Replacing AC/Heater?

Question

Quick question--

We rehabbed a place about a year ago with a window air conditioner. We're in TX and air conditioning is a necessity with heat needed only a few weeks out of the year. The attic space is extremely tiny (only 3 ft. at the peak) so we decided to go with another through the wall unit with a heat strip.

The model we bought is a Frigidaire and has been nothing but trouble. I'm ready to toss it to the street and find something else. Surely with all the new technology these days there's *something* new, wonderful and energy efficient to heat and cool a small home  :roll:

Our wonderful tenant called today and the heat isn't working... *again*...

The place is 700 sq ft-- any recommendations?

Christian Malesic · Answer

We have almost exclusively replaced all other heat sources with BB heat.  We just did 7 apartments this past year, leaving only 3 in our inventory not done.

Just 2 weeks ago, a tenant in one of the remaining 3 complained of no heat.  We had a HVAC guy (whom we trust) go out and he replaced the starter for $168.  One week to the day later, the tenant called and it was not working again, the HVAC guy went out and replaced another widget for another $200.  After 2 more days, no heat.

Needless to say... we now have only 2 units that do not have BB heat.  We just got tired of the nickle and dime stuff with no promise of long term operation with the HVAC unit.  BTW, it was a gas furnance.

Eric Wang · Answer

I have a old gas wall furnace I like to get rid of and replace with electric heater.  Do you just remove old furnace and cap the gas line and close up the wall with drywall?  How do you handle the vent since you no longer need it?   What is the proper procedure?

Thanks,
Eric

Lynn Z · Answer

Baseboard heat in my area is very expensive and if you sell nobody wants it. 
Heat pumps do very well and are efficient.

Gas heat is the primary heat source and is expensive in some houses/apartments and reasonable in others.  Sometimes I think the ductwork/age of house etc. have so much to do with it.

Brandon Schlichter · Answer

Thanks for the advice.....

I made the mistake of listening to a HVAC guy from out of town telling me to run most of my apartments on 1 furnace...BIG mistake (About a $5000 one).

Surprisingly enough, I have 6 apartment units running off of 1 200A box and haven't had too many blown circuts.

Sounds like i'd need just about 2 circuts per unit, which wouldn't be too bad ( Would work in with me putting 100A service in each unit).

Michael Shadow · Answer

The best way to calculate the loads is to use "Manual J" it's available from www.acca.org.  I run all the heat loss calcs for my Dad's HVAC business so I just use a spread sheet that I made to do it.  It's not that complicated.  The Manual J has a spreadsheet in it that you can use.  It's just like everything else we do as REIs, crunching numbers.

Most circuits run are 20Amp but you are not allowed to run more than 80% of that full time.  Which means that on your typical 240V system you can only run 16A continually or 3840 watts max per circuit.  Typically you're looking at 2 circuits for a 1000sqft duplex, 3 for a SFH of the same size.

Like MikeOH said you need to have a minimum 100A service entrance to convert to BBE.  And there is no way it should be run on knob and tube wiring or a fuse box.

Michael Rossi · Answer

Brandon,

Lowes normally has a chart on the wall that lists the square footage covered by the different size heaters.  I would suggest going AT LEAST that big.  Older buildings that aren't well insulated can dictate bigger units than needed.  Also, you'll obviously want to consider how many heaters you can put on the circuit based on wire size.  Number 10 wire is normally good for 30 amps, so you can't put more units on the circuit than the wire can support.

Mike

Brandon Schlichter · Answer

Tom, I looked at northerntool.com and it seems atleast in my area of Ohio they're a bit more expensive than Lowes is for the same dang thing.

How do you guys calculate the needed output for the rental?

I haven't had any major complaints this year about heat (I pay for it in my big pink apartment) but I'd really like to switch over to BBE).

Mike is right, after doing research BBE is by far the BEST for rentals as long as the electric service can support it.

I took Mike's advice and bought some big DIY books, and running new wire for the units doesn't seem to be hard at all (It seemed much harder to me to begin with).

Michael Rossi · Answer

Mark,

If your electrical service doesn't have the capability to handle the baseboard heaters, then you either 1) can't install them, or 2) need to upgrade the service.

Mike

Mark Yuschak · Answer

I never thought about using baseboard heaters.  (but my brother does HVAC for a living so I get all my HVAC work done for free + materials at cost).

But, with these electric heaters, how much do you guys spend to pull new wire to power them?  What if the service panel can't support another breaker?  Or what if the home has knob and tube or a fuse panel which is full?  Do you then get the service upgraded?

Karim El Sheikh · Answer

Yea, go with baseboard heaters. They are cheap and easy to install. They get the job done as well and thats really what you need. You don't need anything super or fancy.