All Forum Posts by: Warren Currier

Recently I was looking at the question you asked elsewhere: Should I Build an Apartment Complex or simply purchase something already out there, and will add a couple of thoughts from what I've collected on my own journey thus far.

Where you are matters because these issues are location specific.

If you were where I am today in South Shore, Massachusetts, I'd be able to suggest certain developments that I like (for whatever reason) and then I hit it all hard: Go deep into these companies, 'how did it all start?', ask, 'who are the original players? See what you can learn from the multitude of stories that are out there. From that track, which can be as deep and wide as you care to make it, I'd start to look at the competitors of each of these players. Perhaps doing one search whereby you enter a few of their names at the same time, will yield a number of different lists; Do they belong to the same associations? Are they LEEDS CERTIFIED? I can think of many ways to approach this, the lead-yield will be prolific. Again, the WHERE? piece, matters.

Another angle I'd attack is this:

Find some really cool building that you like ANYWHERE in the world. First: How do you find them?

I like to enter ANYTHING into a Google search and then click on 'images'. Pictures are powerful! And then scroll down and see what grabs you. Why do this?

When you see something that makes you say to yourself, "Wow, I dream of doing something like this in my lifetime!" then you click on it and learn 'all you can' in five minutes.

Take THAT information and consider WHO among these people you'd like to talk to.

For example:

You love the design concept so you learn about the architect(s) and the designer(s), the developer, the dreamer, the mastermind.... !!

Find the stories that tell how this project came to be. Many stories.

Stories vary.

Call people up and tell them that your looking for a developer for a project in XXX part of US. (I'm assuming US is your outer geographical boundary today)

These design people may assist you with some ideas and they may also ask about the details of your project.

Tell them with confidence, "I'm going to be building a eight story building overlooking the Atlantic ocean just outside of Providence, Rhode Island".

Don't primarily say, "I don't know".

If funding is mentioned I'd offer little, "A combination of private money and one particular New York bank".

You build the network as you go and you do it all so that it benefits YOU the same day you make the calls.

Where does this all lead?

Message me here and I'll give you an introduction to a guy who's building one of the coolest projects in the entire country.

I'm new to BP yet I do not think it'll be too hard for me to figure out how to get a message from you.

This time last year I stayed in a wonderful hotel in Lisbon and I've committed to build something similar here. I have found the land (over the Atlantic Ocean) and I am in contact with the brains behind the operation there. The one who first conceived it all in his mind.

My project is a longterm affair as I need to quietly buy multiple parcels over a long time horizon in order to build what I see in my hear. I do not want outside financing as I am able to proceed with my own capital.

I think you get the idea.

In addition: I have read many great responses HERE, to your post. Some seem more useful than others.

You are an investor and you need to know everything you can about the entire process. Going to school is not your 'best move' at this point. Your in a different league. Learning and school will be ongoing. When you are reading to commit to doing this you will find that 'School is everywhere you want it to be.

2 Votes

Originally posted by @Ryan McElroy:

My ultimate goal is to develop massive condominiums or apartment complexes for profit and investment purposes. I dont have much experience in development yet, just some entry level knowledge as a commercial real estate agent. My question is...

What job would give me the most/best exposure to real estate development so i can educate myself while earning a living? (im currently 25 yo)

Should i work for a developer as an acquisitions and development associate, work as a lender for a bank so i'm exposed to many deals, go back to school and get an MBA with a focus in real estate, work as a property manager learning how to manage a property...

I need the education so i feel confident and safe injecting my own money into multimillion dollar projects

