Appraisal Report Bedroom Count is Different from Actual Number of Rooms

[Joshua Thang]

Hi,

So I have a situation where Cuyahoga County records states my house has 2 beds but my house has 3 beds. The appraiser came in and appraised it as a 2 bedroom and called the 3rd bedroom as a "Den". Is this something I can dispute and get the 3 bedroom so I can increase the appraisal value? What is the process like to change Cuyahoga County records? Are there any risks?

Thanks,

Joshua

[Joshua Thang]

Yes 2 closets, minimum height requirement met, it's bigger than the bedroom than the other rooms that was considered a room, 1 window, and 1 door.

[Jack Krusinski]

Hi Josh. To the best of my knowledge, and I am not an appraiser so I would recommend you verify this, but I have been of the understanding that there are 3 main requirements that classify a bedroom, a bedroom. They are below.

1. Size & Dimensions: The room must be at least 70 square feet. It must be a minimum of 7 feet by 9 feet in size, and at least half of the room should have a ceiling height of 7 feet.

2. Egress window: Must have a egress window where someone can escape for a fire.

3. Enclosure: It must be its own separate, enclosed space with a door. A loft area, for example, does not qualify. 

Does your 3rd bedroom meet these requirements? 

[Patrick Drury]

@Joshua Thang
Does the unit have a living room? I have seen this before where people call it a 2 bed, but it's really a 1 bed on the auditors and they turned the living room into a bedroom by throwing a closet in it. Same principle 

[Joshua Thang]

Yes, there's a living room, dining room, kitchen on the appraiser's report and then they called the what I thought to be a 3rd bedroom to be a "den". The "den" is over 200 sqft and has an openable window and door with 2 closets.

[Frank Chin]

You're saying county records have your property down as 2 bedrooms. If you actually have 3 bedrooms, then the county records are wrong. I recall appraisers check the public records before doing an actual walkthrough. I don't know if the property was originally built as a 2 bedroom and somewhere along the lines another bedroom was added but not recorded for whatever reason.

I had to file revised plans for my own property when I found it was not in accordance with county records and the changes would have to be approved. In my case I had to go down to the county office and see what they actually have on file. You might even be paying lower real estate taxes if the county records only have you down as 2 bedrooms and you actually have three.

[Cameron Green]

Hi Josh,

You can definitely dispute the classification of your property to reflect it as a 3-bedroom instead of a "Den." Here’s how you can approach this:

1. Gather Evidence: Start by collecting any evidence that supports your claim. This can include photos, floor plans, or documentation showing that the room meets the necessary criteria for a bedroom (e.g., size, egress windows, heating).
2. Contact Cuyahoga County Records: Reach out to the Cuyahoga County Fiscal Office or the local assessor’s office. They can guide you through the process for disputing the classification and updating the records.
3. Submit an Application: You may need to fill out a formal application or request to change the property records. Include all your evidence and any relevant details about the property.
4. Appraisal Process: If your request is approved, it might impact future appraisals positively, as the property will be officially recognized as a 3-bedroom.
5. Risks: While there’s generally little risk in disputing the classification, it’s important to ensure that all changes are accurately documented. Inaccurate claims could lead to complications down the line, especially during future sales or refinances.

Overall, the process is straightforward, but patience may be required as it can take some time to update records. Good luck!

[Frank Chin]

Quote from @Cameron Green:

Hi Josh,

You can definitely dispute the classification of your property to reflect it as a 3-bedroom instead of a "Den." Here’s how you can approach this:

1. Gather Evidence: Start by collecting any evidence that supports your claim. This can include photos, floor plans, or documentation showing that the room meets the necessary criteria for a bedroom (e.g., size, egress windows, heating).
2. Contact Cuyahoga County Records: Reach out to the Cuyahoga County Fiscal Office or the local assessor’s office. They can guide you through the process for disputing the classification and updating the records.
3. Submit an Application: You may need to fill out a formal application or request to change the property records. Include all your evidence and any relevant details about the property.
4. Appraisal Process: If your request is approved, it might impact future appraisals positively, as the property will be officially recognized as a 3-bedroom.
5. Risks: While there’s generally little risk in disputing the classification, it’s important to ensure that all changes are accurately documented. Inaccurate claims could lead to complications down the line, especially during future sales or refinances.

Overall, the process is straightforward, but patience may be required as it can take some time to update records. Good luck!

 Alterations to the original building plans, however small, can create risks.

In a nearby county, they have inspectors going around town to check for any unauthorized alterations, A co-worker had an old window AC, his wife was tired of not able to open and use that window, opted to buy a through the wall AC. Hired someone to cut the opening below that window and installed the new AC through the wall. Several years went by and a town inspection found by a drive by inspector noticed the unauthorized alteration, ticketed and fined him for the infraction. Not only that he had to get the installation inspected, approved, and received a notice of back taxes for a few years due to the retroactive reassessment with penalties. He was pissed that the county made such a big deal out of it. He added value to the house and how dare he prevented the town from collecting more money. I was shocked as my dad and I had similar openings cut at our properties for ACs in a nearby city and there were no complaints.

