All Forum Posts by: Scott T.

@Rich Hupper  Thanks for the (logical) clarifications, Rich. ;-) Quote: 

"The real question is the capacity the licensee is representing the parties in the transaction. If there is no fiduciary relationship formed via an agency contract, the finders fee should not have to be processed by the broker. ( I could be wrong with this about this ). A broker agent relationship agreement could still bar the salesperson from accepting these fees. Unless they went through the broker of course. The reason being.... The broker would want the salesperson to convert that party into a commissioned sale. With all that being said a finders fee I am quite sure anyone can earn but a commission only a licensee can earn from their fiduciary..." UnQ. 

That makes logical sense, because I was taught (and in order to do say a lease option agreement, separately between both you and the seller... then later reassigning your 'equitable interest' to the third party 'buyer' separately, after the fact...) so I cannot then be accused of "brokering a deal," or acting in the capacity of "consultant" (a mere advisor) for the seller.

The person I spoke with was apparently most concerned about potentially "loosing their license..." and was an agent, as were two others I've spoke to, prior. However in my defense, I had already emailed "where I was coming from," and even sent an explanatory 'terms deal' video link, the agent hadn't viewed yet, and I wasn't up to the TASK of clarifying the complexities in a coffee shop meet- up.) I didn't know HOW to explain in a few sentences that since 'referrals' to those one cannot currently work with are only 'prospects' (and not even viable leads, if they are for instance about to end- up in foreclosure, unless one also dabbles/ed in short- sales, etc., as I now see this agent does or did, for e.g.) they were no more under a LEGAL "contractual agreement" with them, or paying a "commission," than someone they 'referred to' their hair stylist... because those so- called "leads" are simply NOT clientele, until you have them "under (BINDING) contract." (Perhaps down the road after I saved their home, as one e.g.) Or 'lead list' peddlers would be in "breach of contract," with 'public disclosure,' and actually underlying LAW, vs. 'legal statues,' which aren't actual LAWS.  Thank you, sir! :-) WST

INTERESTING that it appears (to me, anyway) that they made that clause intentionally vague (i.e. "any licensed real estate broker, or broker-salesperson, or salesperson...") which was likely worded as such to "give the impression" that the industry cronies that paid for that state (or DC?) legalese, somehow now have a MONOPOLY on "non- licensed, salespeople..." and therefore, "all RE transactions," which they most certainly, DO NOT. 

@Sam Davis

Thanks for your input, Sam. :-) It sounds then like realtors (under NAR, etc. guidelines, nationwide...) are likely 'unclear' about a "non- transaction" (and that clause clearly only refers to "commission sharing" in reference to actual "under contract" clientele) and likewise my either 'promising' or 'gifting' (in effect) money or perks to someone who 'refers' a potential client they can't work with presently (when I can help that person, who may then become a RE brokerage and/or mortgage, etc. client later on, when they resell, or perhaps refer others they know, if the agent(s) HELPED THEM OUT) doesn't even seem 'grey area' to me, unless there's more 'legalese' (statues, legal precedent, case law???) I'm not finding? Afterall, it's up to every 'corporate person' to report their "earnings, expenses and deductions" on their taxes... just as it's up to say me to list the 'expense.' (If it's even 'deductible?') But my primary objective (MISSION) is to HELP those who are in 'distress...' or otherwise can't buy a home, or resell due to minimal equity, etc. so they don't end- up bankrupt, in foreclosure, or doing a short- sale, etc."And obviously there are 'independent' brokers (and agents?) who work with REIs, and are themselves Real Estate Investors, who clearly aren't "loosing their licenses."

Hello BPers,

I recently met with an experienced realtor who worked for a larger RE brokerage in Arizona that after a decade or more experience remains under the impression that a (non- licensed) investor cannot pay a realtor, etc. (I'm uncertain if that also included mortgage professionals, insurance agents, title company people, etc.?) a "finder's fee" for referring clients, or providing 'leads' or 'lists' compiled from the MLS. It seems (in my limited experience) that every time one approaches a 'realtor...' they either consider an REI a "competitor?" Or they think the NAR and MLS run the industry, and their 'brokerage' (and by extension, they...) are to "report all earnings," and somehow a PROSPECT (vs. a CLIENT) is somehow "brokerage property." If for instance wholesalers had this ATTITUDE, then I wouldn't be working with their 'dead leads' and paying them a 'finder's fee' for referrals they otherwise can do a NOTHING WITH.

