Real Estate Investor · Cincinnati, OH · Member since 2012 · 12 posts · 1 vote
I was at a REIA meeting where a local investor said he puts up a 6ft vinyl banner on the face of the house 2 weeks BEFORE he is done rehabbing it that says "Buy This House" and has website and phone number. My question, has anyone else done this and with what success? Second he said use a good realtor so he isn't a sell it yourself guy, and I agree...but would this banner then have your realtor's contact info or your own. Do you then take down this sign when you go on market,everything is pretty and you have a traditional realtor yard sign out?
Thanks for the tips, I have been a long time rental (buy and hold) investor and just started doing rehab flips (on my second one) and looking to sell as best and quick as I can.
The problem is, people will want to see the house before it is done, and most potential buyers have no vision and can't imagine the house complete if it's not. We will only show a property under two conditions:
1. It's 100% complete and staged; or
2. We have another property that is 100% remodeled and staged (to the same quality and finish level) that we can show them first.
We'll pre-market our properties only if #2 above is possible.
I wouldnt argue with him if it works in that area, but id never do it here. We have organized groups that steal appliances & construction materials here, and in the rehabs ive done, all the valuable stuff arrives in the last two weeks. I try to keep an extremely low profile until the property is on the market. I put my rentals on mls but hide the lockbox on the side of the house, and no sign.
The problem is, people will want to see the house before it is done, and most potential buyers have no vision and can't imagine the house complete if it's not. We will only show a property under two conditions:
1. It's 100% complete and staged; or
2. We have another property that is 100% remodeled and staged (to the same quality and finish level) that we can show them first.
We'll pre-market our properties only if #2 above is possible.
I always put a sign on every property I own, usually from the minute I own it. I had a FSBO sign in the front of a property during rehab last year. It brought in some agents who buy for investors at trustee's sales. They were looking at the house next door which was going to sale in a few days. They stopped in, we chatted, and they ended up bringing me a investor buyer. I did great on that property. I had those same agents manage my last rehab and they just put it on the market yesterday. So a good relationship was started from a sign.
The hard part was the retail buyers who walked in or called, of which there were many. Like J says they don't really know a lot about houses or rehab, don't really understand their finances or what loan they qualify for and were way too concerned about what color the carpet might be. That's when I knew I wouldn't be selling to an end buyer who didn't have an agent, because I do not want to spend my time dealing with them.
So a sign is great if you can handle working directly with the buyers. You'll probably get a fair amount of calls from agents who want to list it for you, at least I always do.
I agree with Scott and Mark on the matter some areas putting up a sign can invite trouble.
On the matter of your product being rehabbed and completed its a good idea to show a finished product since end buyers are in that market and they may not have the vision to see what you do. Its hard to see that unless you do what we do for a living. I have seen retail buyers just cringe at property they walked into that was only missing flooring it is funny to experience the various body languages given off showing unfinished homes to retail buyers. I quit that exercise even on my rentals after seeing the negativity that customers had.
The signs are a little extra potential customers and marketing but too me it isnt worth the potential of losing appliances and copper and ect.
I am also against showing before totally complete. Bottom line is, most people just can not see past chaos and smell, if they could, we would have a lot more competition out there.
As they say, you only get one chance at a first impression and that most decisions on a house are made within the first 90 seconds.
Thank you all for the quick response. I have to say I agree with the disadvantages more than the advantages. The gentleman who said this was such a success for him was a 15 year expereinced investor but he could have been talking about a specific neighborhood where it works well with less downside. I agree though the risks likely way outway the benefit. Thank you!
Justin, I agree with J Scott in that showing a property to a retail buyer before it is complete is not a good idea for the reasons he mentioned, however, I do agree that placing some kind of for sale sign in the font yard is a good idea and should be done.
K. Marie mentioned how she sold a home off her sign and that is one of many reasons. Getting names and numbers of potential retail buyers and their agents is a good thing. When you start doing quantity, many of these people can be called on to look at your available inventory.
I agree: no buyers see it until it's 100% done. Buyers can't see past their noses, no vision (that's retail buyers not investment people). Selling a property with only a sign is akin to selling a widget at a small town flea market vs. selling on EBay. The world needs to know it's for sale (via MLS) vs. just the people on the street. Maximum exposure=maximum return. IMO. :)
I am of the same opinion, we never show a house until it is completely done and staged.
