Should I Replacing Entire Plumbing / Electrical?

Question

Hi all!

This is the first time I'm working on a rehab that's more than just cosmetic. We're finishing a basement & also considering updating electrical / plumbing. Our contractor said we should definitely replace the electric panel, but might be able to get away with using the old wiring. He said the plumbing could be okay as well. The home was built in 1940, and I think most of the stuff is original.

My questions:

1) How do you gauge whether or not you should replace the entire electrical / plumbing system?

2) Generally, what's the cost for replacing the entire thing?

3) If we don't replace it now, would it need to be replaced in the future anyway?

Also, any other contractor recommendations in the North Seattle area? Trying to get some more bids as well :)

Cheers!

Zeb B. · Answer

If the 1940s wiring is original then it is definitely due for an upgrade. A buyer's inspection will likely flag knob and tube wiring as a fire hazard. If the wiring is nonmetallic cable (romex - plastic looking outside layer of insulation) and has a ground wire (3rd wire, bare copper) it might be fine to keep. If the insulation on the wires looks like cloth impregnated with black tar it is past it's service life.

If you are tearing down the plaster/drywall/paneling on the walls and exposing the studs and the plumbing is old (not copper for the supply pipes or PVC/ABS for the sewer pipes) I would update the piping. I don't do flips though, so your cost/benefit analysis might be different than mine as a buy/hold investor.

Fishing new wires and pipes through existing walls is a huge expensive job. Much less labor intensive if the walls are down to just studs.

Eliott Elias · Answer

Get three licensed tradesmen to walk the property and get their input. Most will tell you to replace all to cash the big check. Honest tradesmen will be honest and lay our options for you. Rewiring an entire house costs me 5-9k. If the home has never had electrical updating you need to get a bigger breaker and rewire the home

Kevin Sobilo · Answer

@Eric Yu, if the contractor said you might be able to replace the panel and not the wiring, then I suspect it is not original. In 1940, I think it would have been a fuse panel not breakers and that the wiring might have still lacked a separate ground wire.

So, do you have a panel with breakers not fuses? Are there ground wires running to outlets? Did you test the outlets with a tester to see if they are grounded? That is cheap and simple to do.

If you aren't sure what you have with your panel, post a picture.

Similar idea with plumbing. I would ask WHY anything needs to be replaced? Have the materials failed (leaks)? Are there other issues like lack of venting, S-traps, etc which can be corrected without a complete replacement.

Its easy for a contractor to spend your money and say replace things. If the contractor isn't helping you make good decisions, maybe get a local investor wh is savy to technical issues of rehabbing to help you. They could walk through a property and give you advice.

Tyler Fontaine · Answer

1) Get your contractor/electrician/plumber to see what you HAVE to do to remain within code requirements and meet those at a minimum. Also, look at what it will cost to bandaid it or to replace the whole thing. If the price to replace is within budget I'd do it because you're putting out a newer/safer/more reliable product.

2) Cost to replace the entire systems is tough to gauge without knowing the building size and style... Will all the walls be open? Is any of it salvageable? Are you changing layout and have to move drain lines, gas lines, water lines to new locations?

3) Yes you will have to replace it eventually.... When is the better question? I dont think the n acceptable answer would be 6 months after you sold it. We try to put out a good product that new owners are happy with. Ask your people the lifespan of the old stuff and then go from there.

Nicole Webb · Answer

YES you should. If the electrical and plumbing are from 1962 and you've added 2024 upgrades, that's just putting lipstick on a pig.  You don't want to be the sort who's selling lemons

Drew Sygit · Answer

Why spend money on something that isn't broke, that doesn't add any value or ROI?

Brian Hughes · Answer

galvanized supply pipes  and branch drains that are still in service are probably on the edge of failure.   Common locations for supply lines to fail are where male threaded galvanized pipe is threaded into brass or copper valve and fitting bodies  (due to galvanic corrosion)  and hot water lines will rust up so badly as to start restricting water flow or begin leaking a decade or two before the cold side fails similarly.   It also depends to some degree on your water supply - how acidic it is - and climate,  etc.    Galvanized supply lines can still be holding water but be very fragile if the corrosion has progressed far enough.  Sometimes you can tell because of rust staining and buildup on the outside of such affected pipes,   but even without that they can be weakened considerably from their original state.On the drain side galvanized branch drains  (1.25 through 2" galvanized pipes)  can also rust out or clog up as the rust on the inside is very rough and catches hair, grease,  and other debris and will eventually need aggressive rootering,   which if the pipes have rusted enough may open up holes in them.I should note CAST IRON (hub and bell) old sewer pipe,  at least the 3" and 4" stuff seems to have a bit longer lifespan than galvanized steel;  it still rusts but doesn't crumble and flake and encourage blockages like steel does,   so an old house with a cast 4" sewer stack you may be fine for many decades more if you just replace all the branch lines going into it but leave the main stack.    However I have seen rusted through cast iron as well.On the electrical side agree that any wiring that doesn't have vinyl outer sheath and a ground wire should be considered obsolete and past its service life.    Any breaker panel that doesn't have a main disconnect should also be considered obsolete,   irrespective of if it is "big" enough or not.   Owing to the trend towards smaller,  more efficient appliances and LED lighting  electrical loads I think are somewhat less than they may have been per SF like in the 70's through 2000's when everybody had incandescent lighting and big tube TVs and refrigerators, dishwashers,  etc. that used 2 or 3x as much power as modern ones.I've had a couple turn-of-century units rewired to remove K&T and failed 'BX" (flexible steel sheathed  2 wire cable)  and agree with other posters the pricing isn't that bad as long as you can find an electrician that has some experience with that kind of work,   and sometimes it might be helpful to open up some cable routes ahead of time for them to use so they don't have to do the exploratory work.   If your home will likely remain economically viable  (not in path of redevelopment in next 10 years)  its probably worth looking at some systems upgrades.

Should I Replacing Entire Plumbing / Electrical?

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