Education U.S. style, imo and Beck's.

[Rich Weese]

I was originally going to post this in the Glenn Beck mall thread. Decided it would not really fit, since this was developed from a tangent that developed in previous thread.

TC and others- I've decided that well thought out and documented posts and challenges don't work in politics threads. That is too bad. I don't mind debating questions and facts. I do feel it is a waste of time debating the name caller silliness regarding Beck etal. Just silly.
I give JScott some credit for at least replying point by point on some items and I tried to do the same on points listed by J. I didn't "shrug" my shoulders bytheway. I don't have the time to look up all the links, as I'm lousy on this stuff and have admitted it many times.
So, I'll try one more time with a different approach. Much shorter.

To Bryan- "anyone that associates with Beck or his views is an idiot". OK- That is REALLY a wide brush.

Gallup poll in dec 09 listed Beck as the FOURTH most admired person in the WORLD! A year more of antagonizing the Libs probably will have moved him up, but 4th is a fact for now. That is just ahead of # 5, Pope Benedict XVI. Boy, their are a lot of idiots out there. If only the Pope had a few more followers, he might pass Beck.

With that stand, it is hard to imagine a fact based discussion with you. Attack the messenger just won't work for you, or obama, or dems. Public is on to that and it'll show in Nov., imo.

JScott- I'd really enjoy a sit down session with you and have a back and forth discussion or debate. Maybe sometime. So, many unanswered points in thois thread that are too time consuming for you or I. SO,,,,I want to try different approach, single subject, and see how it goes.

U.S. education system sucks and has deteriorated in past 50 years greatly.(topic).
My thoughts---

We continue to throw more money in the pot and that DOESN'T work. We currently spend nearly FOUR times as much money per student now than in the 60's. Has that helped? Have math and reading scores improved? Have graduation rates improved? No. So, do we spend more money without any requirement for the progress to be tracked?

Census bureau reported U.S. spends $9,138 per student in 2006. Others claim it is twice that, but we'll use their #.

Now, does more money help? Here is a comparison of 2 states--#1 in spending per student, NY at $14,884 and # FIFTY, ut at $5,437 per student-1/3 of NY.
You'd imagine that NY would slam UT if money was the answer. Here are results in scores.

grade subject NY UT U.S. avg

4 math 238 239 237
4 reading 223 221 217
8 math 280 279 278
8 reading 265 262 260

Yes. NY SLIGHTLY beats UT in 3 of 4. BUT, UT beats U.S. avg in ALL 4.
It appears $$$$ is not the answer.

Now, should we diamantle the DOE? Has it been beneficial? How did it come about?

Where is that covered in the Constitution that the feds should oversee our kids' education? Do they do better than local and states would do? The feds have ZERO Constitutional authority to be in the education system. Jimmy Carter is the one that instituted that gigantic govt bureaucracy by the slimmest of margins.. By 4 votes in the House, the DOE was started and has grown by leaps and bounds since. Was this helpful?

Now, how well has this system worked over the past 50 years? We have 32 MILLION residents that can't read or write.

Over ONE MILLION incoming college students require remedial courses just to catch up.Even after all the $$$$ thrown at the problem, American taxpayers pay an additional 2.5 billion PER YEAR to help these "idiots" catch up.

Last point- a friend of the current pres, and a PROFESSOR, William Ayers (we know this name) said in a speech in2006 (standing next to Hugo Chavez)

"education is the motor-force of revolution."

These are the things that make me very concerned about our education system, and make me fear for those mush heads that the colleges are turning out. J, please don't pick THIS one sentence as the only one to respond to.

Others may agree or disagree, but NO attacks on the messenger. (notice I didn't attack Ayers, but simply quoted him, although I REALLY wanted to). Have a great week.
I think I was civil in this post and hope others will follow the same path. Rich