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All Forum Posts by: John S.

John S. has started 0 posts and replied 24 times.

Post: Neighborhood Revival

John S.Posted
  • Chicago, IL
  • Posts 24
  • Votes 6
Originally posted by John S.:
If you are bent on low income try picking up bigger buildings and section 8ing them for the cash flow because there will likely be no gains on the sale of that real estate.

Mark Updegraff I am advising against it but balanced my posts with counter examples about a simliar model that is successful in Indy as well as a another avenue to investigate (Sec 8) for profiting from RE in this type of market. This thread needs a realist so Jeremy can see both sides of what he is considering and inform his plans appropriately. Learn to read and please don't use phrases like whatevs ever again.

Post: Neighborhood Revival

John S.Posted
  • Chicago, IL
  • Posts 24
  • Votes 6
Originally posted by Michael Lauther:

John, having said all this I appreciate your observations and would be very interesting in hearing about your failure in this type of market. What are some of the specific lessons you learned investing in small single family properties in low income areas?

Very Low-education/High Crime/Hood areas are very risky because of the systematic risk associated with the area, mainly the inhabitants of the area.

About 20% of my portfolio is low income and they are more work than the 80% of my units in more livable neighborhoods. I wouldn't define those units as a failure as they were my first investment and provide strong cashflow but the maitainance and legwork relative to the return just isn't worth it IMO. I've found the low prices and allure of large profits and improving the area from such low priced property is an illusion and the savy investor should consider areas with better economics before placing high risk bets in these areas.

Here are some bullets on lessons learned:

- If you have debt service and tax payments, you may not have time to wait and find those housebroken tenants as your expenses clip away. There aren't many well qualified renters in low income areas. I use housebroken because tenants who grew up in bad homes with low education likely never learned to respect a house and don't know how to keep an apartment regardless of how nice they are to you before they move-in. For Ex. Tenants complaining about a broken stove when its stopped working because the grease build-up on the burner was not cleaned since the unit was rehabbed.

-You can screen your tenants but not who might and likely will end up in your unit. Ex. Grandma might look like a great tenant but her son who is getting out of prison and coming to live with her in six months is not. Be prepared for overcrowding and long term unwanted guests, this is a fact of life in these areas. Do you want to spend the $$$$ on an evicition, vacancy, lost rent, debt service, and repairs to make a point and risk getting a trashed unit returned to you? Or do you want to let it slide and send the signal that your soft and can be taken advantage of, a very slippery slope. Be prepared for these types of decisions.

-Low education/Low income tenants have a different thought process and will take and take until you can't give anymore, then they will turn on you and take off. Control the situation and never promise or commit to anything until you have thoroughly thought it threw. Think twice before agreeing to improve the unit for the tenant, they may learn they can ask for anything and you will do it. Never befriend your tenants or think they appreciate you. Your tenants should respect you and know you're serious. They will sniff out weakness/inexperience quickly and exploit them.

-The area will not improve just because you buy a building there. Its easy to think that things will get automatically better this simply isn't true. Take a look at all the other properties that have closed over they years and wonder if every buyer though like that. Everything seems easier at a 10,000 ft view.

-Secure your unit during rehab or you'll be sorry. These areas typically have very high unemployment, which mean means a lot of people just looking around all day doing nothing. Be under the impression you are being watched at all times. Locals will know your schedule and when your crew works and when they aren't there. They will see you brining in hot water tanks and copper. Many will not have a qualm ripping off a guy from a nicer part of town wearing a north face jacket and nice jeans.

Post: Discount to MLS list price

John S.Posted
  • Chicago, IL
  • Posts 24
  • Votes 6

I find list prices are often inaccurate and not strongly correlated to the value of property in my area. I've seen property go for 15% of list and have personally bought between X>100% and 50% of list in the last couple years. That is, when I can't snatch off market deals

Working the numbers should unlock the true value of the RE.

