Workers Comp Waiver Forms?

Question

Good morning all, I listened to episode 442 of the podcast a couple of weeks ago in which Bryce Stewart brought up the importance of workers comp waiver forms. I own properties in New York state and Oregon and I hire individuals to do work in each state (snow shoveling/plowing, lawn mowing, cleaning, etc.). Do others utilize workers comp waiver forms? Is this something that I should be doing? Are there other/better ways to protect myself? For context a own a total of four properties (10 units). Thanks!

Waylon Zook · Answer

@Todd Ashley as owner of a company in IN i have a waiver for workmans comp. Any employees I may have need to be covered tho.

Others states laws may be different.

Courtney Duong · Answer

Following.   A contractor I know just told me one of his workers just threaten to sue him for $20K for injury he got from using the pressure nail gun while working at a house of another landlord.  So we definitely need to have a waiver form handy to use in the future.

Yacine Rimmo · Answer

@Chris K. Thanks you for your insight.

Sounds like a contract defining a contractor as "not an employee" would be useless.

Would a workers comp waiver be useful maybe? It sounds like @Bryce Stewart found a way somehow.

Attorneys I reached out to aren't really getting back to me on this it seems.Would you have an idea of a good source to find or have established such waiver of workers comp

Yacine Rimmo · Answer

Thanks for your reply @Chris K. and nice cat!

Sounds like insurance brokers don't provide this paper at least the one I work with doesn't.

The point of the document we are looking for is to be covered against a WC claim from anyone working on one of our properties such as handyman or else.

Yacine Rimmo · Answer

Hey @John Fider, I have a few rentals in Allentown in PA. Did you ever find out about that workers comp waiver form for our state?

I contacted a lawyer in the area, talked to him, followed up, but never heard back from him...

If someone can recommend a professional in Pennsylvania who is familiar with this document that would be awesome.

Wayne Brooks · Answer

WC Waivers are state specific and each state has their own laws regarding it.

John Fider · Answer

I just asked my insurance guy and unfortunately he has never heard of it. I'm about to post a very similar post in the forum to try and find anyone in the BP community who has utilized this form.

Todd Ashley · Answer

Thanks for bumping this, I was surprised I did not receive any responses. Interesting that your insurance rep has never heard of it...

John Mocker · Answer

Todd,

The Workers comp laws are state specific.  In NY as in most states, the employer is required to provide coverage for all employees.  The Workers comp laws define who is an employee and and the Workers Comp. board will determine the injured person's status.  They use tests of who controls the work, how they were paid, did they supply their own tools, do they work for others, who supplied the materials, is there a contract, etc...   The tests are based on the information at the time of loss.   You really need to discuss this with your agent and attorney to see what course of action might be best:

1. Use only contractors with workers comp (make sure the owner is not excluded) and get proof

2. Get your own policy and be prepared to get charged for any uninsured subs (in NY you will probably have to purchase a NY Disability policy as well as the WC)

or some other course of action

Chris K. · Answer

@Yacine Rimmo and @Todd Ashley

This is the verbatim excerpt from the said podcast:Bryce Stewart:So it was trying and difficult. And the number one point I walked away with was either you have to have somebody who has an insurance certificate that they’re sending to you. Or if you’re having somebody do side work on one of your properties and they’re not an insured contractor because the kind of work that they’re doing is not something that’s insured, you want to have somebody, and talk to your insurance agents about this, you want somebody who has what’s called a workers’ compensation waiver form. It’s them agreeing to not pursue a workers’ comp claim if they happen to be injured. They’re waiving their right to workers’ compensation. So talk to your insurance agent about a workers comp waiver form.There’s probably some big investors out there right now who tomorrow are having people doing work in their properties who do not have a certificate or it’s somebody’s cousin helping them do demo because they’re doing demolition on a unit and the person doesn’t have adequate medical insurance. Guys, this is so important that I actually wrote a song that I’m going to play for.Based on what he wrote, I believe he is making the contractors sign something like this: https://grubermotors.com/media...

Essentially the form makes contractors state that they: (1) are independent contractors; (2) don't have workers comp coverage for themselves on the basis that they are owners/sole proprietors; and (3) will not pursue (or acknowledge that they won't receive) workers comp benefit from the owner.

These forms serve a few purposes. If you actually own a business and have workers comp insurance, your premiums can increase after an annual audit if you don't get the independent contractors to either: (1) provide a COI with workers comp; or (2) sign these waivers. It could also be a way to establish that the contractors in question is an independent contractors versus an employee. But having the contractor sign this form wouldn't be the dispositive issue for whether he or she is an independent contractor. Disclaimer: While I’m an attorney licensed to practice in PA, I’m not your attorney. What I wrote above does not create an attorney/client relationship between us. I wrote the above for informational purposes. Do not rely on it for legal advice. Always consult with your attorney before you rely on the above information.