Has anyone else had any 'luck' approaching realtors, lenders, credit repair specialists, et al for a mutual "win- win" when they provide contacts that YOU CAN HELP, when they CANNOT? I find this particularly 'aggravating' with RE agents, to date, because they think their employer and/ or peers are going to 'black list' them and/ or you. (Peer pressure?) Or is "taxable compensation" as well as the "treat of loosing one's license" the crux of the matter, here?! I specialize in "low to no equity" lease options, etc. And thank you for your input, in advance!  WST

Hello BPers,

I recently met with an experienced realtor who worked for a larger RE brokerage in Arizona that after a decade or more experience remains under the impression that a (non- licensed) investor cannot pay a realtor, etc. (I'm uncertain if that also included mortgage professionals, insurance agents, title company people, etc.?) a "finder's fee" for referring clients, or providing 'leads' or 'lists' compiled from the MLS. It seems (in my limited experience) that every time one approaches a 'realtor...' they either consider an REI a "competitor?" Or they think the NAR and MLS run the industry, and their 'brokerage' (and by extension, they...) are to "report all earnings," and somehow a PROSPECT (vs. a CLIENT) is somehow "brokerage property." If for instance wholesalers had this ATTITUDE, then I wouldn't be working with their 'dead leads' and paying them a 'finder's fee' for referrals they otherwise can do a NOTHING WITH.

Has anyone else had any 'luck' approaching realtors, lenders, credit repair specialists, et al for a mutual "win- win" when they provide contacts that YOU CAN HELP, when they CANNOT? I find this particularly 'aggravating' with RE agents, to date, because they think their employer and/ or peers are going to 'black list' them and/ or you. (Peer pressure?) Or is "taxable compensation" as well as the "treat of loosing one's license" the crux of the matter, here?! And thank you for your input, in advance! WST

Fellow BPers, I found Joe's videos on YouTube last night, and he has about 43 years experience: building, developing, apartment rentals, etc. (his father was a large housing builder- developer) and twenty plus years of experience doing LO deals and wholesaling, etc. What SETS HIM APART (obviously) is that he is NOT asking for $5k.- 10k. down for 'mentoring...' and is thereby really only MAKING MONEY on actual JV "deal splits..." which is what (by all rights) ALL OF the mentors should be doing, as I've told ever one I've contacted to date, and they'd be 'furthering the cause,' exponentially as well as making more money, in many instances... if they DID SO.

So far I've invested in several multi- hundred $ related courses, studied most of what's currently online, and finally (a year hence...) now have my business plan roughed- out, and will likely be contacting Joe here soon... as I'm only risking $97.00 for the LO coursebook and $25.00 a month, vs. 10- 100x that, with no guarantee of RESULTS!  His lead generation methods are 'old school' practical, proven, and I intend to combine them with the most modern approaches and virtual 'outsourcing...' then scale, and be 'disrupting' the entrenched industry, by 2020ish.

Also check- out the French's 'Link Options' program (very comprehensive!) Joe Crump (also very educational and informative) and of course Ron LeGrand's trainings and Gold Club website, in addition to Joe McCall, Brian Gibbons, etc. There is something to LEARN from every teacher, and we all have varied 'learning styles,' and thereby 'relate' to different mentors. And there are HUNDREDS or more useful training videos on "doing terms deals" just on YouTube, alone! 

Like Joe Bodek's "The Ultimate Automated Lead Machine Webinar," for example. (Simple, practical, sounds doable...) And it's TO BAD it appears (after reading three related threads on BP, and seeing "account closed...") that the "usual (type of) suspects" seem to have prompted Joe to 'close' his account here, apparently??? (Which is also WHY I no longer frequent this website, BTW...)  

Unless one also had 'access' to Post Office box and PMB information to cross reference with USPS "change of address" data... how would you be able to (accurately) determine if a place is actually "vacant..." due to a relocation, vs. say a privacy preference, or someone's passing, etc.??? It seems that looking for "staged" and "empty" MLS, FSBOs, FRBOs, etc. online would prove more accurate, and also less time consuming... if you utilize a VA at $3.USD per hour in say the Philippines, etc., vs. spending valuable time cruising the streets (at least, initially) looking for apparent, vacancies.

