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All Forum Posts by: Josh Johnston

Josh Johnston has started 4 posts and replied 51 times.

Originally posted by @Andrew Postell:

@Pablo Davidov I'll tag @Jon Crosby here too since there is so much confusion on this subject but you DO NOT have to face seasoning.  And in most cases we don't face seasoning.  Here's what I mean:

On your BUY step we usually need a loan to BUY & REHAB the property. The loans that do these steps the best will lend you 75% of the ARV of the property. So when you get to the REFINANCE step, you can absolutely, 100% refinance that amount with ZERO seasoning. None. Now, don't get me wrong here....not every bank will follow this. So when we get PREQUALIFIED, before we buy any properties, we ask them if they haves seasoning requirement for refinancing. If they do, then we go to a different lender. I hope this makes sense how I am describing all of this.

And the costs from when the property is empty is called HOLDING COSTS. So yes, calculating your HOLDING COSTS are critically important to a successful BRRRR transaction.

Anyway, I hope this helps in some way.  Feel free to ask anything additional if you need.  Thanks!

Thank you for this, Andrew! Once again, you've been a huge help to us.  My wife and I have been trying to figure out how to make this work with six month seasoning - that's just two properties a year (if you're lucky!) and this whole thread has been really helpful. Appreciate you all. 

Originally posted by @Ned Carey:

@Josh Johnston there are many types of lenders and many types of loans.  You can get loans that cover more than one property for example.

We just did one loan for three properties. That helped us because the value of the properties separately was not enough for the lenders minimum loan. By grouping three properties we were able to get a loan.

Small local banks, the kind with 1 to 5 or so branches tend to be portfolio lenders and will tend to be more flexible. 

Thanks, Ned! So much to learn.  So appreciative of this community. 

Originally posted by @Kevin Sobilo:

@Josh Johnston, I think @Andrew Postell was very much on point.

One addition I would make is that if you are concerned with portfolio lenders having an issue with the number of loans you have, then buy properties in multiple LLCs. Portfolio lenders will lend to LLCs with you as personal guarantor (like a cosigner). So, the debt is the LLC's debt not yours.

This way, each LLC can have loans and when you apply for a new loan only the loans of THAT LLC are applicable to any criteria they have with regard to number of loans.

 Oh, that's really helpful, too! Thanks, Kevin! It sounds sort of fun to own a handful of LLCs, too. Like a person who's actually making it! Here's to making it someday. Appreciate it, Kevin. 

Originally posted by @Andrew Postell:

@Josh Johnston you are on the right track here but essentially you can find loans relatively easy in the market. If you are new it might seem daunting but as you progress in your investing career you will see that money is easy...and actually finding a HOUSE is the hard step.  You will 100% be able to find loans beyond 10.  I'll help clarify the loans a little here:

Generally speaking there are 2 main types of loans for investors: “Conventional” and “Portfolio”

Conventional - I'll define these as loans that come from Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac (if you recognize those names). These loans are all 30 year fixed rate loans. They have the lowest rates we can find and since they are 30 year fixed...they allow us to cash flow better...which helps us qualify for other loans later. The draw back to these loans is that they are more paperwork heavy than the other "portfolio" types of loans....but if you have ever received a loan on your primary home, it's likely that you will go through the same type of paperwork here with conventional lending. Fannie/Freddie money = Fannie/Freddie rules. NOT the bank's own money.  The 10 loan limit is FANNIE AND FREDDIE'S limit.

Portfolio - I'll define these loans as loans that come from the bank's own "portfolio" of money. Sometimes referred to as "commercial" loans. These loans are a lot more flexible than "conventional" loans. Bank's money = Bank's rules. If they like you, then maybe they will lend to you. But since there is a limit to how much money the bank has access to....their rate will be higher...and usually a shorter term. The most common portfolio style loan in Texas is a 20 year adjustable rate loan. These loans are easier to get but the terms are different.  A lender STILL might have some type of a limit here but not as hard as Fannie/Freddie.

Fannie/Freddie types of loans will be available everywhere and those rules might change SLIGHTLY between lenders. Portfolio loans can run the gambit. Since each lender controls it’s own money you will have to call around to ALL the banks to learn about all the programs. A mortgage broker will help with this some…but even the best mortgage brokers don’t have access to ALL portfolio loans out there.

Hope this helps.  Thanks!

That was really helpful, Andrew! Thank you! It helps to hear some good news! I appreciate you. 

Hi all! I've been reading a ton and learning a lot from you all, too, but there's a part I'm stuck on, and I'm wondering if you all have solved the problem in creative ways (or maybe I'm just missing something!). 

The concept of BRRRRing is that you pay cash, rehab to up the ARV, rent, and then refinance to get all your money back out. Rinse and repeat. Genius.

But, from what it sounds like to a very (VERY) new investor, most banks will limit the amount of loans they'll give you, right? Four, five, maybe ten? The BRRRR book suggests finding a portfolio lender that won't cap your number of loans but how rare are those? Are they like infrequent but available, or incredibly rare magical mythical institutions?

So, if they are incredibly rare (which I fear they might be) once you've used your four or five (or ten) loans... how do you keep going? What have you all done? 

Yeah, I'm a new investor too, but I'd add that it would be pretty tricky to get a home at 50% ARV that only needs a paint and carpet. The general rule for flipping is 70% ARV - rehab, so this plan seems like it's counting on hitting home runs every time. Good luck out there, man!

