Anyway, Please feel free to criticize and give your feedback. I always appreciate views from different perspectives. 

[Nina M.]

@JC Wu Thanks for sharing. Kind of agree with you on the most part. I am one of those seasonal buyers and I am a newbie. I purchased 2 from roofstock, one is OK, the other one caused a lot of headache after the closing. Still no tenants after spent tons of money to replace all gas pipes, fix dry walls, repaint, and fix the leaking etc. I am in the middle of writing my own experiences. Will share when ready.

[JC Wu]

Originally posted by @Nina M.:

@JC Wu Thanks for sharing. Kind of agree with you on the most part. I am one of those seasonal buyers and I am a newbie. I purchased 2 from roofstock, one is OK, the other one caused a lot of headache after the closing. Still no tenants after spent tons of money to replace all gas pipes, fix dry walls, repaint, and fix the leaking etc. I am in the middle of writing my own experiences. Will share when ready.

 Hmm, interesting. I'm sorry to hear that. You probably saw one of my previous posts about how my Jacksonville property sat on the market for 81 days after I spent five figure on rent ready repairs. Not a single approved application till I sold it. It may be helpful to check your property's price history on Zillow. Often times, you can tell at what price and at what time it was listed for rent, how long it sat on the market each time, whether the list price had to be reduced, market rent trend over time, etc to judge its rental value. 

By seasoned buyer, I mean experienced buyer. 

I look forward to your review and good luck. 

[Charles Kao]

@JC Wu @Jason Gines

Problem with these turnkey operations is they get greedy or they get pressure from

their investors or board of directors to keep growing. Eventually all these turnkey operations go south because they have to take risks to keep their investors happy. Their performance is not in alignment with that of the investor buying the properties. Your investment performing well, great so are all of the others because its the hottest market we've ever had.

[Jason G.]

Originally posted by @Charles Kao:

@JC Wu @Jason Gines

Problem with these turnkey operations is they get greedy or they get pressure from

their investors or board of directors to keep growing. Eventually all these turnkey operations go south because they have to take risks to keep their investors happy. Their performance is not in alignment with that of the investor buying the properties. Your investment performing well, great so are all of the others because its the hottest market we've ever had.

 Roofstock is a marketplace, not a turnkey company.  With respect to the PSA, a buyer can insist the disclosures are fully filled out before they sign the agreement.  From all the information The OP has provided, my opinion is that the OP made non optimal decisions at multiple points in their experience.  Investing in real estate has many risks and as an investor we need to educate ourselves and take ownership of our mistakes and learn from them.

[Charles Kao]

@Jason Gines

Its still marketing turnkey operations and the less they have invested the more likely they allow others to put junk on there. Your

case seems different because you are doing quite a bit of your own research as well. The more properties they get on their marketplace the more money they make so they are basically a glorified MLS because they are marketing themself at a discount to the typical real estate transaction.

[Guy Gimenez]

Consider this the cost of your education. Your scenario is EXACTLY why anyone with limited knowledge of real estate, real estate law, contracts, etc. should never "jump in with both feet" as most gurus encourage noobs to do. Find a seasoned investor to help you on your first 7 to 10 deals so you don't have such a steep and expensive learning curve. 

[Brian Ploszay]

Roofstock is interesting. The "single family rental industry" lacked a good platform to buy / sell these properties. The local MLS was not working. Roofstock wasn't the only company to try selling these properties, but their platform is becoming the most dominant.

My gripe about them is that they have very few properties in my market and those properties are overpriced.  If Roofstock can achieve the pricing that I see, I will use them to sell my properties.

As far as your problem, my State has strict protection laws disclosure. You therefore can litigate against the owner and possibly his LLC will not protect him if you can prove he knew about it. (consult a lawyer). For larger properties, there are no disclosure laws, so purchasers have to be skilled about due diligence.

It is a good question what is Roofstock's agency responsibility. Despite anything you sign, the local laws take precedent. Is Roofstock just a platform like the MLS? Or can they be considered to be providing brokerage services, representing both buyer and seller of a transaction?

Keep in mind, the people who really make money in single family rentals occupy the whole chain of value.  They buy them cheap, they renovate them and they lease them.  Buying turnkey rentals, you are generally paying more and allowing the provider to capture the profit from developing the property.

[JC Wu]

There's something I'd like to point out after reading some of the comments.

It's my opinion that Roofstock's business model is flawed, because Roofstock targets newbies for advertisement (see the attached screenshot of their Google ad). If Roofstock didn't target newbies, I would have thought their business model is fine. 

Furthermore, on one hand, Roofstock says these sort of stuff on their website:

"when it comes times to finance or manage your property, we’ve found providers you can count on.”

"rigorous certification means you can focus on your investment strategy rather than due diligence.”

