@Kevin Romines - You were so helpful when I refinance my primary residence in Florida.

When you know you want to secure a hard money loan (and then refinance later) do you reach out to these lenders ahead of time or after you have a deal in contract? 

This is directly comparing the HELOAN vs HELOC at 30 years with no additional payments and no refinances

Then in a couple months I can then Refinance? 

They affect DTI as well, if they are fully used up, which can pinch later when you expect to refinance out. 

I live in Phoenix and it's a really expensive growing market so my goal was more to have a place to live, fix up the property and refinance as I grow equity, as opposed to cash flowing each month.

After a year of turns and renovations, we were able to more than double rents and still keep them 20% below market.We took it to our long term lender and ordered appraisals which came in at just over $1.2M which meant I created $700k in equity (current value - current debt).The cash out refinance was $930,000 at 3.75% interest, fixed for 30 years.

Writing this post for my mother who is currently looking to do a cash out refinance on her current house.

Some that I've found that do refinance will only do it on a personal property or second home.  

Some people come with all cash from a hard money lender, then refinance.