I made fun of him a little that he should tell his wife just to shut up about the stupid window.

[Cameron Green]

Quote from @Frank Chin:

Quote from @Cameron Green:

Hi Josh,

You can definitely dispute the classification of your property to reflect it as a 3-bedroom instead of a "Den." Here’s how you can approach this:

1. Gather Evidence: Start by collecting any evidence that supports your claim. This can include photos, floor plans, or documentation showing that the room meets the necessary criteria for a bedroom (e.g., size, egress windows, heating).
2. Contact Cuyahoga County Records: Reach out to the Cuyahoga County Fiscal Office or the local assessor’s office. They can guide you through the process for disputing the classification and updating the records.
3. Submit an Application: You may need to fill out a formal application or request to change the property records. Include all your evidence and any relevant details about the property.
4. Appraisal Process: If your request is approved, it might impact future appraisals positively, as the property will be officially recognized as a 3-bedroom.
5. Risks: While there’s generally little risk in disputing the classification, it’s important to ensure that all changes are accurately documented. Inaccurate claims could lead to complications down the line, especially during future sales or refinances.

Overall, the process is straightforward, but patience may be required as it can take some time to update records. Good luck!

 Alterations to the original building plans, however small, can create risks.

In a nearby county, they have inspectors going around town to check for any unauthorized alterations, A co-worker had an old window AC, his wife was tired of not able to open and use that window, opted to buy a through the wall AC. Hired someone to cut the opening below that window and installed the new AC through the wall. Several years went by and a town inspection found by a drive by inspector noticed the unauthorized alteration, ticketed and fined him for the infraction. Not only that he had to get the installation inspected, approved, and received a notice of back taxes for a few years due to the retroactive reassessment with penalties. He was pissed that the county made such a big deal out of it. He added value to the house and how dare he prevented the town from collecting more money. I was shocked as my dad and I had similar openings cut at our properties for ACs in a nearby city and there were no complaints.

I made fun of him a little that he should tell his wife just to shut up about the stupid window.

They do in some places but is this Cleveland or a county adjacent? Lay low and stay out of the crossfire. That stinks though

[Evan Polaski]

@Joshua Thang, you can always contest an appraisal if you believe the appraisers conclusion is off for specific reasons. 

I cannot speak to having county update, but are you sure it is inaccurate?  If not, than the appraiser just messed up and should be an "easy" fix by contacting your lender to either have it reappraised or appraisal updated.  If county records are wrong, I would call them first.  In my experience, the county offices have always been very helpful, whether it be auditor, building department, zoning, etc.  

What are risks?  In theory, if they have it recorded as 2 but it is built as 3, they could say it is an illegal bedroom, and inspection is required to get it conforming.  Anytime you invite an inspector onto a property, you run the risk of them deciding to poke around other areas of the house and tag code violations that would need fixed.  

The most common things I would foresee them finding is:
- sill height and size of any window you are counting as secondary ingress/egress. Just having a window does not count.  The moveable pane needs to be a certain size and the sill cannot be too high off the ground (I believe 42' is pretty common). 

- number/spacing of electrical outlets.  Not sure what current code is for bedrooms, but if current code is 1 outlet for every 55 sq ft, and you have a 200 sq ft room, you will need at least 4 outlets.  If you only have 1 or 2, like it common in really old houses, you will need to add more.  And this, in theory, could snowball pretty quickly, depending on current condition of house.

[Frank Chin]

@Cameron Green

I'm in New York City. That occurred in Nassau County just east of NYC. I've been in real estate for many years and never heard of a situation more ridiculous. 

I had another coworker on another occasion found someone strolling in her backyard coming home from work and it was also an inspector from Nassau County. Scary. Lucky for her, they found nothing wrong.

[James Wise]

Quote from @Joshua Thang:

Hi,

So I have a situation where Cuyahoga County records states my house has 2 beds but my house has 3 beds. The appraiser came in and appraised it as a 2 bedroom and called the 3rd bedroom as a "Den". Is this something I can dispute and get the 3 bedroom so I can increase the appraisal value? What is the process like to change Cuyahoga County records? Are there any risks?

Thanks,

Joshua

 The 3rd room likely isn't technically a bedroom. Probably ceiling height, lack of egress or lack of closet space.

[Alfath Ahmed]

Quote from @Joshua Thang:

Hi,

So I have a situation where Cuyahoga County records states my house has 2 beds but my house has 3 beds. The appraiser came in and appraised it as a 2 bedroom and called the 3rd bedroom as a "Den". Is this something I can dispute and get the 3 bedroom so I can increase the appraisal value? What is the process like to change Cuyahoga County records? Are there any risks?

Thanks,

Joshua

 Did you meet the legal requirements for the other "bedroom" to actually be considered a "3rd bedroom". Does it have 36" windows egress, 7 foot ceilings, egress doors, HVAC, and closet door? 

Also, do you need to go through one bedroom to get to that bedroom?