Appraisal came in 70k short, sellers being stubborn

Appraisal came in 70k short, sellers being stubborn

Milford, MA · Member since 2014 · 25 posts · 10 votes

Hey everyone,

I'm buying my first property ever and it's been quite an experience.

I had an offer accepted, 645k for a 3 unit on the edge of Boston - Hyde Park. I thought that was a bit high. My agent said he thought it reflected the area and said going in at list price was my only shot, if the bank appraisal disagrees then I can renegotiate. Sure thing. Did it. I'm buying it from a relocating investor who has done very well. He bought it in 2014 for 405k.

The rents are 1100, 1700, 1500. I'd be occupying one of those, but that's a different story. Assuming 50% operating costs, that's a 4.0% CAP rate. There's better to be had, but I'm factoring in my personal quality of life here and can take that hit.

The sellers insisted on a clause in the P&S that said we would split the difference between appraisal and offer 50/50 by default. My attorney was not happy that they snuck it in there, the deal almost fell apart but we landed on 60/40 split in my favor with a low appraisal limit of 600k.

The appraisal came back at 575k. With the 60/40 split deal I pretty much agreed to pay up to 3% above market value, so I applied that to the value from the appraiser and offered them $592,250. They decided they would walk. Then they decided they might not. I was told they would come down to 624k. It's funny because that's 14k more than the price their 50/50 split would have gotten them. At 624k I need to produce 49k extra out of pocket.

I can probably make it happen, but this deal has gotten pretty rough. I feel a bit disrespected that after not asking them for anything post-inspection, allowing them a trick clause in the P&S and even letting them push closing back for 3 months that they would ask for more than their own deal set them up for.

I should walk. But I did spend a long time looking for this property. But what kind of investor makes a bad deal because it's taken too much time? But it could still make a little bit of money. But that extra cash could be used for a second investment. 

I'm obviously not a savvy real estate purchasing machine. Any advice?

Thanks!

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Russell BrazilBusiness Member
Moderator
Real Estate Agent · Washington, D.C. · Member since 2012 · 17k+ posts · 30k+ votes
9y

I don't know the size or niceness of the units, but I don't think the list price sounds unreasonable for the location and 3 units.

Also there is no way you should be spending 50% of the rents on operating costs at this price point. If you are, something has gone drastically wrong.

Also not sure the size of the units....but those rents seem very low.

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  • James MasottiPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Washington Township, NJ · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 976 votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Kavi S.:

    Hey everyone,

    I'm buying my first property ever and it's been quite an experience.

    I had an offer accepted, 645k for a 3 unit on the edge of Boston - Hyde Park. I thought that was a bit high. My agent said he thought it reflected the area and said going in at list price was my only shot, if the bank appraisal disagrees then I can renegotiate. Sure thing. Did it. I'm buying it from a relocating investor who has done very well. He bought it in 2014 for 405k.

    The rents are 1100, 1700, 1500. I'd be occupying one of those, but that's a different story. Assuming 50% operating costs, that's a 4.0% CAP rate. There's better to be had, but I'm factoring in my personal quality of life here and can take that hit.

    The sellers insisted on a clause in the P&S that said we would split the difference between appraisal and offer 50/50 by default. My attorney was not happy that they snuck it in there, the deal almost fell apart but we landed on 60/40 split in my favor with a low appraisal limit of 600k.

    The appraisal came back at 575k. With the 60/40 split deal I pretty much agreed to pay up to 3% above market value, so I applied that to the value from the appraiser and offered them $592,250. They decided they would walk. Then they decided they might not. I was told they would come down to 624k. It's funny because that's 14k more than the price their 50/50 split would have gotten them. At 624k I need to produce 49k extra out of pocket.

    I can probably make it happen, but this deal has gotten pretty rough. I feel a bit disrespected that after not asking them for anything post-inspection, allowing them a trick clause in the P&S and even letting them push closing back for 3 months that they would ask for more than their own deal set them up for.

    I should walk. But I did spend a long time looking for this property. But what kind of investor makes a bad deal because it's taken too much time? But it could still make a little bit of money. But that extra cash could be used for a second investment. 

    I'm obviously not a savvy real estate purchasing machine. Any advice?

    Thanks!

    I haven't crunched the numbers on this deal so assuming that the deal would have worked at your original offer, I can only assume that it will work at a lower price. Therefore I suggest that you...

