Tenant disputing Sec. Deposit charges - time limit they can?

Question

My property is a fully furnished house; I do short term rentals only in NYS.

I had 3 guys in there for a 2 month lease in late October (company paid for). 18 days into their lease I discovered pot and smoking going on in the house and on property. They admitted to it and after another inspection I gave them an option to stay with lease modifications. They blew me off for a few days. Then offered them key-for-cash to get out in 24 hours; it was 10 days of rent. They agreed and signed a lease cancellation agreement. They weren't there for inspection despite them knowing. Found a few buds in a dresser drawer.

Anyways. I kept the full deposit charged for the environmental cleaning and stanley steemer. Sent them the certified notice and details of the charges and discovery of smoking crap. 26 days later I get an email from one of them;

"sorry for the delay. We just saw the charges and we don't agree. felt they were aggregious.... We'd like to discuss a fair cost and leave this agreement in peace"

It was something like that. Seriously, they signed a smoking addendum in the original lease, company agent did too. They fraudulently entered into a contract knowing they would break it. leave pot around. could easily smell it despite them saying they only smoked on patio. I don't care about people smoking pot and such, just not in my property. (hell they can grow their own pot garden at home for all I care)

So my question; 26 DAYS? does NYS have a a rule (or yours) about time limit a tenant can dispute deposit charges? I followed my time limits. What have you done in this situation? I have no intention of coming to an "agreement" they are the ones who screwed up and cost me time and money.

Nathan Gesner · Answer

They violated your lease but that doesn't automatically entitle you to the full deposit. In one sentence you claim to have receipts for the charges but in another sentence you seem to indicate you are withholding some of the deposit because you are angry that they had dope in your rental.

This isn't an emotional issue, it's a factual issue. You hired someone to clean the property and that's what the tenant should be charged for. You don't get to keep additional money just because they violated your lease.

Patricia Steiner · Answer

Geez...you sure did a lot for these jerks - including paying them to leave - to now be playing around with a security deposit dispute. Look at the NY Landlord-Tenant Law first; here it is:

https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/new-york-landlords-guide-security-deposit-disputes-small-claims-court.html

Did you comply with all the requirements? Notice within 14 days? Did you make that itemized deduction list? If so, time to cowboy up and quit playing their game by their rules. Let them know(in writing via certified mail) that you have deducted expenses in excess of normal wear and tear resulting from their illegal drug use on the property and more which were violations of their lease and NY State Law. Remind them of the over-the-norm steps taken to remove them from the property including paying them to leave, and that all is documented should a court action be initiated by either party.

Would I give the security deposit back? No. And, I wouldn't respond to the guy via email either. That door has been slammed. Send a letter by certified mail to the last known address stating the reasons and cost of the deductions. They're counting on playing you again and having you cave-in - again. Let them know that ship has sailed. "The pot butts will be retained for any pending court case as will the statements provided by those licensed and bonded contractors who corrected the resulting damage." That should give a little pause.

And, before you take this route in the future, please know this:

3 Reasons New York Landlords Can Keep a Security Deposit

In the state of New York, a landlord can keep all or a portion of a tenant's security deposit to cover:

• Damage in excess of normal wear and tear
• Unpaid rent.
• Additional breaches of the lease agreement.

Bottom line: Know your business. Know your state law. Enforce your lease. And, don't come on BP to get opinions when what you need are facts.

You may not be entitled to the full security deposit because you elected not to send a Notice To Quit for the lease violation (pot smoking; it's still illegal in your state) and collect for that PLUS unpaid rent and excess damages. But I do think it's time to hold your ground, play hard ball, and move on.

Eli Lederman · Answer

let them sue you if they think they are entitles to a refund

Jacob Fedechko · Answer

I do not practice law in New York (and you should contact someone who does), but my best guess is that this is a contract issue. If your rental agreement says that the tenants have X days to dispute the charges and they delay, too bad for them. But if your contract is silent as to that issue, then tenants may have the duration of the statute of limitations period (my guess is about 6 years) to dispute the charges. If your contract says that smoking pot/possessing illegal substances on the premises results in forfeiture of the security deposit, that should also cover you. Hope this helps.

Corby Goade · Answer

As usual, Nathan is right. This is a bargain learning opportunity for you. For a few bucks, you have an opportunity here to improve your screening and tighten up your lease.

Become familiar with your state's rental laws- most Attorney's General publish a booklet for tenants and landlords that summarize their rights. Make sure your lease complies, but protects you as much as possible. Hire a real estate attorney- most will have a lease you can use that follows the law, but protects you as a landlord as much as possible. They can help you modify they lease in ways that you need for your particular business model, but still complies.

Most investors have been exactly where you are at some point- keep pushing through and make improvements to your model. At some point, you will rarely, if ever, have to deal with this type of issue again.

Good luck!

Mary M. · Answer

can you prove, with receipts, the amount withheld from their deposit? that is the important part....

Edward R. · Answer

Hi! OMG , the one renter (there were 3 and one speaking on the others behalf) emailed me again last week and called today (voicemail) saying he sent an email and would like to folloup on their stay and wished me a Happy New Year.

I have no problem folllowing up but he can send a demand letter via mail and I'll respond to that stating the violated several conditions of the lease, smoked pot in house and remedies are expensive. and followup with my attorneys name and contact them from here on out.

Notice to quit, got me if that applies as they signed a Lease Termination Agreement

with the "keys for Cash" I offered them. If I speak with my real estate attorney and he tells me to settle I will. never know what quirky law may apply. but in general it does persnoally bother me how I went out of my way for their stay, and that they knowingly signed a contract that they intended to break. That is fraudulent by misrepresentation in my eyes. People can smoke pot all they want, helk I even think they should be allowed to grow it in their garden...but just not on my property.

BTW: Thanks to you great and meaningful responses. They are all right on and knowing the laws is so important and making sure procedures are followed. NYS recently changed laws this year (to the disadvantage of Landlords) so what LL may have known changed somewhat this year 2019

Tenant disputing Sec. Deposit charges - time limit they can?

Tenant disputing Sec. Deposit charges - time limit they can?

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