All Forum Posts by: Brandon Lee

J, I said that in response to what Mike said about "a lot of folks are broke from the $25-40k/year for College and need to get this for free." The "this" he was referring to, I took to mean Fortune Builders. So my quote was regarding the fact that there is no free version of Fortune Builders. It wasn't a direct comparison to BP.

It's like I said previously, I don't think it even makes sense to compare BP with FB, they are different tools that are better fit for different individuals. 

See above --  I've never made a blanket statement that "FB is better than BP." I've only said, "if you want to go all in, FB may be a better fit."

As I mentioned in the first post about how "I am a graduate of the program", it's dismal. Which is why I said what I said about how I question FB's marketing practices, and the fact that I'm simply trying to better educate people about what FB can deliver and what the limitations are. 

I am not Fortune Builders staff, I don't know their current policy, but from what I remember 2 years ago, they have very little protection, buyer beware. 

Again. I don't 100% vouch for everything FB has done, how they go about doing it, or what they will do. I'm merely here to help people have a more realistic expectation about what it can offer. 

Active investor. Minimum of 10 investment deals closed. Must be a culture fit with FB. 

From my experience, not much. 

But again, I'm not here to defend FB and all their practices. I'm simply here to inform people to make a more educated decision. Many people (30+ people) have asked me about joining FB, I tell them that if they aren't prepared to do this full time and go all out, it may not be the best fit and they should consider alternatives like BP. Those conversations have ranged from 5 minutes to 45 minutes and many of them decided not to join by the end of the call and are probably a part of BP because of it. 

@J Scott -- Yes. I think a lot of people have a lot of opinions about Fortune Builders while having no experience in terms of what they actually deliver. 

Fortune Builders is expensive. Yes. But it is a tool, and from what I hear about all the other programs out there, it's probably one of the better ones. At the end of the day, the tool is NOT a trump card. Tools are multipliers. They amplify the person who is using it. 

Sure BP is free. It's a tool, many people benefit from it. But in the same way, it's still the people who are able to take action that will make money because of BP. Fortune Builders is no different. 

The price you pay doesn't change the fact that each individual is still responsible for the work required it takes in order to make money. 

My intent was just to convey that I think I understand the strengths and limitations of FB as a tool more than most, and people should make decisions whether they think the trade-offs between the strengths/limitations are worth the investment -- this is no different than telling someone about buy/flip VS buy/hold as an investment strategy. Each strategy has upsides and downsides, but it's ultimately up to each individual to understand those trade-offs and pick which is a better fit to reach their investment goals. 

@Mike Hurney -- I don't dispute that. But I am not Fortune Builders. The best thing I know to do is mentor people who want to get started, but I draw a very fine line between those who want the work done for them, and those who genuinely need a hand up. 

At one point I was mentoring a guy based in Sacramento whom I had never met, he just posted an ad on Craigslist because he wanted to find a mentor -- I volunteered. We've never met, we dialogued over phone/email for a while until he decided he wanted to get into buy/hold.

I did something similar with a guy that emailed me off my Craigslist ad. 

I did something similar with a lady out in NC that called me because of a similar post I made here regarding Fortune Builders. She got her first deal under contract within a week and I walked her through some protocol and how to watch for certain pitfalls. 

Fortune Builders has every right to charge whatever they charge as long as there is demand for it. I can't change that, but until someone comes out with something that is as good as FB for free, the best thing I can do is to help people make more educated decisions about whether it is a good fit for them or not. 

All flip deals --

Closed on a ~500k deal in Alameda late last year

Closed on a ~200k deal in San Pablo late last year

Closed on a ~900k deal in Orinda in January

Closed on a ~450k deal in Berkeley also in January

Should be closing on a deal in Oakland (~250k), Bay Point (~200k), and Redwood City (1.1m) within the month. 

The deals exist, they just aren't low hanging fruit and it's hard(er) to pull them off if you do this part time. 

The easiest way to get a mentor is:

1.) Asking for advice

2.) Doing it -- questions are good, no excuses.

3.) Follow up with your results

Many people do step 1. 

99% of people never do step 2.

You can guess how many do step 3.

I mentor anyone that can pull step 2 off (to date, only 2 have)

I am a graduate of the program.

It is NOT for anyone and everyone. But it certainly is NOT a scam in the sense that the material is 'wrong' or 'fake', but I would definitely question some of the statements they make in their marketing/sales efforts.

Fortune Builders' material is geared towards making a business out of flipping a home. They have quite of bit of systems, mind maps, templates, contracts, and marketing material that are turn-key. Their intent is not necessarily to make you a 'casual' flipper. This is where the value lies.

It's important to note that a lot of their material (at least when I joined) was geared towards the mid-west/east coast market. Some of the strategies they taught in their course definitely did not apply in certain markets (especially mine).

A big point to consider is that Fortune Builders pitches "coaching" as part of their course -- this was the biggest issue I had with them. When I went through the program, their 'coaching' was summed up as once a week coaching calls for 30 minutes with a coach wasn't even in my local market (most of them were on the east coast). It's imperative as a newbie to have someone accessible and knowledgeable of the local market.

When I signed up, there were 3 busloads of people who also signed up with me. That was over 2 years ago, and to this day, there are only 6-7 people that I am aware of (out of the 3 busloads) that are still doing it today.

Most people were successful because 1.) They have a business background or Real Estate background or 2.) They went in full time.