    Offer to pay his asking price but only if he will personally carry a second note on the $49k balance between the appraisal and his asking price. Offer it on something reasonable like 20 year terms and a 7 year ballon at whatever interest rate your primary mortgage will be held. This way it ends up being a win win for you both. He gets his full asking price plus cash every month and you get a cash-flowing property. 

  • Russell BrazilBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Real Estate Agent · Washington, D.C. · Member since 2012 · 17k+ posts · 30k+ votes
    9y

    I don't know the size or niceness of the units, but I don't think the list price sounds unreasonable for the location and 3 units.

    Also there is no way you should be spending 50% of the rents on operating costs at this price point. If you are, something has gone drastically wrong.

    Also not sure the size of the units....but those rents seem very low.

  • Rental Property Investor · NY · Member since 2013 · 844 posts · 350 votes
    9y
    Kavi Siegel you realize that if you pay over asking you will be under water on this house for a very very long time. Most people with 30 year mortgages don't start to build equity until year 5-7 because all the interest is front loaded. You would be doing even worse then that. And what if you have an emergency and have to relocate? You would have to do a short sale to get out.
  • Investor · Flower Mound, TX · Member since 2017 · 4 posts · 1 vote
    9y

    Hi Kavi,  it sounds like you want this deal a little too much.  At those numbers this is not an investment, its a purchase.  Boston area will likely continue to appreciate but unless you are willing to accept the snails pace of appreciation... keep looking.  If you simply 'must have it', then Mr Masotti's advice sounds excellent (obviously a smart guy with experience).

    Just my 2 cents.  good luck and let us know how it works out

  • Real Estate Investor · Williamson County, TX · Member since 2011 · 1k+ posts · 961 votes
    9y
    Just for laughs, have you used the calculator at the federal housing finance something or other? You plug in a sale amount by year and quarter snd it will give you a current valuation based on their data...inflation/appreciation on same property repeat sales using conforming loans. Your property would be a jumbo proabably, but it would be interesting to see. Overpaying might not be a bad idea, but not overpaying is always better. There is an adage, houses are like buses...always another rounding the corner. But sometimes it can take a while. 70k is a lot of money, but it is what? 12% of the purchase? That doesn't sound too bad if it is in good shape and in the neighborhood you want...close to a T? I will say, if you walk there is a chance they will come back to you with a sweeter offer. They now know how much a bank will think the property is worth for a loan. I would think having someone willing to pony up to share bridging the shortfall would put you in a class above the other buyers....or Boston is totally diferent (and it may well be so take what I say with a grain of salt )
  • Real Estate Agent · Princeton, NJ · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y
    Kavi Siegel - if I didn't misunderstand, the original 50/50 deal would have gotten them $610 price (50% 645-575) and a 60/40 deal with a min of $600 would end up at a $618k price. If they chose not to walk, they must think they can't do better in the near term. That gives you power. Try to get $592-610? You'll have to bring the cash above the appraised price. Review the appraisal and see if you could honestly buy a similar asset for $575. (Or less and rehab it yourself?) Purchasing at a 4% cap is a bit lousy - if you had a 100% loan at 4.5% you'd lose money. Especially given the guy just made $200k on the property (minus any rehab). However, hot is hot. I've heard of rents continuing to rise in the Hyde Park area. You can use the $250k capital gains waiver to shield your equity from taxes as it appreciates depending on how long you hold it. What are your investment alternatives? I made 15% on my passive stock portfolio last year and was happy to be renting temporarily from someone who is just breaking even on the condo apartment. (I considered buying it.)
  • Milford, MA · Member since 2014 · 25 posts · 10 votes
    9y

    Thanks for all the advice, everyone who chimed in! I closed on the house Monday morning. After much back and forth, the agents cutting their commission, one agent paying for a washing machine out of pocket, three rejected counter-offers.... we ended up at $603k. Ended up needing $147k cash to close versus 20% of $645k, $129k. I'm glad that the $18k didn't break the deal. I think I did well! With the new mortgage rate, it cash flows $200 with only the two tenants in place. When I buy my next multi-family in 2 years or so, rents should go up at least $200 per unit and the third unit should rent for $2000, I'm looking at $5000 a month from rent and cash flowing $2600/month from this property. 

  • Developer · Houston, TX · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y

    Congratulations, Kavi.

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