Direct mail, rlvm, texts. How many leads do I need to start?

Question

I recently listened to Will Brown: Ep 371 podcast about his motivated seller lead generation using ringless voicemail and texts. I am planning on starting my first marketing plan and I am unsure how many leads I need to get started. There are some resources on his website here including his lead source REItargetlist. I also got an email step-by-step guide (thanks @Roland Brown)

So my question is how many leads do I need to start with and should I start with RLVM, texts, direct mail or all of the above?

Thanks, John

Robert Nabong · Answer

@Amy Aziz hey I’m curious to know how many you send and the ratio of calls you get ?

Jerryll Noorden · Answer

I always laugh when I hear people talk about "Motivated" seller lead generation and then they mention DMM, cold calling, RVM... Motivated sellers, are people that want to sell already and have some sort of above average need to have it sold. When you are talking about DMM RVM cold claling etc. etc. that is NOT a "Motivated" lead generation system. That is called a: "I-HOPE-I-will-get-lucky-and-find-a-motivated-seller" lead generation system. Or "I-am-just-going-to-target-a-bunch-of-people-and-hope-some-motivated-sellers-will-respond" lead generating system. You are not generating motivated leads. You are generating everything, from pissed off people, people that want to just know how much you would offer for their house, curious people trying to see what the hell that is calling, people that demand you take them off your list, some motivated leads sure... everything. People should stop using the term "motivated" lead generation when they are just doing "something" that gets them responses. A motivated seller lead generation system is a system that generates motivated seller leads. That said, to answer your question, how many leads do you need to start.. is like asking "how lucky do I need to be to get a deal?". Correct? Yes that LITERALLY translates to that. See that this entire "strategy" you got going is flawed? That is like asking how many leads do you need to get a deal. Well it is not about leads. A lead means nothing. If your voice message is wrong, and it resonates with traditional home sellers that want market value for their house, no matter how many leads you harvest, you make ZERO deals. You are asking the wrong question here. The correct question is, "am I truly reaching motivated sellers?", and if so, how much do I need to spend in order to make a deal. It is all about cost / deal, not cost per lead (or # of leads). All and ANY system you use is useless if you are not accurately targeting motivated sellers. And text, ringless voicemails DMM do not incorporate finding motivation. They are just based on a list. And lists dont deal with motivation either. So to answer your question. The ONLY correct answer to "How many leads do I need"... you need to send messages out to as many people as possible. The more you send out the luckier you will get. It is as SIMPLE as that! You are not using any strategy really. You are just playing with numbers. Marketing is a HUGE deal when it comes to business success. Have you seen how complicated the facebook marketing platform is? How about Google PPC and adwords. A lot goes into it just to address ONE issue: "How do you target the right people... motivated people". And here comes DMM cold calling, RVM, and their platform is just "Ohh I have a list, lets send 3000 hits out". Do you all not realize there is a HUGE disconnect here? How can you all STILL mindlessly use these retarded systems when it is clear as day in front of you how much truly goes into marketing. Not just that but look at the damn numbers. 0.3%-3% open rate? Are you friggin kidding? How is that POSSIBLY acceptable?!?!?! WHY are so many of you just following sheep... It is literally beyond me!Folks, the podcasts are not some magical guide to what is correct, or what works.These podcasts are an educational guide, a window to what OTHER investors are doing and what THEY THINK about what they are doing. It is not Biggerpockets saying "you should do this because it works great".You can not blindly take the speakers word for it without doing some accurate unbiased fact checks. How many people are doing DMM RVM text... how many are successful? That alone is a clear indication that something is amiss.And honestly, I don't care what magical tweaks and twists someone makes to a flawed and inferior system. It is still based on flawed principles, i.e. it is not targeting motivation. It is targeting quantity, numbers. I call that winging it!

Amy Aziz · Answer

@John Peroyea I dont have the man power for 10000 yet! lol I send about 3 to 5k. :)

John P. · Answer

A lot as in 500, 1000, 10000?

John P. · Answer

@Jerryll Noorden thanks for the input. I agree that PPC looks like the best way to get targeted sellers to my website while my SEO gets going (so far I am indexed and getting some search traffic but no leads yet. I am unsure on a budget to start with for PPC. I am going to start doing some keyword research for my market this week though.

Jerryll Noorden · Answer

Yup, mind you when I answer posts I actually write to the entire BP community, not specifically you. From your quesiton it was clear what you meant.Indeed bud. I would focus more on strategies that actually gets you in touch with motivated sellers. Again, DMM can work but the ONLY way to reliably make deals from DMM is you have to send 5000 +.And when you are looking at these costs, you are way better off doing PPC and facebook ads.As a beginner I would focus more on PPC and facebook ads. By all means take SEO very seriously, but don't count on making money through SEO for the first few months. PPC Gets you more motivated sellers than Facebook ads.Facebook ads gets you more motivated sellers than PPC or cold calling.And SEO beats everything... (but it takes time).Especially when you are first starting out you really can't afford to invest in strategies designed to make you fail!

John P. · Answer

@Jerryll Noorden Thanks for the response. I am not naive to think that direct mail to people from a list is a "motivated seller" lead since this is all outbound marketing and more of a shotgun approach. I was simply asking the question to get a good starting point for using a list to begin my marketing. You are correct in that people do not give specifics from their own systems on the podcasts. Any type of marketing is a test and requires repetition. Like others I use the podcast interviews to get an idea of what people are doing and the different ways to market. Since I am just starting out I thought I could draw on this forum for some help with a question. I am not a "sheep" as you suggested and I have years of business and marketing experience as an entrepreneur and business owner. I am however new to Real Estate. You have to start somewhere though and here I am.I assume by your post you would suggest more marketing to target inbound leads from motivated sellers through SEO and PPC, which I have experience with as well in my other businesses. I'd be interested to get your take on starting out with these types of marketing channels for a wholesale business if you would like to share.Thanks, John

Jerryll Noorden · Answer

Amy I made a simple visualization of DMM in action.The point here is this. If you send out anywhere between 0 and 5K, you are playing against the house and although you can get lucky, you will be struggling. Of course these are based on a few assumed input variables, but I believe this accurately paints a scary picture using DMM.The lesson here is that unless you send 10K+ mailers, you are not really getting anywhere.

Amy Aziz · Answer

@John Peroyea I just do bulk mailers but I send out a lot! It keeps me pretty occupied :)