Question involving time spent at a job site?

Question

Over the past few months I have been learning and becoming well versed on the rehabbing and flipping of REOs. I am ready to start searching for my first deal and I had a question I can't seem to find the answer to.

When working with a GC who is managing my entire rehab, how much time should I spend at the job site? I want to be hands on and be in control of the deal, but at the same time I want to let them do their job and not be looking over their shoulder the entire time. I was thinking it would be best to show at random times throughout the day and switch it up every day so I am not predictable. Also, when I'm on site what would I need to be doing besides making sure everything is in order? I would definitely want to learn the process hands on by asking questions and observing, since this would be my first flip, but what else needs to be done when at an active rehab site?

Thanks BP!

Cara Lonsdale · Answer

Then visiting the jobsite before of after the workers get there will give you an idea of what the order of subs is without being in their way.

In a full gut or major rehab, you want to get all demo out of the way first.  Then repair/replacement of any nonworking systems (plumbing, electrical, structural, etc), windows if they are being replaced, then you want to start putting it back together.

I always paint at this point.  Many people save that for later, but I like to paint as the first step toward putting it back together because for some reason it makes me feel like the project has taken the turn toward completed (even when it still has so far to go), and also because it allows for less paint prep since you don't have any floors down yet or cabinets or fixtures to have to wrap up.

Once painted, I move to cabinets and then floors, then fixtures.  Touch up paint along the way, and then all the finishing stuff (baseboards, outlet covers, window coverings if you are doing them, etc).

BTW, don't forget your landscaping!  If your front yard shines like a new penny, then drivebys are going to generate calls.  You could have it sold before you even have it completed!  We just had our total gut rehab rented out before we were finished with the rehab because we had the exterior painted and landscaping done, and people were knocking on the door and calling us to see what we were going to do with it.

George Smith · Answer

I personally will walk through that job site every day until i was comfortable with the contractor and his/her progress. I can see it slowing things down if you're always there AND always asking questions, but besides that I havent seen many delays it has cause provided you respect the contract and his process.

Christopher B. · Answer

Not to sound like a jerk but have you ever ran or even been on a jobsite before? This is residential remodeling, not the building of a multistory commercial building. OSHA.. hard hats.. let's not go overboard here on the technicalities or scare tactics

Also, it's HIS property, therefore it is HIS jobsite. He can show-up whenever he dang well pleases. Him being on the jobsite doesn't have to stop anything and if the GC doesn't want him around then he needs to find anothet GC.

Hunter (My @ doesn't work because BP refuses to support droid), your initial idea is correct. Go often as you like, go by randomly. Do know the jobsite will be different when you are and are not there because you are "the boss". You may even hear about someone bitching about you behind your back if you ask for something to be "corrected," let it roll off your back. Construction sites are a unique atmosphere. GL

Ola Dantis · Answer

@Hunter Harms I think you should take your time to learn a ton about the elements of rehabbing I mean absorb as much technical content as you can get your hands on.

As an alternative, you can hire a project manager, as the cost is slightly lower. If you are able to be really hands-on (if you don't have a full time job for example), then you should be super hands on. In reality, you are going to be hands on anyways, and you may start wondering why you are paying your GC anyways (unless you get an amazing GC).

Now, what you could also consider doing is partnering with a local rehabber in your market, but you must be ready to provide value to that rehabber either in the form of providing a juicy deal to him/her or in the form of capital. In this case, you should be willing to split profits. A better option to start out with because you are opened to other opportunities through this rehabber and you get to learn a ton from the rehabber as opposed to just paying a GC, who may (or may not) use OSHA BS on you.

In any case, it is better to learn as much as you can before diving in (it will serve you well).

Hope this helps. Good luck. Thanks! - Ola

Michael Noto · Answer

This all depends on the relationship and the trust level you have with your GC, but if it is your first time using this particular GC here is what I would recommend:

1. Make sure you have written out in a contract all of the work you expect to be done (this cannot be to specific in my opinion) and the payments schedule/work milestones timeline agreed upon upfront to avoid any confusion down the line. Then from there you are basically just managing the GC to make sure everything agreed upon is getting done the way it was planned.

