I am seeking a real estate broker who handles short-term rentals in Brevard County, FL. Please PM me.
Direct mail marketing works great for me, and I have never stopped in over 10 years of doing it consistently, and I have closed many deals from SFR, notes, land and commercial properties
yes, you can do PPC or SEO, but you can spend thousands of dollars too, and no deals.
Basically you need to know what you are doing in DM or Online for it to work, otherwise, you will spend thousands of dollars without success
@Jonathan Krauser. The letter looks good. Good Luck
"DMM has worked great for me",
What exactly do you mean by " it works for me" and what do you mean by "it works great". Quantify this for me.
1% success rate? This means every 100 mailers you send you get one deal.
0.1% success rate? This means every 1000 mailers you send you make one deal.
0.01% success rate? You need to send 10,000 mailers to get one deal.
And you have been doing it for 10 years... Why even mention this as this has nothing to do with anything.
I have been doing this for just 6 and I get more leads for free than you get chasing after them paying a fortune. But alas this is not about me or SEO.
Allow me to make my point.
Consider exhibit A: some actual data/numbers
All free, all motivated, all begging me to make them a cash offer, all 100% free.
So tell me again, What does "it works great for me" truly mean? It's quite objective right? So what you are doing is misleading people. What you call "works great for me", to me is quite low performance.
So let's agree from now on to never again use mere opinion or baseless claims as a substitution for data. Agreed? Good!
Now:
You can spend thousands of dollars on SEO and PPC and still make no deals. Yup! You can also die in a car accident, and/or you can also NOT die in a car accident. Are you saying, we should not drive cars and just walk everywhere?
Yes you can spend thousands on PPC and SEO and make no deals, but you can also spend thousands on PPC and make a TON of deals. So?! Your point?! That what you said makes absolutely no sense.
Are you saying DMM is acceptable because other methods CAN fail too? That is no reason to do DMM, what the hell?! Your conclusions are drawn out of thin air.
Let's run this experiment:
Step 1:
How many of you doing DMM are actually successful (RELIABLY and CONSISTENTLY? Write that number down, call it "X"
Step 2:
Now, How many of you are doing DMM and get NOTHING out of it (other than a bunch of angry people threatening you?) Write THAT number down, call it Y
Step 3:
Compare those two numbers.
Hector be very honest for a second. Compare the numbers. There will be a HUGE difference between "X" and "Y". I am willing to bet that X is a couple of orders of magnitudes larger than Y.
My question to you is this. Can you be man enough to admit this?
If yes, then there you have it. If it "worked" there would be more success than failures, but there are FAR more failures than successes, so how can you be ok with telling people or advising people to do it when you know DARN well that every 1000 people you tell to do it, 999 will fail. Bet you don't refund them when they fail, do you? I bet that if you HAD to refund the failures you would absolutely not teach people this stuff. Right? Am I right? huh? ;) ;)
Easy for all you gurus and coaches to say and make all sorts of claims without accountability, but if you were to be held accountable you wouldn't say these things. Most gurus (not you) think that the louder you bark the more people will listen, but none show data, proof, or evidence. WHY is that?!
Everyone is so fast to respond to questions, but no one, NOT A SINGLE ONE OF YOU shows ANY evidence, proof or data backing up said claims, WHAT-SO-EVER!
Everyone just talks a strong talk. But that's all they do.
Here is what you are teaching others:
1. Perform a ton of research on how to generate leads.
2. Listen to podcasts on your way to work.
3. Question the meaning of life, listening to, and
dissecting all that information.
4. Find A list, Filter That List, Buy that List, Buy stamps, Buy mailers.
5. Handwrite 5000 letters.
6. Include a pen inside the envelope for “lumpy mail”.
7. Send mailers.
8. Experience a short-lived feeling of accomplishment.
9. Followed by an intense sense of depression and shock upon receiving a ton of angry calls from said mailers.
10. Get a ton of returned mailers.
11. Skip trace these addresses.
12. Pay for a new set of envelopes mailers and stamps.
13. Resend mailers.
14. Experience another short-lived feeling of hopefulness.
15. Followed by an intense sense of depression and shock upon receiving a ton more angry calls from said mailers.
16. Listen to more podcasts.
17. Get a “AHA!” moment when discovering different color mailers, envelopes, and stamps.
18. Research what mailer or letter works best. (yellow, blue, handwritten, scribbles).
19. Slap a unique tracking phone number on each mailer design.
20. Spend another fortune sending mailers, again.
21. Get yelled at, again.
22. Remove people from the list that demand it, again.
23. Receive a bunch of returned mailers, again.
24. Spend another fortune to skip trace and resend the new mailers… again.
25. Subscribe to your favorite real estate investing forum and ask people what you are doing wrong.
26. Try hard to make sense of their response: “If all this is not working for you, it means you didn’t do it enough, do more (of what obviously is not working), and stay consistent”.