0 Votes

Carlina: I enjoy reading your words as I feel an excitement you seem to have. It's wonderful! I'm new to this site as well. I see so much cool stuff to learn, so much opportunity here that I almost get confused. To your original question: It's likely that other commenters have way more experience than I will ever have in this subject. From what I recall about the property you're interested in doing something with, it seems that you really need to find a way to lock yourself into some sort of a position, something that gives you some legal footing. A simple agreement can give you what you need. (for more about that read further down). Again, I don't know this stuff like other BP people here so I will say that my ideas may be of little value, but if the place is still available I'd consider getting in front of the owner for a quiet back-of-the-envelope presentation. He or she will listen especially if they know that others are not moving forward (for whatever reasons). There may be a broker involved and they're not going to want you to present anything to the property owner. Broker or no broker you can knock on the owners door or leave a handwritten note asking then to call you. Tell him/her that you're really interested in the property and that you'd love to chat when they have a few minutes. Once you get in front of them you layout your plan as to what you feel is needed for the property to be made livable. Ask this person for a chance to pull this whole thing together. Discuss price after you skim over what you feel it will cost to make the place safe, insurable. This conversation is where YOU are earning your share of the action. You need to present and then listen. Look for the tell that will inform you how much you can offer. "Based on all that you have just told me I feel that I may be able to get you $____XX___, does feel about right?" And then you wait for their reply. If it's positive, you continue. "I'm going to need a couple of weeks to pull everything together, to price out the work required... So, if we can agree on a price right now I'll get going on my side to make it all happen. How does that sound?" If you get this far and they'll agree to sell for that certain price that you know you're going to need to get it for, next thing you do is to pull out some paper and write it up. With a small bit of consideration (I'd use a one-hundred dollar bill) you can write a simple agreement stating that THIS PERSON (the Owner of this property) will give you this exact amount of time (fill in a date in the future) to buy their house. Obviously, one month will be much better than ten days! I'd write it up and I'd take some photos of the event. Essentially, you are creating an option agreement whereby you have the option to buy this property for the amount indicated in the time period indicated. Do some due-diligence, find the records, get a title company to run a 'property profile', whatever, make sure that you are dealing with the actual owner. Oftentimes I will show MY ID to another person to show them that I am who I say I am and then I say, "Let's look at yours" in a jovial manner. Take photos and do all of this according to standard laws involving agreements. A contract, to be valid, is required to have a number of things in place. "that both parties are of sound mind".. is one, "that both parties are of age" in another. "Consideration" is important... there are basics to any agreement in US. Real Estate transactions typically need to be in writing. This is an option agreement with RE as the subject. It simply needs to be written for this to work. You need to know that you HAVE this document BUT you do not want to show this document to anyone. Once you have this document you will be uniquely in a position to have something to sell. You are NOT representing anyone but YOURSELF. You can secure offers on the property. You can secure offers on the property the very day that you get the option agreement in place. Ask yourself, "Who would make an offer on this place?" I'm guessing that the people who have the wherewithal to repair the structure could be interested (eg., foundation company owners, house movers) and even if they have no interest you can make it worth their while to suggest WHO you should contact. These company owners likely know what players would be interested in having a look. The "HOW to pull it all off from here" part is going to be done differently by different people. Having an OPTION AGREEMENT that's assignable seems to route I'd take. The key is to build a rapport with the owner.

They need to like you and they need to trust you and you need to do everything very clean so as to do right by them and make sure that they end up getting what you promised you would bring to them. I have written many words and I wish you well. Done correctly, everyone wins.

0 Votes

Originally posted by @Carlina Burford:

Originally posted by @Warren Currier:

Carlina Burford wrote about a house she saw listed somewhere and then the conversation became all about funding. Perhaps I'm really out of it but I don't understand how one NEEDS to prove that they can fund a deal in all cases. Are we simply assuming that she'll need to prove that she's got the money to buy the place? Somewhere I read (ie here) that this house is leaning or something and it has not passed inspections. My words may be off but I do not remember having to prove I had the money to buy a house I bought for $945K. I wrote and offer and the offer was accepted. The "I can't get any deals with out proof of funds" seems like a statement that is NOT based on experience, and the, "...and I can't get proof of funds without having a deal under contract" sounds ridiculous! If I have money in a bank and I go to that bank and ask for a statement stating that I have this money in my account such a declaration is easy to get AND it actually is less strong than my own bank statements on that same account that shows the money is aged. Sounds like this is a case of trying to pretend when pretending is not the answer. "Completely stuck on this one" ??

There's more, "I found a deal through a listing and am planning on wholesaling it but of course I can't submit an offer without having proof of funds". It seems like the potential with a house that is leaning may be be found in consulting with a foundation company or a house moving company. Talk to these people and get a price for fixing it all and then do whatever else a real buyer would need to do. Armed with this make your way to the owner and present a well-written offer without any contingencies.

