Contractor threatens to place lien & call city for code violation

Contractor threatens to place lien & call city for code violation

Investor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2020 · 30 posts · 15 votes

Hi all, have a situation here where the contractor that did the work on my property is now threatening to file a lien and also call the city for multiple code violations because I am not agreeing to pay the full amount of his last draw. Here's some background. I' m not seeking formal legal advice, just thoughts and opinions from people who have dealt with **** contractors that have tried to jump scare them and how they would handle this situation. 

I hired a contractor a few months ago to rehab a pretty beat up property I just bought. It was supposed to be done in 6 weeks but the contract stated 8 weeks. Fine. But the project went 2 months overboard. There were multiple days, and even weeks, where no work was performed at all, no progress made. I'm out of state so I relied on my project manager to walk it. By week 4 it was clear that he and his crew were slacking but would never provide answers as to why work wasn't done, even though it was pointed out to them. He then started to evade us - phone calls, texts, wouldn't show up at the house when we walked it. Before you say I should have fired him (I wish I did) - I fronted all materials so he had that above my head. It's my first big rehab & brrrr so lesson learned and there was no bonus/penalty structure embedded in the contract. As the project went onwards (and consequently remained delayed), his communication and attitude got even worse. We just didn't know what the hell was going on but we were deep in it it with him and it would be taken more time to get someone else in there to finish it and costlier as well. So I had to stick with him. I missed about 7 weeks of rent on the 2 units (it's a duplex), lost 1 tenant who - because the unit wasn't 100% ready like it was supposed to be - decided not to move forward, and was at risk of losing the other tenant because his move in date kept getting pushed off, had to live without water once he did move in, and dealt with a lot of disturbances all due to this contractor and his negligence to just finish it on time. 

Today the work is finally done and the second unit's tenants moving in tomorrow and he has been haggling me to pay him his last draw combined with some out of scope work for a total of 8k. I have been keeping track of all expenses in and out of scope, all change orders, and payments made. From the 8k I deducted all the rents I missed out on due to his failure to not finish by the date in the contract (I prorated it carefully) and I deducted work that was in the original scope that I paid for but was not done (either due to the tenant already moving in and not wanting to be disturbed or just not done properly). The final total came out to under 2k. I knew this would be upsetting to him but thus far I've been good on all my payments, I fronted materials + first draw before work ever began, I paid other draws and change orders before work was even completed despite the awful communication, delays, and just blatant disregard for deadlines, timelines, and tenants. He just did not give a F*** throughout this project and only did work when he wanted to, was accessible only on his own time. Me deducting from his pay was not out of pettiness but out of - I thought - justified reasons. We signed a contract. He didn't uphold it. And this is the consequence. I am not deducing the additional interest I've had to pay for privately borrowed money, extra project management fees, taxes, insurance, etc that I've had to pay due to the delay. 

He is now threatening to place a lien. I said okay, take me to court because I have the contract and other proof in writing, as well as pics of unsatisfactory work. It is unclear if he's licensed or unlicensed (I did ask my PM to verify this) but he did all the electrical and plumbing work on the house - and did not pull permits. My assumption is if he tries to file a complaint against me then it gets revealed that he didn't do things by the books either. I can say I didn't know any better? The contract has language that states he will pull all necessary permits needed, and signed off on that, so I think that makes him liable. I think for the most part he's bluffing and trying to scare me. The one thing I'm uncertain and a bit nervous about is - if he does call the city, can they just take his or really anyone's word and do an inspection? The house is old. It's in Ohio. Many, many old houses in the area and city and region really are not up to code - but that's not to say it's unsafe. Rather, I have approved any and all work that has come up during the rehab outside of scope to make sure that the home is safe for people to habit. But not sure if the plumbing is up to code because of old pipes, and there was no reason to redo the entire system if it was functional. Now according to the contractor, he says electrical, plumbing, water main, foundation is all violating city code and that they'll come and tag this house as unlivable and I'll have to pay many fines along with not being able to collect rents.

What are your thoughts on this? Any action I can take or do I wait & see if he actually does place a lien, or wait for the city to call me? 

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Investor · Greenville, SC · Member since 2016 · 5k+ posts · 13k+ votes
3y

Follow the contract.  Pay the last draw and preapproved out of scope work and move on.  There's no contractual penalty for delays.  The length of your post and your position is one of emotion...and rightfully so but no contractual basis for it...and this is common practice in the industry.  Getting reasonable cost, done right, and on time never happens...getting two of three is a win.  