2. Go to the job as much as you can before the work starts and after it ends for a given day the first couple weeks. If the GC is not getting things done time wise or quality wise the way you expect it is best to nip those problem in the bud early on so if you need to pivot to a new contractor you aren't coming to that realization a month in.

3. If they are progressing the way you expect the first 2 weeks then I would start going 3 times a week just to make sure there is consistent progress. The worst thing for a flip is for it to sit stagnant. You always want to make sure something is getting done.

4. There will be things that come up during the project that are unexpected and will cause the scope of work and the budget to increase. Make sure you have a plan in place for how you want the contractor to communicate these issues. For instance, if you can't always pick up your phone make sure your GC is text or email savvy. Not all of them are.

I am just scratching the surface on here and this is a topic that many have written books on including J. Scott and his books are for sale here right on BP. I recommend anything he has put out flipping wise in terms of books or forum posts. Very good resource and he presents things in a very easy to read fashion.

Cara Lonsdale · Answer

Your GC may have issues with you just showing up at their jobsite as there are OSHA regulations, and workers are required to walk off the jobsite if an unsafe condition exists (IE you showing up without a hard hat).

However, absent of a GC that pulls the OSHA card on you, I don't think it's unreasonable for you to show up and want to see what is being done as long as you aren't in the subs way.  Don't show up on tile day and want to walk around.

My suggestion would be to either be in another part of the property discussing plans for that, or come for a visit before or after the subs go home, and you can assess their progress for the day.

Personally, I don't use a GC unless it is a major project that requires it.  I Serve as my own GC, and just hire subs.  This way, YOU are in total control, and can be there whenever you want.  As you progress through rehab projects, you should be collecting business cards and/or contact info from the subs that you think do good work.  Build your team of subs.

GCs are good for people who just want it all done, and don't want to be involved themselves.  However, it sounds like you WANT to be involved, so you may look at taking the reins down the road.

Milind Shastri · Answer

@Hunter Harms , my wife and I recently got our house rehabbed. And she managed all the sub-contractors right from hiring them to modifying the job and making the final payment. Mind it, that her personality is gentle and soft spoken; and she still did it. Hats off to her! She managed the following contractors: foundation team (4), painting team (5), handy team (3), flooring team (2) & demo guy.

How we were able to do it was:

1. every day we would sit together and discuss all the little details of what planning out the project. We first learned what it will take to do it our self, and on many occasions, did it ourselves too just to understand how much time it really takes and most importantly, to learn the vocabulary for the job. For learning this we used youtube and an excellent resource by home depot (https://www.homedepot.com/p/The-Home-Depot-Home-Im...).

2. Once we knew how to do it ourself, then we had a few sub-contractors walk through to bid for the job and in that process re-calibrate our understanding & vocubalary of the job.

3. We'd draft up a contract with a clear description of the job and payment schedule. With this, everyone knew what they were agreeing on and made the job easier. Any changes would be priced as add-ons and the contractors seemed quite fair.

Wish you all the best and believe me, its a very satisfying experience. Just do your homework and plan it out.

Cara Lonsdale · Answer

Of course it is, and just to be clear, I have been an investor since 2002.  So, I am not a novice at jobsites.  However, if you want your jobsite to run the most efficiently, then you won't show up while everyone is there because it holds up progress.  If you show up and walk the jobsite when the flooring guy is there....messes him up.  Wanna walk it during painting?...messes up the painter.

My comments were to remind you that even though you have the RIGHT to show up, doesn't mean that you should. The subs quote a rate based on the time it will take them to complete the job, and the effort and materials it will take.  If you come by and halt them from working, you are cutting into their time budget.

SO, my suggestion was to come by after the work day has commenced, or at lunch time, or be in an area that isn't being worked on where you will get in the way.  It's just about courtesy.  You ahve a budget for your project, but you have to respect that the workers do also.

Christopher B. · Answer

Checking on YOUR jobsite should not slow the progress or anger anyone. If that has been your experience I highly recommend you reevaluate the GC's you use. It's also important to note that they are in-fact YOUR jobsites, don't let anyone ever say differently.

Question involving time spent at a job site?

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