Packaged correctly the owner of the property may want to proceed with you. Get the right paperwork signed and give them something to seal that the offer is accepted and you may have something to sell.

You need to do some legwork and apply some real creativity and followthrough.

In closing:

She writes: "I like the ideas of having the funds to back me in any case so I am glad I am learning this now, but how do I go about this?"

You can pull this off without 'having the funds to back me' and in doing so you will show people (esp., those with money) that you have a certain set of talents, and that itself will attract funds.

Warren, once again you have given me a lot of insight. And I thank you for that. I AM a newbie with very little experience which is why I come to Biggerpockets to get advice, and figuring out which way to go at times can be tough. I had looked through other forum posts to see if anything related to the question I had and didn't really find anything, so I posted my own question. I am not afraid of the legwork, so giving me that direction to go is amazing. That will be my next step. Thank you again.

Carlina: I enjoy reading your words as I feel an excitement you seem to have. It's wonderful! I'm new to this site as well. I see so much cool stuff to learn, so much opportunity here that I almost get confused. To your original question: It's likely that other commenters have way more experience than I will ever have in this subject. From what I recall about the property you're interested in doing something with it seems that you really need to find a way to lock yourself into some sort of a position, something that gives you some legal footing. A simple agreement can give you what you need. (for more about that read further down). Again, I don't know this stuff like other BP people here so I will say that my ideas may be of little value, but if the place is still available I'd consider getting in front of the owner for a quiet back-of-the-envelope presentation. He or she will listen especially if they know that others are not moving forward (for whatever reasons). There may be a broker involved and they're not going to want you to present anything to the property owner. Broker or no broker you can knock on the owners door or leave a handwritten note asking then to call you. Tell him/her that you're really interested in the property and that you'd love to chat when they have a few minutes. Once you get in front of them you layout your plan as to what you feel is needed for the property to be made livable. Ask this person for a chance to pull this whole thing together. Discuss price after you skim over what you feel it will cost to make the place safe, insurable. This conversation is where YOU are earning your share of the action. You need to present and then listen. Look for the tell that will inform you how much you can offer. "Based on all that you have just told me I feel that I may be able to get you $____XX___, does feel about right?" And then you wait for their reply. If it's positive, you continue. "I'm going to need a couple of weeks to pull everything together, to price out the work required... So, if we can agree on a price right now I'll get going on my side to make it all happen. How does that sound?" If you get this far and they'll agree to sell for that certain price that you know you're going to need to get it for, next this you do is to pull out some paper and write it up. With a small bit of consideration (I'd use a one-hundred dollar bill) you can write a simple agreement stating that THIS PERSON (the Owner of this property) will give you this exact amount of time (fill in a date in the future) to buy their house. Obviously, one month will be much better than ten days! I'd write it up and I'd take some photos of the event. Essentially, you are creating an option agreement whereby you have the option to buy this property for the amount indicated in the time period indicated. Do some due-diligence, find the records, get a title company to run a profile, whatever, make sure that you are dealing with the actual owner. Oftentimes I will show MY ID to another person to show them that I am who I say I am and then I say, "Let's look at yours" in a jovial manner. Take photos and do all of this according to standard laws involving agreements. A contract, to be valid, is required to have a number of things in place. "Sound mind".. is one, "Of age" in another. "Consideration" is important... there are basics to any agreement in US. Real Estate transactions typically need to be in writing. This is an option agreement with RE as the subject. It simply needs to be written for this to work. Once you have this document you will be uniquely in a position to have something to sell. You are NOT representing anyone but YOURSELF. You can secure offers on the property. And this is where I will leave the conversation as this is where it gets into more legal stuff. The "HOW to pull it all off from here" part is going to be done differently by different people. Having an OPTION AGREEMENT that's assignable seems to route I'd take. The key is to build a rapport with the owner.

0 Votes

Originally posted by @Valerie Hiscoe:

Carpenters who work on boats are usually highly skilled because they'e often not working with square edges. If he has experience like that, he'd be more than capable of looking after your cabinetry.