I agree, but to be clear, I also agree and support (and perform) that placing a sign in the yard for sale to gain access to potential buyers is also a good thing.
On my sign, it states "Construction Zone, Do Not Enter" then goes on to state it is "Coming Soon" for sale and has a contact phone number. This allows us to premarket without showing anyone the inside before it is completed.
I am of the same opinion, we never show a house until it is completely done and staged.
I agree, but to be clear, I also agree and support (and perform) that placing a sign in the yard for sale to gain access to potential buyers is also a good thing.
On my sign, it states "Construction Zone, Do Not Enter" then goes on to state it is "Coming Soon" for sale and has a contact phone number. This allows us to premarket without showing anyone the inside before it is completed.
Yeah, but your drywall guy, carpet guy, molding guy etc. arent security guards, and dont generally care if someone follows them in and looks around.. if they grumble at a potential customer to kick them out, you've lost a customer, if they let them look around, you've lost a customer.. or worse yet, you may have allowed a criminal to scope out your progress, so they know what goodies are available to steal.
Will, I really appreciate the insight from your experience with a pre-completion sign working, I see the benefits. Any issues ever with break ins though by flagging that it's empty? Or us the dumpster outside, etc doing that anyway so who cares. Do you do a security system of anything else to discourage theft/vandals?
Thanks
I am of the same opinion, we never show a house until it is completely done and staged.
I agree, but to be clear, I also agree and support (and perform) that placing a sign in the yard for sale to gain access to potential buyers is also a good thing.
On my sign, it states "Construction Zone, Do Not Enter" then goes on to state it is "Coming Soon" for sale and has a contact phone number. This allows us to premarket without showing anyone the inside before it is completed.
I'm with you. The sign isn't supposed to be an invitation for a tour, but rather to create interest and give a phone number. And for those of you with brands, it's more branding. My agent team managed my current rehab and they put their sign in the yard the first day they entered the property. It's in area with no crime or vandalism issues though, and you couldn't tell the property was vacant because the HOA maintains all the landscaping and driveway out in front.
It's also a local thing. Signs really sell and rent stuff in my farms. People drive around looking for signs in areas where they want to live. In the beginning my husband was so negative about my FBSO and rental signs because he said no one would see them. He really didn't understand how it works there. I once put a sign up a large vacant lot, with no neighboring residences and the lot faced the wall blocking the highway. No one could see that sign. I got three calls within an hour.
I am of the same opinion, we never show a house until it is completely done and staged.
I agree, but to be clear, I also agree and support (and perform) that placing a sign in the yard for sale to gain access to potential buyers is also a good thing.
On my sign, it states "Construction Zone, Do Not Enter" then goes on to state it is "Coming Soon" for sale and has a contact phone number. This allows us to premarket without showing anyone the inside before it is completed.
Yeah, but your drywall guy, carpet guy, molding guy etc. arent security guards, and dont generally care if someone follows them in and looks around.. if they grumble at a potential customer to kick them out, you've lost a customer, if they let them look around, you've lost a customer.. or worse yet, you may have allowed a criminal to scope out your progress, so they know what goodies are available to steal.
This is true about lack of security. But that's not about the sign. That's about the fact that many job sites are not secure. Only the big jobs have fences. I can walk onto almost any job site and if there is no supervisor or owner present, none of the crew will ask me who I am or why I am there. The risk of theft and vandalism is always there. Here in Santa Barbara the GC's sign is on the property from day 1 and everybody in town can tell you what properties are in rehab and at what stage.
... Signs really sell and rent stuff in my farms. People drive around looking for signs in areas where they want to live. In the beginning my husband was so negative about my FBSO and rental signs because he said no one would see them. He really didn't understand how it works there. I once put a sign up a large vacant lot, with no neighboring residences and the lot faced the wall blocking the highway. No one could see that sign. I got three calls within an hour.
No doubt about that. I have not had a "for rent" sign up for about 7 weeks now, but just two weeks back I received two calls from people who had seen my "for rent" signs up and took the number down. The taking the number down was new to me, since usually they just call right on the spot when they see the sign.
Yeah, but your drywall guy, carpet guy, molding guy etc. arent security guards, and dont generally care if someone follows them in and looks around.. if they grumble at a potential customer to kick them out, you've lost a customer, if they let them look around, you've lost a customer.. or worse yet, you may have allowed a criminal to scope out your progress, so they know what goodies are available to steal.
