Skip to content
×
PRO
Pro Members Get Full Access!
Get off the sidelines and take action in real estate investing with BiggerPockets Pro. Our comprehensive suite of tools and resources minimize mistakes, support informed decisions, and propel you to success.
Advanced networking features
Market and Deal Finder tools
Property analysis calculators
Landlord Command Center
$0
TODAY
$69.00/month when billed monthly.
$32.50/month when billed annually.
7 day free trial. Cancel anytime
Already a Pro Member? Sign in here
Pick markets, find deals, analyze and manage properties. Try BiggerPockets PRO.
x
All Forum Categories
All Forum Categories
Followed Discussions
Followed Categories
Followed People
Followed Locations
Market News & Data
General Info
Real Estate Strategies
Landlording & Rental Properties
Real Estate Professionals
Financial, Tax, & Legal
Real Estate Classifieds
Reviews & Feedback

All Forum Posts by: Taylor Jones

Taylor Jones has started 5 posts and replied 24 times.

Post: Do people like losing money in the Smoky Mountains?

Taylor JonesPosted
  • Investor
  • Orlando, FL
  • Posts 27
  • Votes 34
Quote from @Chase Hoover:

This roast is getting a little crispy.........


 Got people commenting ;) 

Post: Do people like losing money in the Smoky Mountains?

Taylor JonesPosted
  • Investor
  • Orlando, FL
  • Posts 27
  • Votes 34
Quote from @Luke Carl:

I agree with Dave I can't imagine 30k in OpEx where did that number come from?

How big is the house?


 If you assume a 4 bedroom cabin that's ~2,500 sq ft, that's what I went off of.

OpEx includes utilities, WiFi, property maintenance, household supplies, furniture replacement when worn out, fixing broken appliance, fixing amenities that break (hot tubs, game room, movie theater, etc), CapEx issues such as Roof, HVAC, Water heater, etc.

Post: Do people like losing money in the Smoky Mountains?

Taylor JonesPosted
  • Investor
  • Orlando, FL
  • Posts 27
  • Votes 34
Quote from @Tyler Solomon:

How is your opex at $2,500 / month? $1,600 / month also seems very high for cleaning fees, however, why not bake the cleaning fee, or at least part of it, as a fee passed on the renters? 

We finance a lot of smoky mountain STR's, nearly all of which cashflow very well when properly operated, even at 80% LTV. Obviously if you come in more cash heavy on the down payment, your debt service will be lower and your cash flow would improve, but even at 80% financing with todays current interest rates, $125,000 in gross revenue should certainly be cash flow positive. If not, you have a property with an unordinary amount of operating expenses.

 


$125K in revenue includes cleaning fees collected from guests. Yes it's a pass through. But you collect a total of $125K in revenue (ADR's plus cleaning fee), you'll have to pay your cleaners invoices.

Have you tried to source quality cleaners in the Smokies lately. More cabins than cleaners, can't go cheap. 

2 turns per week at $250/turn runs you $2k/mo in cleaning

Post: Do people like losing money in the Smoky Mountains?

Taylor JonesPosted
  • Investor
  • Orlando, FL
  • Posts 27
  • Votes 34
Quote from @Jaron Walling:

$30k OpEx...? More like $3K if it's been updated or remodeled. 

Is a $20K annual cleaning fee seriously real? Asking for a friend. 


 If you have 2 turns per week on say a 4 bedroom cabin, you're probably paying $250/turn so $500/week or ~$2k/month

OpEx includes utilities, wifi, maintenance, Capex issues, household supplies, etc. No way you are running all of those for $250mo

Post: Do people like losing money in the Smoky Mountains?

Taylor JonesPosted
  • Investor
  • Orlando, FL
  • Posts 27
  • Votes 34
Quote from @Nathan Gesner:
Quote from @Taylor Jones:

I haven't checked your numbers, but I suspect a $1 million property would produce closer to $40,000 - $50,000 net per year.

I've seen people buying property these last two years that look like real stinkers, but I know some people that are still doing really well.


 How can you net $50K per year when debt, taxes, insurance alone run $78K annually?

Post: Do people like losing money in the Smoky Mountains?

Taylor JonesPosted
  • Investor
  • Orlando, FL
  • Posts 27
  • Votes 34

How does anyone buying in the Smoky Mountains make money buying today?

$1M purchase price and $125k in revenue

P/I/T payments run -$78k/yr (assuming 8% interest rate and 80% LTV)

Cleaning fees -$20k/yr

OpEx - $30k/yr

Total = $128k expenses

-$3k in cash flow.

Do people like losing money or am I missing something?

Quote from @Jordan Askew:

@Taylor Jones

You literally typed out 35.9% of $640k, which was the total purchase price


 "We bought a cabin for $640k. With a building basis of $560k, that's a $20k a year write off against $50k in cashflow on a $640k deal."

Quote from @Jordan Askew:

@Taylor Jones

Can’t depreciate land so you can’t use the $640k value in your calculation. You need to use your building basis, the portion allocated to land needs to be excluded.


 Re-read the original post. Bought for $640k and allocated a building basis in the OP.

Quote from @Josh Green:

@Taylor Jones

Is there a form or application to get a RE professional status or is it simply that you meet the requirements and thus are considered one when doing your taxes?


 I'd say consult your tax professional. My tax professional handles it for me so I don't want to misspeak

Quote from @Josh C.:

You can absolutely bonus depreciate a large percentage of the building value of the home as described by the OP. Not sure why people are saying you can’t do this. So much misinformation on this thread.

We’ve done this for years and many many people do this as well. Being a RE professional (which I am) helps, but many of our clients aren’t and if you have a killer building making good money this is a great tax strategy regardless of RE pro status. You can’t count against your W2 income usually, but you can against the building income.

Now if you have a normal W2 income and a regular sfh that makes $150/month it's probably not worth the cost seg investment. But a very profitable and expensive apartment or STR it can make a lot of sense.

This is pretty much the lifeblood of the syndication business model. Very common and the OP got it mostly right.


 Thanks Josh. Just relaying what those before me have taught. Sharing my journey and trying to be more active on here. Not looking to troll or mislead. Just sharing my journey for others.