All Forum Posts by: Bob Washington

Disclaimer: I am not licensed in TX and this is not legal or tax advice:

You really need to contact an attorney specializing in working with real estate investors, to structure an entity consistent with your specific tax planning and asset protection goals.

There are many experienced and successful folks on BP giving free advice, which is great. But you need a professional to look at your particular situation, and goals, and structure an entity to help you achieve them. Otherwise, free advice, including mine, is worth what you pay for it….

It is very expensive to setup the wrong structure, and later find that either the formation documents, or operating documents or bylaws -- which can be more important than the formation documents -- did not provide the protection or grant the authorities to do business, you thought it did--

too often, this is discovered after a tenant is suing you, and the tenant's attorney successfully "pierces the company veil" that you thought was protecting you. Once your company veil is pierced, you have no liability protection. So, seek a professional. This is not the time to be cheap.

Additionally, since CA & FL courts have started LIMITING the protections of LLCs, i.e. limiting "charging order" protection for which the LLC was formed, and since the consideration is that other states may follow FL & CA courts, you really need to talk to a tax and asset protection attorney in YOUR COUNTY, to help you PLAN your entity and your business.

Some asset protection attorneys are returning to Limited Partnerships [with INC as general partner, providing the protection and control you desire], which stand up very well when you are sued, and have literally centuries of judicial rulings upholding liability protection, when the LP rules have been followed.

Series LLC is a comparatively new entity structure, which DOES NOT have sufficient judicial rulings to say that it will in the future provide you with the liability protection you need. Yes, many attorneys are “selling†it â€" I went to school with attorneys like these, and the vast majority of the ones I’ve spoken with, do not risk their own personal investment assets with Series LLCs â€" until time determines whether courts honor the protection the new entity structure was created to provide. They’ll happily take your money to set it up for you though, if you request it.

Contact several of the local real estate investment clubs nearest you, and ask for recommendations for attorneys specializing in tax and asset protection entity structure for real estate investors.

Then, INTERVIEW the attorneys, to ascertain that they have the expertise working with real estate investors to structure entities addressing both tax and asset protection needs.

Just my ten cents. Best of luck

Bob

Financial Freedom Network I laughed at -- after reading the agreement, no comparable value for that monthly price -- 3 or so years ago, if value has changed now, my time-based disclaimer is as aforementioned -- and Legrand would do well to disconnect FFN from his name, as I believe FFN is now out-sourced, whatever.

I empathize with you , Joe and the other responders, but when I read Legrand’s, and most of the other guru’s, contracts prior to trying a teaser product, it clearly stated in the agreement that if customer did not want the upgrade service for which the teaser/free product, free video, whatever, was being given away, then customer must cancel within the stated period of time, which almost always range from 30 to 90 days [60 days is becoming more common, as more folks forget to cancel]

So long as terms to cancel are clearly stated prior to contracting, I don’t find it unethical, -- and real estate gurus have merely adapted a teaser or rebate marketing technique used in most every industry -- recently even Chrysler cars [try our minivan for 60 days! you’ve seen the ads….]. Not wanting to sound like an attorney, but companies like the teaser because they are on firm legal ground: so long as company clearly tell consumer prior to purchase when they must cancel by

[knowing statistically enough will not comply in time to make the teaser marketing profitable] be it rebates on computer software that many folks will fail to mail in, or real estate CD w/â€mentoring†or whatever that some unfortunate folks will not timely cancel, or Chrysler minivans forget to return….

Legrand was very ethical each time I or my partners have tried his teasers [no Mr. Moderator, we have no financial relationship with any guru :B ]
after we canceled promptly there were no additional billings either time.

I or a partner have done at least two of his boot-camps over the years, including his land & commercial property which helped us buy our first three land joint ventures-with-the-sellers a few years ago – never has there been subsequent illegal charges, but I do read thoroughly the agreements and immediately notate in my day-timer the required termination date for any company’s teaser or rebate.

Again, I empathize with those who had bad experiences with any company’s or guru’s teasers, but I’d suggest rather than avoiding teasers and rebates, take advantage of them! Using your throw-away prepaid credit card of course, to protect your credit, and complying with the contract terms --

I find teasers sometimes do indicate whether the subsequent seminar or product might be worth having your company purchase. Though if an individual were paying for her or himself, I’d say go with the home-study version for a fraction of the costs of the live seminar….

Okay, bring on the angry posts from all teaser-victims [wait, I said I empathize….]