I would not contest the fact that yes, BP has great, if not the same amount of content, but to find it all in one place along with systems, a roadmap, and a support community (all the other students that have joined), that is what you are paying for.

If you want to go all-in like I did, FB is a good choice. 

If you are trying to pace yourself, stick with BP

I am a graduate of the program.

It is NOT for anyone and everyone. But it certainly is NOT a scam in the sense that the material is 'wrong' or 'fake', but I would definitely question some of the statements they make in their marketing/sales efforts.

Fortune Builders' material is geared towards making a business out of flipping a home. They have quite of bit of systems, mind maps, templates, contracts, and marketing material that are turn-key. Their intent is not necessarily to make you a 'casual' flipper. This is where the value lies.

It's important to note that a lot of their material (at least when I joined) was geared towards the mid-west/east coast market. Some of the strategies they taught in their course definitely did not apply in certain markets (especially mine).

A big point to consider is that Fortune Builders pitches "coaching" as part of their course -- this was the biggest issue I had with them. When I went through the program, their 'coaching' was summed up as once a week coaching calls for 30 minutes with a coach wasn't even in my local market (most of them were on the east coast). It's imperative as a newbie to have someone accessible and knowledgeable of the local market.

When I signed up, there were 3 busloads of people who also signed up with me. That was over 2 years ago, and to this day, there are only 6-7 people that I am aware of (out of the 3 busloads) that are still doing it today.

Most people were successful because 1.) They have a business background or Real Estate background or 2.) They went in full time.

I would not contest the fact that yes, BP has great, if not the same amount of content, but to find it all in one place along with systems, a roadmap, and a support community (all the other students that have joined), that is what you are paying for.

Like Lumi said, it really depends on your goals and how fast/hard you want to go.

If you want to go all-in like I did, FB is a good choice. 

Based on my limited exposure to the new construction space:

Big time builders/developers are building at $70-90/sqft

Institutional restoration companies rebuild at around $100-125/sqft 

High-end prefab is going at about $150-190/sqft

Multi-family prefab is going at $140-220/sqft

We have bids for high-end customs ranging from $210-250/sqft (just building to shell). 

All of that makes building so much more viable now. 

Jason,

I am a graduate of the program. 

It is NOT for anyone and everyone. But it certainly is NOT a scam in the sense that the material is 'wrong' or 'fake', but I would definitely question some of the statements they make in their marketing efforts.

Fortune Builders' material is geared towards making a business out of flipping a home. Their intent is not necessarily to make you a 'casual' flipper.

Also, a lot of their material is geared towards the mid-west/east coast market. Some of the strategies they teach in their course definitely do not apply in certain markets (especially mine).

Their 'coaching' is probably the biggest issue I have with them, what was delivered was drastically different than what they communicated they would deliver. When I went through the program, their 'coaching' was summed up as once a week coaching calls for 30 minutes with a coach that may or may not be local or understand your local market. That is imperative as a newbie to have someone accessible and knowledgeable of the local market. Even the radio advertisement said they had a "small" "local" team -- this is completely false. 

When I signed up, there were 3 busloads of people who also signed up with me. That was over 18 months ago, and to this day, there are only 6-7 people that I am aware of (out of the 3 busloads) that are still doing it today.

Most people are successful because 1.) They have a business background or Real Estate background or 2.) They went in full time.

That being said.. there is more than enough information on biggerpockets to get started in investing. The real value that FortuneBuilder really provides is business systems to streamline what you are doing and scale.

I am a graduate of the program.

It is NOT for anyone and everyone. But it certainly is NOT a scam in the sense that the material is 'wrong' or 'fake', but I would definitely question some of the statements they make in their marketing efforts.

Fortune Builders' material is geared towards making a business out of flipping a home. Their intent is not necessarily to make you a 'casual' flipper.

Also, a lot of their material is geared towards the mid-west/east coast market. Some of the strategies they teach in their course definitely do not apply in certain markets (especially mine).

A big point to consider is that Fortune Builders pitches "coaching" as part of their course. This is probably the biggest issue I have with them. When I went through the program, their 'coaching' was summed up as once a week coaching calls for 30 minutes with a coach that may or may not be local or understand your local market. That is imperative as a newbie to have someone accessible and knowledgeable of the local market... but the impression that they "sold" was that there would be someone to "hold your hand." My experience and the experience of many other students was completely the opposite.

When I signed up, there were 3 busloads of people who also signed up with me. That was over 18 months ago, and to this day, there are only 6-7 people that I am aware of (out of the 3 busloads) that are still doing it today.

Most people are successful because 1.) They have a business background or Real Estate background or 2.) They went in full time.

All that to say, there certainly value in the FB program, there are templates, systems there that you can't find elsewhere, but if you simply want to learn how to flip a house or learn about real estate investing in general, BP has a plethora of resources that are free that will be quite effective as well.

Biggest factor in your success regardless of either resource will be an accessible local mentor.

Full time.. Real Estate is my first career --

Started out through Fortune Builders (I know, right?) 18 months ago, went all-in with a business partner to do flips.

Roughed it for 6 months on our own, had our first deal under contract (from a bandit sign), HML bailed the day AFTER we were supposed to close. Called our entire buyer list, someone took over the deal the next morning. As we were talking that morning, the founder of the company offered for us to come on board with his group to learn, the rest is history.

It's been a year since that first rollercoaster deal, now directing acquisitions for the company, getting free mentorship (risk-free learning), our team has doubled from 4 to 9 in the past year, now mentoring other folks trying to get started as well.