Tired of my money not working for me in Toronto, Canada - looking to diversify in USA

[Kris Lou]

Hi,

My wife and I are real estate investors from Canada. Finding good deals here is like finding a needle in a haystack. Everything is stacked against you here. Taxes, tenant laws, prices of properties. It no longer makes sense to buy here.

Anyways, we are in the process of liquidating most of our assets here and our plan is to start buying in Indiana. We plan on doing a trip for a few weeks to get to know Indianapolis more. We have driven through Michigan City, Gary and South Bend. 

Would love to join a community of investors and pick your brains about neighborhoods, things to look out for, contractors, property managers, etc.

If anyone is interested in connecting, please let me know!

Kris

[Jason Wray]

Kris,

Hey I do a ton of investing on Indy and have a lot of connections if your looking to expand and Network.  Send me a PM or email me just go to my profile page.

[Gloria N Gear]

Hi Kris,  I would be happy to drive you around Indianapolis and show you the transitioning neighborhoods when you come to visit.  I have 4 other investors from the Toronto area that I work with.  I will send you a PM.

[Drew Sygit]

@Kris Lou we work with a LOT of Toronto area investors here in the Metro Detroit area - we're only a 3-4 hour drive away!

No matter where you choose to invest, please keep in mind the following (copy & paste):

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Recommend you first figure out the property Class you want to invest in, THEN figure out the corresponding location to invest in.

Property Class will typically dictate the Class of tenant you get, which greatly IMPACTS rental income stability and property maintenance/damage by tenants.

If you apply Class A assumptions to a Class B or C purchase, your expectations won’t be met and it may be a financial disaster.

If you buy/renovate a Class A property in Class D area, what quality of tenant will you get?

Similarly, if you put all Class D tenants in a Class A 4-plex, what do you think will happen?

So, when investing in areas they don’t really know, investors should research the different property Class submarkets.

Here’s our OPINION for the Metro Detroit market (use as a template for your target area!) that we’ve learned in our 24 years, managing almost 700 doors across the Metro Detroit area, including almost 100 S8 leases.:

Class A Properties:
Cashflow vs Appreciation: Typically, 3-5 years for positive cashflow, but you get highest relative rent & value appreciation.
Vacancy Est: Historically 10%, 5% the more recent norm.
Tenant Pool: Majority will have FICO scores of 680+ (roughly 5% probability of default), zero evictions in last 7 years.

Class B Properties:
Cashflow vs Appreciation: Typically, decent amount of relative rent & value appreciation.
Vacancy Est: Historically 10%, 5% should be applied only if proper research done to support.
Tenant Pool: Majority will have FICO scores of 620-680 (around 10% probability of default), some blemishes, but should have no evictions in last 5 years

Class C Properties:
Cashflow vs Appreciation: Typically, high cashflow and at the lower end of relative rent & value appreciation. Can try to reposition to Class B, but neighborhood may impede these efforts.
Vacancy Est: Historically 10%, but 15-20% should be used to also cover tenant nonpayment, eviction costs & damages.
Tenant Pool: majority will have FICO scores of 560-620 (approaching 22% probability of default), many blemishes, but should have no evictions in last 2 years. Verifying last 2 years of rental history very important! Also, focus on 2 years of job/income stability.

Class D Properties:
Cashflow vs Appreciation: Typically, all cashflow with little, maybe even negative, relative rent & value appreciation
Vacancy Est: 20%+ should be used to cover nonpayment, evictions & damages.
Tenant Pool: majority will have FICO scores under 560 (almost 30% probability of default), little to no good tradelines, lots of collections & chargeoffs, recent evictions. Verifying last 2 years of rental history and income extremely important to find the “best of the worst”.

Make sure you understand the Class of properties you are looking at and the corresponding results to expect.

The City of Detroit has 183 Neighborhoods we’ve analyzed.

PM us if you’d like to discuss this logical approach in greater detail!

[Stephen DiJulius]

Quote from @Kris Lou:

Hi,

My wife and I are real estate investors from Canada. Finding good deals here is like finding a needle in a haystack. Everything is stacked against you here. Taxes, tenant laws, prices of properties. It no longer makes sense to buy here.

Anyways, we are in the process of liquidating most of our assets here and our plan is to start buying in Indiana. We plan on doing a trip for a few weeks to get to know Indianapolis more. We have driven through Michigan City, Gary and South Bend. 

Would love to join a community of investors and pick your brains about neighborhoods, things to look out for, contractors, property managers, etc.

If anyone is interested in connecting, please let me know!

Kris

 Hey Kris - I'm the owner of a brokerage in South Bend that specializes in working with out of state investors. I'd be happy to jump on a call to chat if you want. PM me. Best of luck.

[Travis Biziorek]

Hey Kris,

I totally get where you're coming from—I live in California, and it's a similar story here. Finding good deals is nearly impossible with the prices, tenant laws, and taxes working against us.

Since you're considering the Midwest, I'd definitely suggest keeping Detroit on your radar. I've been investing there since 2019, and there's a lot going for it. Property prices are still very affordable, which makes it great for BRRRR or buy-and-hold strategies. The rent-to-price ratios here make cash flow realistic, and there's a lot of revitalization happening that adds appreciation potential.

Detroit’s population is officially growing again, and there’s strong rental demand, especially in neighborhoods seeing more development. It’s been a good blend of cash flow and appreciation for me, and it might be worth checking out as part of your trip to the Midwest.

If you want to chat more about Detroit, feel free to reach out. I’m happy to share more insight to help you get a sense of the market.

Hope this helps!

[Kris Lou]

Thank you all for your responses, and apologies for the delayed reply. My wife and I just returned from our honeymoon in the Maldives and Sri Lanka.

I’d like to clarify our goals. We’re planning to move to Europe to start our family, and we’re looking to generate $1,000–$2,000 USD/month in net income (after management fees and other expenses) with these RE investments. This won’t be our sole income but a supplementary one to help support us overseas.  Our focus is on cash-flowing properties, particularly multifamily properties that meet the 1% rule. We’re open to considering Section 8 rentals if they align with our goals.

Our initial plan is to purchase one or two properties outright with cash, although we’re still open to financing options if the right opportunity arises.

We’re planning a 1- to 2-week trip soon to explore Indiana and get a feel for different cities and neighborhoods.

I’d really appreciate your honest feedback. Do you think generating $1,000–$2,000 USD net income per month is a realistic goal?

Thank you,

Kris

[Jake Baker]

@Kris Lou

I recommend finding local meetups to attend. https://www.biggerpockets.com/forums/521
I have found all of my best connections at local meetups.