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  • Rod HanksBusiness Member
    Insurance Agent · Dallas, TX · Member since 2013 · 743 posts · 462 votes
    3y
    Quote from @Puja Devi:

    Hi all, have a situation here where the contractor that did the work on my property is now threatening to file a lien and also call the city for multiple code violations because I am not agreeing to pay the full amount of his last draw. Here's some background. I' m not seeking formal legal advice, just thoughts and opinions from people who have dealt with **** contractors that have tried to jump scare them and how they would handle this situation. 

    I hired a contractor a few months ago to rehab a pretty beat up property I just bought. It was supposed to be done in 6 weeks but the contract stated 8 weeks. Fine. But the project went 2 months overboard. There were multiple days, and even weeks, where no work was performed at all, no progress made. I'm out of state so I relied on my project manager to walk it. By week 4 it was clear that he and his crew were slacking but would never provide answers as to why work wasn't done, even though it was pointed out to them. He then started to evade us - phone calls, texts, wouldn't show up at the house when we walked it. Before you say I should have fired him (I wish I did) - I fronted all materials so he had that above my head. It's my first big rehab & brrrr so lesson learned and there was no bonus/penalty structure embedded in the contract. As the project went onwards (and consequently remained delayed), his communication and attitude got even worse. We just didn't know what the hell was going on but we were deep in it it with him and it would be taken more time to get someone else in there to finish it and costlier as well. So I had to stick with him. I missed about 7 weeks of rent on the 2 units (it's a duplex), lost 1 tenant who - because the unit wasn't 100% ready like it was supposed to be - decided not to move forward, and was at risk of losing the other tenant because his move in date kept getting pushed off, had to live without water once he did move in, and dealt with a lot of disturbances all due to this contractor and his negligence to just finish it on time. 

    Today the work is finally done and the second unit's tenants moving in tomorrow and he has been haggling me to pay him his last draw combined with some out of scope work for a total of 8k. I have been keeping track of all expenses in and out of scope, all change orders, and payments made. From the 8k I deducted all the rents I missed out on due to his failure to not finish by the date in the contract (I prorated it carefully) and I deducted work that was in the original scope that I paid for but was not done (either due to the tenant already moving in and not wanting to be disturbed or just not done properly). The final total came out to under 2k. I knew this would be upsetting to him but thus far I've been good on all my payments, I fronted materials + first draw before work ever began, I paid other draws and change orders before work was even completed despite the awful communication, delays, and just blatant disregard for deadlines, timelines, and tenants. He just did not give a F*** throughout this project and only did work when he wanted to, was accessible only on his own time. Me deducting from his pay was not out of pettiness but out of - I thought - justified reasons. We signed a contract. He didn't uphold it. And this is the consequence. I am not deducing the additional interest I've had to pay for privately borrowed money, extra project management fees, taxes, insurance, etc that I've had to pay due to the delay. 

    He is now threatening to place a lien. I said okay, take me to court because I have the contract and other proof in writing, as well as pics of unsatisfactory work. It is unclear if he's licensed or unlicensed (I did ask my PM to verify this) but he did all the electrical and plumbing work on the house - and did not pull permits. My assumption is if he tries to file a complaint against me then it gets revealed that he didn't do things by the books either. I can say I didn't know any better? The contract has language that states he will pull all necessary permits needed, and signed off on that, so I think that makes him liable. I think for the most part he's bluffing and trying to scare me. The one thing I'm uncertain and a bit nervous about is - if he does call the city, can they just take his or really anyone's word and do an inspection? The house is old. It's in Ohio. Many, many old houses in the area and city and region really are not up to code - but that's not to say it's unsafe. Rather, I have approved any and all work that has come up during the rehab outside of scope to make sure that the home is safe for people to habit. But not sure if the plumbing is up to code because of old pipes, and there was no reason to redo the entire system if it was functional. Now according to the contractor, he says electrical, plumbing, water main, foundation is all violating city code and that they'll come and tag this house as unlivable and I'll have to pay many fines along with not being able to collect rents.

    What are your thoughts on this? Any action I can take or do I wait & see if he actually does place a lien, or wait for the city to call me? 

    I would follow the contract word for word. If there is a time deadline for completion of repairs along with penalties stated etc. then make the deductions. If he places a lien on the property and it’s fraudulent it won’t be good for him. If he calls the city, so what, I’m sure you want the property city approved. I’ve had a similar situation in the past and I called him on his BS and never heard back from him. Don’t let him try to intimidate you into paying what you don’t owe, this is business.
    Rod Hanks Insurance4.9153 Reviews
  • Contractor · AZ · Member since 2022 · 215 posts · 185 votes
    3y

    My 2 cents as a contractor... the contract language said nothing about bonuses and penalties for timeliness, so I'm not sure you have any recourse here as long as the SoW was completed with acceptable quality. Plus, it sounds like you approved a number of change orders. I have language in all of my contracts that says the original completion date is invalidated as soon as the customer starts making change orders.