Also one of the standard municipal "code violations" is "high grass," for e.g. And while this might prove a good starting place... someone would be better off comparing the owners of record's info online (is the place owned by an LLC, or corporation, as a RENTAL? In FACT... that's likely what these softwares and aggregators are NOT "fact checking," and mainly then WHY they are less than 50% ACCURATE??? And then there's the potential periodic "changing of the guard" automobiles on Google, etc. maps photos...) then contacting these people via: phone, voicemail, text and mail (AND following- up at least five times) vs. driving around, door knocking, or expecting accurate (and up to date) info, from say USPS... or third parties, using the same limited data! And then there's the "market cycle." (i.e. Are you ONLY looking for 65% or less of ARV deals, near the TOP of the current "seller's market?!" If so, then GOOD LUCK!)

@Jeff Schwarz    Hey Jeff,

I actually just sent you a BP email, then recalled that I also commented on this thread, several months ago... as did you. I'm trying to discern how the REACT (reverse engineered) version of the ACTs program (I'm familiar with LeGrand's repackaging of ACTS, as well as Joe Crumps and others "cooperative" LO approaches, which all appear to be, quite similar) differs, and how one is able to find (85%) "cash buyers" for these homes... which sounds more like what Home Partners is doing (i.e. buying, then LOing them out) vs. say the LeGrand and Ianotti's, ACTS program? (i.e. How can one mostly resell homes for CASH, unless there is a institutional buyer(s) and/ or foreign investors, doing so???) I myself am planning to target cooperative lease options, collecting 2.5- 5% or so down, then moving on... unless this is a better approach?! (Then switch to buying subject to, etc. and reselling mainly via lease option, after the next "market correction..." when it's again a "buyer's market," and terms are back IN DEMAND.) 

And (based upon your comment here...) if what they're doing is securing a "non binding" agreement to simultaneously market and advertise FSBO, etc. properties, then marking them up another 5- 10%... who the heck is paying that much more for a property currently advertised FSBO for considerably, less?? And why would a seller agree to do so?? (Also, if 80%- 90% of FSBOs don't ever sell... then there really isn't much "competition," nor many "showings???") ATB :-) Scott

I'm considering investing in the Ianotti's REACT program, but still need more information and some endorsements. Since we're currently in a "seller's market," this approach seems to be the majority share of the (reverse engineered CATS) deals they're doing, since 2013 or 14. I was about to begin by 'focusing' on cooperative lease options (no credit, money down, low risk, etc.) until the next staged 'correction...' but apparently that's only around 5% of the deals they're currently doing, while 85% are near to full price (to mainly to foreign investors?) targeting FSBOs. It seems to me that $2k. is a fair upfront invest, but not without a money back "guarantee" if one "jumps through the hoops," and does the legwork that should in turn produce the RESULTS. In my view this (and not simply 'partnering' with those who don't have the investment capital, doing say 60/40% splits, until the price is paid- off) is foolish... and whomever 'reverses' this trend, will reap the lion's share of 'networking' affiliations... since "those currently, in need" tend to be FAR more MOTIVATED... to TAKE ACTION! (And clearly, now in the majority...) 

@Charles Thurber

Hey Charley! I just replied to your colleague request, sir. :-) I also know a bit about Short Term Rentals, after studying them in depth and staying in them for several months (25- 30 places, now?) and spending many hours talking with "hosts," and sharing my ideas, and background experience (business, RE, design, build, remod, STR stays, etc.) and secondly (after location) you would need to have the right floorplan, or rent the entire abode out (in your absence) and for a multi- room arrangement (vs. the entire space) I would say a single level, 3 bedroom, 2.5 bath (at minimum) to make any real money with AB&B, or VRBO, etc. as a STR. (Exception: A newly done, well appointed, located and amenitied condo, de centrale, renting the entire space, as a rule.) And allotting around $10k. in new furnishings and amenities.

A friend of mine here has (8) properties in Tempe and Gilbert, so far. She has half of them AB&B'd, and can barely keep pace, with her main house "on the Lake" (The Islands) in Gilbert, also STR'd! (4300 sf, five bedrooms, weekly and monthly rates, vs. daily...) Four or more bedrooms, nearly as many full baths, multiple en suites, and amenities such as a pool, and TVs in the rooms, a work space and good chair, etc. tend to attract the widest variety and volume of STR clientele. Another 4200sf place I recently stayed in in Gilbert had five bedrooms and six full baths, including a separate 'wing' with three bedrooms with en suite baths... The place is already booked- out for months, after only being listed on AB&B since mid Oct., 2017! And most everything should be "professionally" (pro level) done, managed, cleaned, etc. (Ultimately, it's a LOT of work!) in order to maintain "5 stars."
@Charles Thurber