Serving first 3-day Notice to Pay/Quit - Any helpful experience?

[Elena T.]

I'm serving a 3-day notice to pay or quit this afternoon. It's totally my fault; I allowed an alternative method for a month, and the tenant took full advantage of my willingness to work with her. I've heard nothing for a few days.

I understand what the process if she doesn't answer, but this is a real pain in the rear. She's been a decent tenant for the first 12 months of her lease, but it was full of late payments and excuses. From now on, I must be strict. I admit, I've been very lucky in the past, with wonderful tenants, this is my first tenant that has had any issues. I didn't pay attention to  the excuse pattern until recently, when an agreed upon term was not met, nor was there a call regarding it. 

I know what I must to do, legally, to get past due monies and how to move forward if she responds/fails to respond. This thing makes me nervous as I've heard some horror stories from Landlords as California is a tenant friendly state.

Does anyone have any helpful tips, experience they'd like to share with this kind of situation? 

Cheers, Elena

[Kyle J.]

Sorry to hear about your tenant troubles.  It happens to most of us at one time or another.  Think of it as a learning experience.  I bet you won't let it get to the 25th of the month before you serve the notice next time. :)

First thing you need to do is make sure your notice has the required information in it (i.e. name, address, and phone # of person to pay; exact amount of rent that is due; do not list any late fees in the notice; where and how payment is to be made; etc).  Then make sure it is properly served (i.e. personal service, substituted service on another person, or "nailing and mailing").

Then wait the 3 days to see if the tenant pays.  (Note: Begin counting the three days on the first day after the notice was served. If the third day falls on a Saturday, Sunday, or holiday, the three-day period will not expire until the following Monday or non-holiday. If you served it via the "nailing and mailing" method, service of the notice is not complete until the copy of the notice has been mailed. The 3-day period begins the day after the notice was posted and mailed.)

If the tenant doesn't pay, it's time to file an Unlawful Detainer lawsuit.

For what it's worth, I realize California has a notoriously bad reputation for being tenant-friendly (and that may be more true in some parts of the state than others).  However, I've actually spent time at the courthouse sitting in on eviction hearings to learn more about them and haven't found much to warrant the reputation of being overly tenant friendly.  It was actually quite fair and expedient.  In every case I saw the landlord was prepared and in the right and won their case.  Not to say there aren't some jurisdictions or isolated incidents that could be different, but that could happen in any state.  Just be prepared when/if you have to go to court and you should be okay.

Hope it works out for you.

[Katrina Edwards]

Hi Elena.  You might check with your local eviction guru on whether or not you can serve that notice yourself.  If you are the property owner, you likely need to have someone else serve it for you and then fill out a proof of service.  The key is to have her served properly and fill out the notice as well as the proof of service properly.  You might call Todd Rothbard's office in San Jose.  While he started his eviction-only practice in Silicon Valley, I think he might have an arm up your way now.  He's also send you the forms and instructions for you need for free.  I would not use anyone else to do an eviction in CA.  In my almost 30 years in the real estate industry with a focus on PM I've served a ton of notices, but only had to send the file to Todd 5 times (both residential and commercial).  Since I don't serve notices too often, I always check with him before I do to make sure I'm up to date.  There is no charge to call his office and talk.  You can drop my name, Katrina Edwards, Triumph Property Services if you like. 

Again, the key is to fill out the forms correctly.  You don't want your case thrown out on a technicality.  Waste of time and money.  

On the bright side, sometimes just serving the 3-day notice will get the tenant's attention and they fall in line.

Good luck to you.

[Stephen Haynes]

Originally posted by @Elena T.:

I'm serving a 3-day notice to pay or quit this afternoon. It's totally my fault; I allowed an alternative method for a month, and the tenant took full advantage of my willingness to work with her. I've heard nothing for a few days.

I understand what the process if she doesn't answer, but this is a real pain in the rear. She's been a decent tenant for the first 12 months of her lease, but it was full of late payments and excuses. From now on, I must be strict. I admit, I've been very lucky in the past, with wonderful tenants, this is my first tenant that has had any issues. I didn't pay attention to  the excuse pattern until recently, when an agreed upon term was not met, nor was there a call regarding it. 

I know what I must to do, legally, to get past due monies and how to move forward if she responds/fails to respond. This thing makes me nervous as I've heard some horror stories from Landlords as California is a tenant friendly state.

Does anyone have any helpful tips, experience they'd like to share with this kind of situation? 

Cheers, Elena

 I would call Gary Link he is a Sacramento Attorney, his law office has processed over 39,000 evictions. If you want the contact info PM me or google him. It is well worth it to hire a professional for the first one and watch the process. 

[Kyle J.]

Originally posted by @Katrina Edwards:

Hi Elena.  You might check with your local eviction guru on whether or not you can serve that notice yourself.  If you are the property owner, you likely need to have someone else serve it for you and then fill out a proof of service. 

The landlord doesn't need someone else to serve a 3-day notice in California.  The landlord can do it him/herself.  If it gets all the way to the Unlawful Detainer lawsuit, then that's when you'll need someone else to serve that paperwork for you.  It can be a process server, the Sheriff's Office, or anyone over the age of 18 who is not a party to the lawsuit.