    I'm not saying that his unresponsiveness is excusable or that going 2x over the timeline is okay. But generally when working with contractors on big remodels you should expect some delays and as long as they're communicating those issues with you it's pretty normal. Factor that into your next BRRR.

    I call BS on a contractor threatening to report their own work to the city... they'd be cutting off their nose to spite their face. But a mechanic's lien... that's fair game. 

    IMO if he completed the work then pay the agreed upon amount and move on.

  • Rental Property Investor · Russellville, AR · Member since 2014 · 684 posts · 509 votes
    3y

    That's a tough spot.  I wouldn't worry too much about the city.  First, you should want your property to be legal and safe.  Secondly, since he did the work he would only be hurting himself.  Unfortunately, there's probably not much you can do.  He could argue they went over because the scope of work changed.  Small claims court might take your side a little since you have a record of him not showing up to appointments and being non-responsive to information requests.

    There is likely a state contractor's board you can report him to.  You could file a complaint.  It likely won't get you anything, but it will be a blemish on his record which might help the next customer he treats like this.

  • Contractor · AZ · Member since 2022 · 215 posts · 185 votes
    3y
    Quote from @Billy Daniel:

    There is likely a state contractor's board you can report him to.  You could file a complaint.  It likely won't get you anything, but it will be a blemish on his record which might help the next customer he treats like this.

     You could file a complaint, but before you do consider a few things:

    (Note - my knowledge is based on the rules in AZ but most states are pretty similar)

    1) Investors are not eligible for payouts from the Recovery Fund, so filing a complaint to the state licensing agency will get you precisely $0 unless you plan to use this property as your primary residence. 

    2) Based on the original post, the only strike against him is that he went over schedule. That's unfortunate, but not uncommon in this market. It may also be unenforceable depending on what changes you made to the SoW. If there were additional issues (blatant code violations, theft, etc.) you might have a case for yourself, but I doubt the licensing agency will pay much attention to a complaint about a project that ran over schedule. 

    3) The 2 fastest ways to get on a contractors bad side are 1) not paying them and 2) threatening their license. Contractors talk. If word gets around that you're doing these 2 things you could be burning bridges that you'll need for the next BRRR or flip in that town.

  • Investor · Ashburn, VA · Member since 2020 · 140 posts · 145 votes
    3y
    Quote from @Ryan Normand:

    My 2 cents as a contractor... the contract language said nothing about bonuses and penalties for timeliness, so I'm not sure you have any recourse here as long as the SoW was completed with acceptable quality. Plus, it sounds like you approved a number of change orders. I have language in all of my contracts that says the original completion date is invalidated as soon as the customer starts making change orders.

    I'm not saying that his unresponsiveness is excusable or that going 2x over the timeline is okay. But generally when working with contractors on big remodels you should expect some delays and as long as they're communicating those issues with you it's pretty normal. Factor that into your next BRRR.

    I call BS on a contractor threatening to report their own work to the city... they'd be cutting off their nose to spite their face. But a mechanic's lien... that's fair game. 

    IMO if he completed the work then pay the agreed upon amount and move on.


     I agree with this completely. I would probably have a conversation with the contractor (they seem to be a lot more responsive when money is owed to them) and just ask him about all the things that went wrong, the lost rent from the delay, etc. and try to get him to come down on his price and meet somewhere in the middle. If he's completely irrational and illogical then this likely won't work. 

    I think 2 things are true at once; he did a horrible job and doesn't deserve the full $8k, and nothing in the contract was really broken. It sucks but this is probably a learning lesson to add verbiage into your contract moving forward to prevent this from happening with future contractors. 

    I had a similar issue where I used these attorneys years ago for something and they sent me a bill that was about 4x what I thought it would be, and some things they charged me for were ridiculous. It ruined my day, I yelled and screamed, but then I paid it, moved on and forgot about it. In hindsight, that was a way better decision than if I decided to fight it and get into a mud wrestling match with them. Same likely applies here too. Best of luck to you!

  • Investor · Greenville, SC · Member since 2016 · 5k+ posts · 13k+ votes
    3y

    Follow the contract.  Pay the last draw and preapproved out of scope work and move on.  There's no contractual penalty for delays.  The length of your post and your position is one of emotion...and rightfully so but no contractual basis for it...and this is common practice in the industry.  Getting reasonable cost, done right, and on time never happens...getting two of three is a win.  

  • Real Estate Professional · West Palm Beach, FL · Member since 2012 · 23k+ posts · 13k+ votes
    3y

    @Puja Devi As others have said, you won’t recover lost rents. Pay him for Xacrly the work was done, correctly….no more, no less.

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