Post: how to make an offer in a vacant foreclosed property

John S.Posted
  • Chicago, IL
  • Posts 24
  • Votes 6

Probably not. Wells Fargo like other large banks have a process in place to deal with foreclosures at this point that ends with listing with a realtor.

They may also be required to 'expose the property to the market' to get a true market value as opposed to leaving money on the table in private transaction. Larger banks may sell to a private investor on a volume basis ie - $10M of SFH in a single area, but again they are too big to worry about one offs.

Is this property in Florida? There are likely a lot of other good deals around that don't require that type of leg work. True connecting with community banks that have portfolio loans going under.

Post: Not paying a realtor?

John S.Posted
  • Chicago, IL
  • Posts 24
  • Votes 6

I haven't met a broker who stays in business not protecting their commission and not selling property. Reading legal documents isn't required to understand that.

Post: Neighborhood Revival

John S.Posted
  • Chicago, IL
  • Posts 24
  • Votes 6

You should read the post, I'm advising against it.

Post: Neighborhood Revival

John S.Posted
  • Chicago, IL
  • Posts 24
  • Votes 6

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=hood, the definition is implied through the content of my posts. Real estate is local, so voicing the speculative nature of your strategy in the Roc is general, despite it being successful. The only trite text I see in this thread is a strange love affair people are having with very low income and warzone areas.

Knowing your market, putting a plan on paper and working numbers is advice I've bestowed, all I see in your post is blind encouragement and it oozes of naivete. Anyone can buy a 30 cap in the worst neighborhood, but whats the exit?

Btw, assessed values raise your taxes, every investor out there is trying to lower their assessments. Try using comps to price your real estate. Also, cap rates are typically not applied to SFRs due to the impact of vacancy and collection on NOI as well as the cost of maintenance for a single occupant. Use $/sq ft based on comparable sales.

Post: Being confident during First contact w/ Seller!

John S.Posted
  • Chicago, IL
  • Posts 24
  • Votes 6

Stinson is right

Just listen to them and gather relevant information through asking questions. Try making bullets beforehand so you are sure to collect everything you need during the call.

On a tactical note, go into the call knowing about what you would pay if the property is in fair condition and practice saying those number out loud confidently (IE "Based on the information on the property I would offer 230,000 for it and cover all out of pocket expenses related to the sale.") That way it rolls off your tongue like you've pitched 100 times.

Post: Neighborhood Revival

John S.Posted
  • Chicago, IL
  • Posts 24
  • Votes 6

Removing emotion from the equation will help you develop a more pragmatic approach. I think every new'b at some point thought just like that then eventually found it was a dead end and a major headache, including me.

In contrast, there is a guy in Indy running an operation that buys 50 packs of these types of SFRs refurbishes them and sells them for 40-50k, and he is helping improve the area while profiting. Don't expect to move the market through the purchase of a couple 999sqft SFRs. To replicate, you'll need a large volume of homes to purchase, political buy in, an experienced crew, a million dollar line of credit, and management experience to pull off a deal like that. The money is made on volume of buying and selling, like a Wal-mart for little houses, not on holding them.

I'd recommend putting your plan on paper and working the numbers see if it makes sense. Shop the plan around to other investors who are in the are and see if they think its madness or a practical and executable plan.

Every real estate investment should be analyzed for maximum capitalization. If capitalizing deals isn't interesting to an individual, then that individual is not investor and I'd recommend looking into habitat for humanity or a similar NPO to affect social change.

Post: Not paying a realtor?

John S.Posted
  • Chicago, IL
  • Posts 24
  • Votes 6

@ JScott

This isn't about me, its about giving the poster options to deal with his situation.

A brokers job is to protect their commission and sell property, Darwinism exists in real estate too.

Since only 10% of brokers are competent and hardworking, the other 90% are disposable, and if this burned realtor is out of the game with the next few years the story of this situation would die along with her career. How does this cost an investor deals in the long run?

Every investment situation is unique and should be analyzed for maximum capitalization.