27. Get depressed.
28. Get yourself together.
29. Do it all over again.
30. If it doesn't work, keep telling yourself that it works, so do more, more and more.
31. If it STILL doesn't work, in that case... DO MORE!! Stay consistent.
32. If it still doesn't work, remember how many people on Biggerpockets said "it works for me", so DO MORE.
"works great", Really dude?
Here is what I am teaching others.
You can't target motivated sellers. It is not possible. When you need something you take it upon yourself to find the solution to your problem. You resort to the internet. You don't look through your mail hoping someone sent you a DMM piece on how to solve your problem. You don't go through your text messages hoping a random stranger sent you a text coincidentally with the exact solution you need, you don't go to the library, you don't open a newspaper, you don't call your mom or your neighbor. You whip up your phone and go to GOOGLE!
Motivated sellers find you. YOU don't find THEM.
Which of the 2 makes more sense?
To think you have been doing all these 29+ steps for 10 years and you proudly say it out loud, as if it were a good thing? It is not!!
You and I obviously think very differently. But hey keep doing your 29 steps. That's on you. But I wouldn't tell others to do it, there are far better and easier ways.
Work smarter, not harder.
Thank you for the post. What have you found works in getting motivated sellers to talk with you?
No worries man. My pleasure.
To answer this question you first need to understand what a motivated seller is because this is the root of all the inconsistent advice flying around. This is very important so see if you can stick with me here.
A motivated seller is not someone that want to, needs to, or even has to sell their house (like foreclosure, tax liens, job loss etc. etc.).
A motivated seller is anyone willing to sell their house below market value regardless of the reason why.
So it is the willingness to sell below market value is what separates a seller from a motivated seller.
Take someone in foreclosure. Don't they have to sell their house? Yes. And if they don't sell their house aren't they going to be in trouble? Yes.
Are they willing to sell their house below market value? Nope!
Although they HAVE to sell are desperate to sell, NEED to sell, they are NOT motivated.
They rather pour concrete down the drain, destroy the cabinets then sell to you... at market value, let alone at a discount.
So, once you truly and fully understand this, think about it. Who are you targeting by sending marketing to a list? People who want to, need to, or have to sell.
If foreclosures were motivated sellers, why does it take you 3000 to 5000 mailers calls or texts to get ONE deal? The data and numbers are staring you in the face, but people choose to see what they want to see.
Now. Sadly, you can't target motivated sellers. It is not possible.
Why?
Jon, do you own your house?
Yes?
Great.
I am going to offer you 20 cents on the dollar for your house. Yes or no?
No?
Darn it.
Fine how about 50 cents on the dollar?
No?
Jeez man
FINE 100 GADAMN CENTS ON THE DOLLAR. I will give you market value for your house.
No still right?
Why?
Because if you had said yes, you would have to pack, move, find a house, moving company... WHY? WHY take on all that crap when you were not motivated in the first place right?
So, ok you are not a motivated seller.
God forbid, knock on wood, something happens to you tomorrow and you BECOME motivated.
My question is this.
Who knows that you Jon Krauser, living at 123 Main Street became motivated?
NO ONE!!
You do not magically appear on the motivated seller list in Propstream. You do not get a tag in the government registry that says "Jon right.... wait for it.. .waaaait for it.. NOW.. NOW Jon became motivated, everyone sends him a mailer call or text". It's moronic!
My point and proof, evidence-backed.
NOTHING can target motivated sellers because no one knows when someone else becomes motivated. No list no set of characteristics and predict motivation because motivation is based on emotion, NOT DATA.
If you were a lion in the dry savannah of Africa and you wanted food. Where would you go?
The watering hole right?
I don;t care who you are, your butt will be at the watering hole every single day
Where do you go when you need info, help, reviews, knowledge, entertainment, and answers? Library? No, Google. You go to the internet.
Well, guess what So does everyone else including actually MOTIVATED sellers.
The ONLY way to reliably get in touch with motivated sellers is for you to make it extremely easy for them to find you.
I call this "stalking the watering hole".
SEO is obviously the best, but PPC and Facebook ads (a service I do not provide... meaning I am not just saying this BECAUSE I offer SEO) are the next best thing each with advantages and disadvantages.
Now, you are better off investing in an ever working lead generation system so you can automate this to generate the highest quality leads for free, than investing in a list, no matter the list and every single time you send mailers you have to
1) Hope they see the mailer
2) Hope they open the mailer
3) Hope that when and IF they open the mailer they are in the mood to read it
4) Hope that when they 1. find the mailer, 2. and hopefully open the mailer, and 3. hopefully they are in the mood to read your mailer, and 4. they are coincidently in some sort of motivation state to act on the mailer, they will give YOU a call when they have received 400 other mailers from other people
You do realize that 50% of 50% is 25%. So hoping on a hope the numbers go down QUICK.