I'd hate for you to be prejudice against someone for their disability. I don't think an insurance company could legally be able to be so therefore your liability should be contained within the bounds of anyone else doing the job. If it weren't for this newfound awareness of liability and release, you might not otherwise thought of it, so you can thank him for reminding you to protect yourself.

My brother lost an arm and I can safely promise you that he accomplishes twice as much because he tries twice as hard. But i can also promise you with a fair amount of certainty that if someone has been uprooted from their life and forced to rely on social services - they are going to be fairly desperate. Its got nothing to do with their skill level or personality - its that they dont have enough money to live. My brother is lucky because thats not the case but I would hate for him to be considered a charity case just because he's trying to earn a living. So there's that.

As per payment, I like to get an idea of how much something should cost, less materials (which I usually get myself) and set a payment plan - 10-20% for showing up the first day (which doesn't always happen), another 20-30% halfway through or so, 90% when it' done, and the final 10% a couple of weeks later when the things that nobody noticed were left undone have been completed to your satisfaction. Some people add bonuses and penalties for time constraints if those are of the highest priority. Keep in mind though, that if someone is desperate and inexperienced at giving estimates, they will probably lowball it. That's not good for either of you so get more than one estimate or an example of his working on something so you can get a realistic ballpark figure.

And write a contract for exactly what, where, when, how, and by whom, no matter who ends up doing the work. And if you'e going to hire someone licensed and insured, make sure you get proof of their license and insurance.

It sounds like the man you'e contemplating to have do this work also has some creative and design experience. Don't underestimate that because he may foresee problems or options that you might not. Having been a boater myself, I know that boats are, by necessity, usually well designed.

Best of luck with your renovation.

The insurance company needs to know about the pain meds and the lack of licensure, the workmen's comp issues. They'll want to know what insurance HE has. And then they'll tell you they're NOT going to cover the homeowner if he proceeds (ie., does stupid things). Actually, if the owner were to contact the insurance company to ASK about this, he'd go on their radar. In the Northeast (US) an insurance company will surprise visit, to stop by, to check closets for electric heaters, from time to time. Coming from California I had not know this would actually happen. It does. It did happen to me! Read the agreements with the insurance company.

Be polite to the gentleman seeking work:

"I've decided to hire a contractor to do the whole thing, personally, I don't feel much like getting involved with this sort of work myself"

0 Votes

Originally posted by @Carlina BurfordWarren, once again you have given me a lot of insight. And I thank you for that. I AM a newbie with very little experience which is why I come to BiggerPockets to get advice, and figuring out which way to go at times can be tough. I had looked through other forum posts to see if anything related to the question I had and didn't really find anything, so I posted my own question. I am not afraid of the legwork, so giving me that direction to go is amazing. That will be my next step. Thank you again.

My reply:

Carlina: I enjoy reading your words as I feel an excitement you seem to have. It's wonderful! I'm new to this site as well. I see so much cool stuff to learn, so much opportunity here that I almost get confused. To your original question: It's likely that other commenters have way more experience than I will ever have in this subject. From what I recall about the property you're interested in doing something with it seems that you really need to find a way to lock yourself into some sort of a position, something that gives you some legal footing. A simple agreement can give you what you need. (for more about that read further down). Again, I don't know this stuff like other BP people here so I will say that my ideas may be of little value, but if the place is still available I'd consider getting in front of the owner for a quiet back-of-the-envelope presentation. He or she will listen especially if they know that others are not moving forward (for whatever reasons). There may be a broker involved and they're not going to want you to present anything to the property owner. Broker or no broker you can knock on the owners door or leave a handwritten note asking then to call you. Tell him/her that you're really interested in the property and that you'd love to chat when they have a few minutes. Once you get in front of them you layout your plan as to what you feel is needed for the property to be made livable. Ask this person for a chance to pull this whole thing together. Discuss price after you skim over what you feel it will cost to make the place safe, insurable. This conversation is where YOU are earning your share of the action. You need to present and then listen. Look for the tell that will inform you how much you can offer. "Based on all that you have just told me I feel that I may be able to get you $____XX___, does feel about right?" And then you wait for their reply. If it's positive, you continue. "I'm going to need a couple of weeks to pull everything together, to price out the work required... So, if we can agree on a price right now I'll get going on my side to make it all happen. How does that sound?" If you get this far and they'll agree to sell for that certain price that you know you're going to need to get it for, next this you do is to pull out some paper and write it up. With a small bit of consideration (I'd use a one-hundred dollar bill) you can write a simple agreement stating that THIS PERSON (the Owner of this property) will give you this exact amount of time (fill in a date in the future) to buy their house. Obviously, one month will be much better than ten days! I'd write it up and I'd take some photos of the event. Essentially, you are creating an option agreement whereby you have the option to buy this property for the amount indicated in the time period indicated. Do some due-diligence, find the records, get a title company to run a profile, whatever, make sure that you are dealing with the actual owner. Oftentimes I will show MY ID to another person to show them that I am who I say I am and then I say, "Let's look at yours" in a jovial manner. Take photos and do all of this according to standard laws involving agreements. A contract, to be valid, is required to have a number of things in place. "Sound mind".. is one, "Of age" in another. "Consideration" is important... there are basics to any agreement in US. Real Estate transactions typically need to be in writing. This is an option agreement with RE as the subject. It simply needs to be written for this to work. Once you have this document you will be uniquely in a position to have something to sell. You are NOT representing anyone but YOURSELF. You can secure offers on the property. And this is where I will leave the conversation as this is where it gets into more legal stuff. The "HOW to pull it all off from here" part is going to be done differently by different people. Having an OPTION AGREEMENT that's assignable seems to route I'd take. The key is to build a rapport with the owner.
They need to like you and they need to trust you and you need to do everything very clean so as to do right by them and make sure that they end up getting what you promised you would bring to them. I have written many words and I wish you well. Done correctly, everyone wins.

Warren, once again you have given me a lot of insight. And I thank you for that. I AM a newbie with very little experience which is why I come to BiggerPockets to get advice, and figuring out which way to go at times can be tough. I had looked through other forum posts to see if anything related to the question I had and didn't really find anything, so I posted my own question. I am not afraid of the legwork, so giving me that direction to go is amazing. That will be my next step. Thank you again.

Originally posted by @Warren Currier:

You need to do some legwork and apply some real creativity and followthrough.

In closing:

She writes: "I like the ideas of having the funds to back me in any case so I am glad I am learning this now, but how do I go about this?"

You can pull this off without 'having the funds to back me' and in doing so you will show people (esp., those with money) that you have a certain set of talents, and that itself will attract funds.

0 Votes

James Orr Real Estate Agent from Fort Collins, Colorado

posted 3 months ago

(Hey SBB: I found this and believe that this guy and his friend will have some get info for you!)

I am a Realtor in Fort Collins, CO. My best friend is looking to move to Salt Lake City area and I am looking for a great Realtor to refer him to. Any recommendations of a good agent that understands single family homes as investments?

Although not required, it helps if the agent knows about the Nomad investing strategy.

Thanks.

James Orr Real Estate Services LLC

2 Votes

Perhaps you can hire him to take you out on his boat and have a good time.

As for having someone working inside your home:

1) It's all on you when something goes wrong.

2) Who is paying the workman's comp?

3) What does your insurance company say about this?

0 Votes

You need to do some legwork and apply some real creativity and followthrough.

In closing:

She writes: "I like the ideas of having the funds to back me in any case so I am glad I am learning this now, but how do I go about this?"

You can pull this off without 'having the funds to back me' and in doing so you will show people (esp., those with money) that you have a certain set of talents, and that itself will attract funds.

0 Votes

All Forum Posts by: Warren Currier

Warren Currier has started 2 posts and replied 62 times.

Post: salt lake City Utah help

Post: I need experience...

Post: I need experience...

Post: I can't get any deals without proof of funds

Post: I can't get any deals without proof of funds

Post: Would you hire a guy with one leg to do your cabinets?

Post: I can't get any deals without proof of funds

Post: Best SLC Meet Up there are so many!

James Orr Real Estate Agent from Fort Collins, Colorado

Post: Would you hire a guy with one leg to do your cabinets?

Post: I can't get any deals without proof of funds