It's not a perfect solution, but all my contractors know that, if someone stops by to see the property, give them my number (actually, my wife's number) and tell them to call us instead of just letting them in.
Most of the time, they'll call and will be a nosy neighbor, and we're happy to let them do the tour. If it's a potential buyer, we'll tell them that the house isn't ready to be shown and make other arrangements.
That said, we've had a few people slip past the contractors (they'll just walk in the front door like they know what they're doing)...can't stop everyone...
... Signs really sell and rent stuff in my farms. People drive around looking for signs in areas where they want to live. In the beginning my husband was so negative about my FBSO and rental signs because he said no one would see them. He really didn't understand how it works there. I once
Dout a sign up a large vacant lot, with no neighboring residences and the lot faced the wall blocking the highway. No one could see that sign. I got three calls within an hour.
No doubt about that. I have not had a "for rent" sign up for about 7 weeks now, but just two weeks back I received two calls from people who had seen my "for rent" signs up and took the number down. The taking the number down was new to me, since usually they just call right on the spot when they see the sign.
Don't know about your markets, but in mine not everyone has a cell phone. And lots of people living nearby will take an interest for their family members and friends. That behavior was was all new to me when I first started. We were once at a rental for a couple of hours, waiting for a contractor. I put a sign in the yard, with my PMs number on it. Almost everyone driving by would stop their car and come in to talk to us. Some shouted up from the street. It looked like we were having a party.
Like others stated, you are correct, it is not a perfect system, but like J stated, all the subs working in the home are REQUIRED by me as the owner (if they want to continue getting work from me) to keep the front door closed and locked (other reasons for this too) and anyone looking to come in is told exacvtloy what J stated - they are given a number to call (its on the sign for goodness sake) and told the home is not in showable condition, that they are not allowed or permitted to allow anyone to enter the premises for insurance and safety reasons, and by calling the number, they can get a private showing and tour along with any other info they desire.
As far as security, sign in the yard or not, it does not take a genius to figure out what is going on when I do any one of my rehabs. First off, no valueables are placed into the home until the last minute and by that time, we are just about ready for MLS. I don't work in high crime neighborhoods and while crime even happens in Beverly Hils, all my neighjbors are met and asked to keep a watchful eye on the property, sometimes, cameras are placed (and signs of their existence are shown), and all other means to secure the home are made. You can only do so much for security. Insurance covers the rest!
My opinion is that the sign would be good to generate a buzz, so long as the outside was finished. However, you'd really need to make sure they buyers wouldn't just pull over and walk in (as mentioned above--the subs will typically not stop anyone). It would be difficult to monitor and stop anyone from seeing it before it's ready. As an agent, I prefer to take the approach of creating the buzz with other agents--for instance an email "I've got a totally renovated XXX XXX coming on the market at it's going to be priced at $XX Do you have anyone looking for something like this?
The agents will either have someone and they can be on the "first to preview list" or perhaps in the next 2 weeks they will encounter a buyer and remember that property is coming on the market. They always want pictures etc...but the agents who respond (if even asking for pictures I'm not ready to give--until the project is completed) go on my "hot list" since it's likely they are working with a possible buyer. Once the house is market ready--I've already got a list of people who may have an interest-then I send out "you're the first to see this home flyer" and that gives it a marketing kick-start. Don't show/list a home until it's totally ready ;-)
Don't know about your markets, but in mine not everyone has a cell phone.
Wait, I thought you lived in California? Turns out you live in 1982...
:)
I'm sure you've been an early adapter since birth, but it's unlikely that you were surrounded by cell phones in 1982, or even in 1992.
We aren't talking technology, we are talking markets with poverty and education problems, often combined with an older generation. I could pick out zip codes in Atlanta (and Detroit and Columbus and Buffalo.....) where you can find the same houses for the same prices, the same rents, and the same socio economic challenges as some of my CA farms. You market rentals differently in those places.
I can see that I'm in the minority, but here's my take:
+ First, our buyers are a mix of families and investors. The investors typically are more interested in the numbers, not staging.
+ We're building a buyer list and a funnel so we use the opportunity to get interested people calling us! There's always another house that we'll be selling.
+ In the neighborhoods where theft is a *true* concern, we have someone stay in the house once there's something worth stealing. Obviously your mileage may vary here. I know some guys that have dogs that spend the night at rehab properties...
+ I'd rather be the bottleneck to closing because of MY schedule vs. finding the right buyer. Posting a sign or banner helps mitigate that...