Can you make deals doing it the old way? Absolutely. No one is saying you don't.
But if you want to become a serious Real Estate Investor, you better get with the times or you will become obsolete.
In short.
You don;t find motivated sellers, they find you.
If you have to pay for a lead tr chase a lead, per definition it is a bad lead. Why Because if it was a good lead you wouldn't need to change them They would be chasing the solution to their problem, YOU!
And this is not just blowing hot air.
You all seen my data, seen the evidence seen my leads pouring in and ...
Now you have seen my checks:
All these are Wholesale assignment fees!
That is what I find so stupid in these forums. People fight me on DMM cold calling lists, WHILE they complain about DMM cold calling and lists. I tell them its wrong they defend it to the death, while they SEE me put undisputable proof that those methods are retarded!, yet they call themselves coaches and experts with absolutely no data to show While I am showing concrete proof that what I am telling them is solid, common sense logic, while THEIR OWN DATA shows I am correct.
Un
Be
LIEV
ABLE!!!
Okay I am interested. I do not need to know anymore about how mailers are bad. How do you find motivated sellers?
After reading the letter for a second time, I would recommend changing the following
here is my two cents.
In the second paragraph where it says "I will also pay cash" be careful with that statement. If you are targeting small multifamily properties, that statement can be true, but if you are targeting larger units, the chances of paying cash are very small to none, as many people will buy it using banks and a mix of syndication, so savvy investors will ignore your letter
The PS section where says " or if they have tenants in the property." This is what I typically use for my SFR direct mail campaign to landlords. but if you are targeting multifamily more likely they will have tenants in place, so that statement is not as powerful for your audience as it is for SFR landlords, that sometimes is hard to sell a property with Tenants in place
I hope that helps a bit
Direct mail marketing works great for me, and I have never stopped in over 10 years of doing it consistently, and I have closed many deals from SFR, notes, land and commercial properties
yes, you can do PPC or SEO, but you can spend thousands of dollars too, and no deals.
Basically you need to know what you are doing in DM or Online for it to work, otherwise, you will spend thousands of dollars without success
@Jonathan Krauser. The letter looks good. Good Luck
"DMM has worked great for me",
What exactly do you mean by " it works for me" and what do you mean by "it works great". Quantify this for me.
1% success rate? This means every 100 mailers you send you get one deal.
0.1% success rate? This means every 1000 mailers you send you make one deal.
0.01% success rate? You need to send 10,000 mailers to get one deal.
And you have been doing it for 10 years... Why even mention this as this has nothing to do with anything.
I have been doing this for just 6 and I get more leads for free than you get chasing after them paying a fortune. But alas this is not about me or SEO.
Allow me to make my point.
Consider exhibit A: some actual data/numbers
All free, all motivated, all begging me to make them a cash offer, all 100% free.
So tell me again, What does "it works great for me" truly mean? It's quite objective right? So what you are doing is misleading people. What you call "works great for me", to me is quite low performance.
So let's agree from now on to never again use mere opinion or baseless claims as a substitution for data. Agreed? Good!
Now:
You can spend thousands of dollars on SEO and PPC and still make no deals. Yup! You can also die in a car accident, and/or you can also NOT die in a car accident. Are you saying, we should not drive cars and just walk everywhere?
Yes you can spend thousands on PPC and SEO and make no deals, but you can also spend thousands on PPC and make a TON of deals. So?! Your point?! That what you said makes absolutely no sense.
Are you saying DMM is acceptable because other methods CAN fail too? That is no reason to do DMM, what the hell?! Your conclusions are drawn out of thin air.
Let's run this experiment:
Step 1:
How many of you doing DMM are actually successful (RELIABLY and CONSISTENTLY? Write that number down, call it "X"
Step 2:
Now, How many of you are doing DMM and get NOTHING out of it (other than a bunch of angry people threatening you?) Write THAT number down, call it Y
Step 3:
Compare those two numbers.
Hector be very honest for a second. Compare the numbers. There will be a HUGE difference between "X" and "Y". I am willing to bet that X is a couple of orders of magnitudes larger than Y.
My question to you is this. Can you be man enough to admit this?
If yes, then there you have it. If it "worked" there would be more success than failures, but there are FAR more failures than successes, so how can you be ok with telling people or advising people to do it when you know DARN well that every 1000 people you tell to do it, 999 will fail. Bet you don't refund them when they fail, do you? I bet that if you HAD to refund the failures you would absolutely not teach people this stuff. Right? Am I right? huh? ;) ;)
Easy for all you gurus and coaches to say and make all sorts of claims without accountability, but if you were to be held accountable you wouldn't say these things. Most gurus (not you) think that the louder you bark the more people will listen, but none show data, proof, or evidence. WHY is that?!