“enjoy long-term, expert support: Our team is here for you all the way. We set you up with a vetted local property manager, and continue to work on your behalf to help everything go smoothly.”

“if there’s a dispute or disagreement, Roofstock is always there to step in.”

All of that gave me the impression that Roofstock provides lots of support and assurance to newbie investors, especially newbie buyers.

On the other hand, there are the "Property Managers", "Indemnity", "Limitation of Liability" sections in the Terms&Conditions that seem to conflict with the statements on their website, to some degree or another.

It makes me wonder, does Roofstock abide by or own up to those statements on their website or follow provisions in the Terms&Conditions? My personal experience makes me guess it's somewhere in between. If that's the case, where does Roofstock draw the line? Is it a case to case basis? Then how can investors determine the amount of support they can expect to receive from Roofstock before they make investment decisions? 

[JC Wu]

@Jason G. What do you mean by "with respect to the PSA, a buyer CAN insist the disclosure are fully filled out"? I wasn't aware it was an option. By the way, why would any buyer want to insist that if given an option? 

What does OP stand for?

@Charles Kao I feel that the majority of the discount goes to sellers rather than the buyers. For MLS transactions, sellers typically pay all the commission around 5-6%, right? Roofstock charges a much lower commission, but the buyer has to pay part of it. Whether there's really a discount or not, I think it largely depends on the final sale price. Some sellers may be willing to pass on some of the savings from the commission to buyers.

@Guy Gimenez Yes I've come to the same conclusion. Not all newbie investors are lucky to have seasoned investors help them out though. Sometimes newbie investors have to either jump in with both feet or not jump at all. 

@Brian Ploszay Very helpful insights. Proving the seller knew about it can be tricky. I think most of the time there's only indirect evidence. Also, as out of state investors, litigating against seller in another state is probably a hassle and expensive. Don't the litigations have to take place in the state the property is located? 

[Nina M.]

@JC Wu Thanks for pointing it out ;-) 

You inspired me to finish writing my purchases through roofstock. Hope it's not too boring or too long to read. https://www.biggerpockets.com/forums/311/topics/693781-my-roofstock-purchases I don't have time to do all the researches, so I rely on Roofstock to do the work for me. I expect Roofstock to help me if I have any issue right after closing, but I am not sure how they draw the line. Based on my experience, I guess it's a case to base basis. Again, thanks for sharing your thoughts from a seller's angle. 

[Jason G.]

Originally posted by :

What do you mean by "with respect to the PSA, a buyer CAN insist the disclosure are fully filled out"? I wasn't aware it was an option. By the way, why would any buyer want to insist that if given an option? 

What does OP stand for?

OP = Original Poster. Of course you can insist it is filled out. If the seller refuses you can walk away. On a deal with Roofstock that ultimately fell through I had Roofstock send the disclosures back to the seller several times until every question was responded to, which ultimately led to the revelation of prior water intrusion into the basement that they had claimed to have resolved. If you are looking at listings on MLS you can ask your agent to request the seller disclosures before putting in an offer. Even if the seller is an investor they should know what their own inspections have found and what kind of work they did on the property. If it is an estate sale then it would be more understandable if the seller has no idea what the condition of the property is.

[JC Wu]

Originally posted by @Jason G.:

Originally posted by :

What do you mean by "with respect to the PSA, a buyer CAN insist the disclosure are fully filled out"? I wasn't aware it was an option. By the way, why would any buyer want to insist that if given an option? 

What does OP stand for?

OP = Original Poster. Of course you can insist it is filled out. If the seller refuses you can walk away. On a deal with Roofstock that ultimately fell through I had Roofstock send the disclosures back to the seller several times until every question was responded to, which ultimately led to the revelation of prior water intrusion into the basement that they had claimed to have resolved. If you are looking at listings on MLS you can ask your agent to request the seller disclosures before putting in an offer. Even if the seller is an investor they should know what their own inspections have found and what kind of work they did on the property. If it is an estate sale then it would be more understandable if the seller has no idea what the condition of the property is.

 Ohh, that's what you meant. I thought you were saying buyers have an option to opt out of agreeing to the "seller disclosures" section on the Roofstock drafted PSAs. 

While we're at it, do buyers have that option?

Are Roofstock PSA terms negotiable? 

Although there's a disclosure form embedded in the PSA I signed for my NC property, the seller checked "no representation" for all of the questions and stated, "has never occupied the property" - it was as though the disclosure form was never filled out. In that case, would you make Roofstock ask the seller to select either "yes" or "no"? 

I'm pretty sure MLS agents are expected to request seller disclosures on behalf of the buyer without being asked by the buyer. If the buyer has to remind or ask the agent to do so, the agent is most likely a lousy one.

Nonetheless, I wasn't aware buyers can ask Roofstock to send diclosures to sellers several times. That's helpful information. Thanks, Jason. I wish I knew it earlier.