Originally posted by @Erik W.:

@Josh Johnston, as I said in my initial post, you must be very clear that the tenant is buying rent 2 weeks at a time vs. paying twice per month.  I am emphatic about it.  It's written in our lease.  See this cut and paste below taken directly out of a lease we signed yesterday with a new tenant.  You are welcome to take it and modify it to fit your needs.  Notice, we do offer a "pay twice per month" option called Bi-monthly.  You may also notice we don't divide the rent precisely by 2.  I merely used that above as a quick example of the potential to gain one full extra month's rent over a year's lease.  I divide by 2 then round up to the nearest $10 increment for the sake of simplicity and it provides a clear signal that rent isn't simply being divided in half.  For the bi-monthly, we divide by 2 and add a 5.5% "premium" to the payment.

A 5th grader should be able to understand this...which is how I like all of my lease to read.  

I have explained to some tenants it's like buying soda at the grocery store.  If you buy a case of 24 cans, it costs $9.99.  If you buy a 12 pack, it costs $6.99.  If you buy a 6 pack, it costs $3.99.  Everyone knows that when you buy in bulk, you usually save money.  Ditto with rent.  A month is the "bulk" 24 can purchase.  Bi-weekly is like the 12 pack.

*****************************************************************************

Rent. TENANT(s) have initialed next to the rent payment plan that shall be applied to this lease agreement.

_______ $575 Monthly (pay 1 time per month), due 1st day of each month. 12 payments per calendar year.

_______ $300 Bi-monthly (pay 2 times per month), due the ______ & ______ of each month. 24 payments per calendar year.

_______ $290 Bi-weekly (pay every 2 weeks), starting ___________________, 2019. 26 payments per calendar year. TENANT understands some months will contain three bi-weekly payments.

TENANT has been informed of the different payment options and understands that each payment plan has a different total cost for a calendar year. TENANT understands and agrees that choosing the bi-weekly or bi-monthly payment plans may result in different total cost over a year’s time than paying Monthly.

*****************************************************************************

 Thanks, Erik! That's really helpful and I'm filing it away for sure. 

Originally posted by @Erik W.:

I have seen many variations on this question... "The tenant pays late....the tenant is sloppy....the tenant hoards...the tenant moved in her boyfriend/girlfriend without approval..."

The key to answering ALL of these questions is to avoid falling victim to "sunk cost" fallacy.  Briefly, the sunk cost fallacy assumes that "since I'm already here, I might as well stay."

The better question is to evaluate based on what would you do today if you had a vacant unit in the condition it is today?  This allows you to move away from laziness/inertia and make a wise business decision.  For example...

Let's say this unit would cost $1,000 to freshen up in the condition it is today.  Further, it would cost you 4 weeks of vacancy to move the tenant out, freshen up, and find a new tenant meaning you eat a month's vacancy.

By keeping the tenant, you avoid that cost.  However, you may incur more costs going forward if the late pay signals financial disorganization that may lead to an eviction and additional damages, which means you would spend more than $1,000 on freshening (maybe $2,000!) and would have an even longer vacancy because it would take more time to remedy the greater damages.

By moving that tenant out, you incur the known cost of $1,000 plus a month's lost rent, but you could re-rent at a higher rate and recover it more quickly.  You would also (potentially) reduce the stress of late pays with a better quality tenant.

There is a third option: keep the tenant, raise the rent, and put them on a payment plan that ensures timely payment.

Try this: 

Step 1: raise the rent $30/month.  No one moves over $1 day extra rent unless they were already going to move out anyway.  

Step 2: Make their rent due the day OF or the day AFTER their payday.  Require payment by ACH/auto-debit and schedule it to hit on the due date when their account should have money in it, assuming they aren't overdrawn by more than their pay check.

Step 3: Offer alternative payment arrangements.  For example, if they get paid every two weeks, divide their rent in two chunks and take that amount every two week.  There is no magic to the 1st of the month.  I collect rents all month long.  It's not hard.  A calendar, a dry erase board, or spreadsheet makes it easy to track payments.  My bank's Business Services Department offers ACH / auto-debit: check with yours.  I input the rent batch a few days early, set it to process, wake up in the morning and there is the money.  The only time there's a problem is if they are overdrawn/insufficient funds, in which case you know within a day or two vs. waiting 10-20 days for a check to bounce or listening to endless promises that "I'll pay you in a few days..."

The other advantage to offering bi-weekly payments is if the tenant is short a few bucks, it is much easier for them to borrow and/or find that money elsewhere.  Let's say rent is $1,000 and they pay $500 twice per month.  Much easier to come up with $500 than $1,000.  

Most people give up if they see a mountain ($600 short on monthly rent) in front of them, but they might try to climb if it's only a small hill ($100 short on bi-weekly rent).

Easy payments.  Many industries have figured this model out.

P.S.  If you're like me and enjoy math, I'm sure by now you've realized that paying 50% of the monthly rent rate every 2 weeks means you get 3 payments in a month every 3 months or so (i.e. the "extra Friday").  There are 26 two-week periods in any given calendar year, and so you would collect 26 half payments which equals 13 whole month payments.  That's your incentive for being "flexible."  Just be sure the tenant realizes they are not buying rent by the month.  Rather, they are buying rent two weeks at a time.  You can still have a lease that runs for 1 year, but that doesn't mean you have to collect rent one month at a time, does it?

I've heard about the 2 week strategy - seems clever! I love it.  How upfront are you with tenants when offering it? Do you tell them it will cost more across the course of the year? 

And I think the auto-debit plan is brilliant.  Thanks for sharing your thinking, Erik! 

Thanks, Darrell! There's always something to worry about, right? Can't let it stop you from trying, I suppose. 

I'm just getting started, too, Tyler, in the same area! Let's talk sometime soon to compare notes.