Everyone is so fast to respond to questions, but no one, NOT A SINGLE ONE OF YOU shows ANY evidence, proof or data backing up said claims, WHAT-SO-EVER!
Everyone just talks a strong talk. But that's all they do.
Here is what you are teaching others:
1. Perform a ton of research on how to generate leads.
2. Listen to podcasts on your way to work.
3. Question the meaning of life, listening to, and
dissecting all that information.
4. Find A list, Filter That List, Buy that List, Buy stamps, Buy mailers.
5. Handwrite 5000 letters.
6. Include a pen inside the envelope for “lumpy mail”.
7. Send mailers.
8. Experience a short-lived feeling of accomplishment.
9. Followed by an intense sense of depression and shock upon receiving a ton of angry calls from said mailers.
10. Get a ton of returned mailers.
11. Skip trace these addresses.
12. Pay for a new set of envelopes mailers and stamps.
13. Resend mailers.
14. Experience another short-lived feeling of hopefulness.
15. Followed by an intense sense of depression and shock upon receiving a ton more angry calls from said mailers.
16. Listen to more podcasts.
17. Get a “AHA!” moment when discovering different color mailers, envelopes, and stamps.
18. Research what mailer or letter works best. (yellow, blue, handwritten, scribbles).
19. Slap a unique tracking phone number on each mailer design.
20. Spend another fortune sending mailers, again.
21. Get yelled at, again.
22. Remove people from the list that demand it, again.
23. Receive a bunch of returned mailers, again.
24. Spend another fortune to skip trace and resend the new mailers… again.
25. Subscribe to your favorite real estate investing forum and ask people what you are doing wrong.
26. Try hard to make sense of their response: “If all this is not working for you, it means you didn’t do it enough, do more (of what obviously is not working), and stay consistent”.
27. Get depressed.
28. Get yourself together.
29. Do it all over again.
30. If it doesn't work, keep telling yourself that it works, so do more, more and more.
31. If it STILL doesn't work, in that case... DO MORE!! Stay consistent.
32. If it still doesn't work, remember how many people on Biggerpockets said "it works for me", so DO MORE.
"works great", Really dude?
Here is what I am teaching others.
You can't target motivated sellers. It is not possible. When you need something you take it upon yourself to find the solution to your problem. You resort to the internet. You don't look through your mail hoping someone sent you a DMM piece on how to solve your problem. You don't go through your text messages hoping a random stranger sent you a text coincidentally with the exact solution you need, you don't go to the library, you don't open a newspaper, you don't call your mom or your neighbor. You whip up your phone and go to GOOGLE!
Motivated sellers find you. YOU don't find THEM.
Which of the 2 makes more sense?
To think you have been doing all these 29+ steps for 10 years and you proudly say it out loud, as if it were a good thing? It is not!!
You and I obviously think very differently. But hey keep doing your 29 steps. That's on you. But I wouldn't tell others to do it, there are far better and easier ways.
Work smarter, not harder.
Thank you for the post. What have you found works in getting motivated sellers to talk with you?
Thanks Johnathan!
That's great to know. How often would you recommend mailing. Quarterly or every couple months?
Hey everyone, I was going to use direct mail to find deals. Here what I'm thinking:
1.) I'm looking for small multifamily, 8 units and under
2.) Was going to handwrite letters to property owners in my immediate area and maybe include a photo of my wife and I.
Can anyone give me any suggestions on best practices? Any good books for this type of approach? I've seen people say they've had luck looking at probate filings at the local courthouse...but for that...who do you mail?
Thanks in advance.
Direct mail works, but you typically need to hit them 3-5 times or be following up with cold calling. Too many new wholesalers mail them once and give up. What lists are you targeting plays a large roll also.
Hey Everyone.
I started mailing out market reports to absentee owners in my town with the hope of finding new clients. Any agents out there have recommendations on what they are doing to generate leads thru direct mail? Are there better lists that I should be tar,geting like high equity or mailing to everyone in a certain neighborhood? Any insight would be awesome! Thanks in advance.
-Forester
I have found that you get the best success if you repeatedly send marketing to a neighborhood for a few years. After about two years you will start seeing results. If you call people with a just listed or just sold script as well you will find the results you are looking for.
Direct mail works, but you typically need to hit them 3-5 times or be following up with cold calling. Too many new wholesalers mail them once and give up. What lists are you targeting plays a large roll also.
This is also my belief. I expect it to be similar to real estate farming. We do not see results until we consistently do the mail-outs for a couple of years.
Hi Jonathan, this looks good to me--It'd be great to have you follow up with your results in a couple months!
John