Best of luck
Bob

I second Gene Trowbridge--
he's both an Esq. and a CCIM

"It’s a Whole New Business" is in it's 2nd edition... and better written than were some of my law school textbooks [less theory, more real world application]

This is not to denigrate Alan's course [it was an, interesting, read... ] but it was constructed pre-2008, before the SEC and many state regulators started becoming more viligant at monitoring the increasing number of real estate investors issuing securities [if you are raising capital from investors to invest in real estate....]

Whichever course you elect to use, or not, or self-educate, seeking out an active attorney current on your state's and federal SEC law is ESSENTIAL, before you mail out any post cards inviting folks to luncheons or otherwise ADVERTISE for investors [as Alan's course advocated when I perused it].

The red flag to state regulators is when ads appear, if the advertiser has not complied with the proper state registrations prior to soliciting investors through advertising, you've just created a HUGE target for yourself in most states.....

On the other hand, a good attorney practicing in your state's PPM or private offering realm can protect you, and review your offering to investors....and save you some stiff penalties
[you've probably heard of the one old school very successful investor, sort of the grand daddy in the private investors area, was actually shut down, for a comparatively MINOR failure to maintain proper paperwork, i.e. whether funds would be returned to investors after each project, or rolled over to the next project..., simple paperwork, had it been drafted correctly, and then proper records maintained]

Best of luck

Bob

For getting started in apartments:
"Real Estate Recipe for Buying Apartments"
[or similar]
by Brian Friedman

For the basics, for folks who are not numbers crunchers, on how to raise private capital from investors to purchase real estate, by helping investors feel comfortable with self-directed retirement accounts,
the CEO of theentrustgroup's book
"How to Invest in Real Estate..."
by Hugh Bromma
[disclaimer: this is not an endorsement of his self-directed IRA company, in fact I got started with his competitor's company and keep planning to move our accounts over, but haven't gotten round to the "rolling over"

-though persons considering raising real estate capital this way, should compare the fee structures of the top 3 administrators of the self-directing Real Estate IRAs-- as they can differ significantly, based on the number of transactions you anticipate annually...

Bob

Both I and one of my partners attended Scott's when he was first starting his national bootcamps.

He did not have a homestudy at that time.
If he does now, and it includes his software for analysis of commercial properties, I'd say consider it.
We still use the software.
By comparison, Dave Lindahul[sp] at that time at least, concentrated on mostly just apartments [though my partner liked Dave's like presentation best]
Scott covered most all commercial, not just apartments, and his wife, a former commercial lender for one of the top 3 banks, covered lending [pre-2008, so.....]. Don't know if she still presents with him.

Of the top commercial presenters, we found Scott's the most comprehensive HOWEVER, when we attended--back when he was first starting,
he missed a WHOLE Important section in the manual [he ran out of time]
and the manual, back then at least, was just an OUTLINE of topics in which attendees had to fill in the details

...and there was no home-study, at that time--
add that to how little even the most intelligent of us retain from live bootcamps, and I'd always suggest the home-study materials from any guru, rather than live [if Scott now offers it]
...unless you can clarify that the oversized manual now contains all the notes of the live presentation, or an audio is now included [it wasn't when we attended]

otherwise I can not recommend the live bootcamp,
unless it's for the analysis software, which we still use both for buyers proposals, and investor presentations when fundraising.

That said, if you're thinking of just apartments, you might look into an infinitely less expensive book:
"Real Estate Recipe for Buying Apartments"
[or similar]
by Brian Friedman....

Hope that helps

Bob

"Dandrews Capital Partners"

I usually enjoy or learn a little new from every seminar, but the aforementioned was the most negative and unpleasant I've ever attended in ten years...

That said, in your evaluation, of this or any other guru, be sure to get confirmed, in writing, before purchasing, that you are in fact ordering the level of service that fits your goals

e.g . do you seek just a course manual, or also evaluation software, right to partner and finance deals, mentoring, transactional funding, etc.

is what you want included in the basic bootcamp fee,
if not what's the upgrade fee?

compare those total fees to the other gurus to see who, if any, best offer the items you want at the best price

but also check your local REIA, even if that might mean getting over to Scottsdale - Phoenix in your case, to see if there is a local successful person willing to, or already offering mentoring in the area of commercial investing that interests you [if you've narrowed it down]

a local guru has many advantages over a national one, not the least of which is ability to verify happy past referrals that the local guru helped

and ability to introduce you to the professionals you'll need to meet as you build your team toward taking down your 1st cm'l property

BTW
What was it about Jason Gilbert's that displeased you---one of my partners was planning to check Gilbert's cm'l bootcamp out later this year?

Best of luck

Bob