[Elena T.]

@Kyle J. thanks for the information. I read and reread Sac County's eviction process and that is exactly what it said. I worked out a deal with her. I had to do it one other time and she came through, but you give 'em an inch... On the 5th, from now on, the process starts. 

@Katrina Edwards thanks! I'll keep you message handy, in case I run into an issue later on.

@Stephen Haynes thank you for the recommendation

Update - My husband went to serve her this evening, but there was no one home. He called and said he peeked through the window, as the blinds were open and the place was nearly empty, just a few boxes stacked up.  I immediately wrote a notice of inspection which we will post tomorrow morning as I call to give her my 24 hour notice of entry into the premises. 

She has 9 months left on her lease and I may be jumping the gun, but are there any other steps I should take? We have a clause in the lease about breaking early, and the penalty, but since she's already shown this side of her tenancy, I don't know what else she'd do.

[Katrina Edwards]

did he post the notice? Did you put it in the mail? You should still do that in order to cover yourself. When I post the notice and no one is home I put it in an envelope with their name in big black pen. But I use blue painters tape and I tape it directly to the front door right next to the lock. 

[Stephen Haynes]

well at least you wont have to pay for an eviction and hopefully the house is still in good shape. 

[Neil G.]

across clients i see a growing trend here in socal to post 3 days notice to pay or quit as early as the day after the rent is due, which is likely due to the currently crashing economy as well as since california law stipulates that the Notice cannot reflect any late fees, it makes sense to do just that from now on to start the ball (3 days rolling) towards UD. 

[Elena T.]

@Katrina Edwards, yes and yes. Posted and mailed.

@Neil G. I noticed the trend too, and didn't think I would do such a thing. However, after this ordeal with my tenant, I will. Why should I pay for someone else to live in my house? Essentially, that is what I am doing by not taking action. 

Tenants and toilets, two necessary evils of buy-and-hold real estate :)

[Katrina Edwards]

I try and set expectations with the tenants upfront.  I also squeeze the grace period from rent due to late fee application down to three days.  I make an extra effort to make sure the renters know that rent is DUE on the first, LATE on the second and late fees apply after the third.  Lots of folks have 5-10 day grace periods, but I think that gives the tenants a false sense of it being OK to push payment to the late fee date.  Just my 2 cents.

Let us know what happens with your renter.

[Neil G.]

Amen, investment sister! I'm currently going thru the same thing (tenants have ignored the 3 day to pay or quit and lawyer said it will cost 3 to 6 THOUSAND to evict so he said just do it myself or through a paralegal.. theres so many boxes to check off on the Complaint & Summons!).

In your case.. it sounds like she's already somewhat packed and ready to quit?

[Jason D.]

Elena T. e

I know everyone is talking about using the official time consuming eviction route. However, if I was the tenant I would be soiling myself and pulling all the punches to not get evicted because I would have no where else to go. I was listening to one of he podcasts and thought what if you gave the tenant $500 and hired movers. I'm sure the price would be similar to court costs and the Benefit for the tenant is that hey would not have an official eviction on record. For me I would look at an eviction as a life long black list or reason for ridiculous down payment or elevated rent. I have no experience on ever using this technique but I was wondering has anyone tried this or are there any flaws in this logic?

[Michael Noto]

If an attorney is handling the eviction let them deal with everything and limit your interaction with the tenant to just responding to urgent maintenance requests. 

If you are handling the eviction make sure you are following the laws of your state to a T when evicting them. Any misstep could cause a serious delay in getting them out. 

Every investor goes through this. Don't let it get you down. 

In my 10+ years as a landlord I have never had someone catch up on rent after they fell behind at least a month. If there is no money there is no money. I

To protect your interest always serve the notice to quit the first day you can this way if you need to proceed with a full blown eviction you have already taken the first step. 

[Stephen Haynes]

Originally posted by @Neil G.:

Amen, investment sister! I'm currently going thru the same thing (tenants have ignored the 3 day to pay or quit and lawyer said it will cost 3 to 6 THOUSAND to evict so he said just do it myself or through a paralegal.. theres so many boxes to check off on the Complaint & Summons!).

In your case.. it sounds like she's already somewhat packed and ready to quit?

 In Sacramento county most evictions cost less than $ 1000

[Neil G.]

Wow that sounds dirt cheap compared to what my LA attorney quoted, which included $300 just to buy a case # from court to put on the Summons, then $100 per TENANT to be served by registered process server (in my case 4 on the lease plus a couple john does!) and the statutory fees already racked up close to $1k not even including his fees

i would have thought in all counties of CA it would be around the same, since its the same court (Superior)

[Jai Coward]

Hello all, I know this thread is old but I figured the title was still relevant, as I am preparing to serve my 1st 3 Day Pay or Quit. 

My tenant is currently on a month to month lease - has been in the property for about 20 months now.

She is past due on her July rent, looks like August won't be any different. She refuses to communicate as to why she is always late, or even to set up a plan - for which my wife and I are completely willing to work with her on. In CA, I understand I have to give 60 days notice for tenants who have lived in the unit for over a year, but, I also know there are certain circumstances, like paying rent late or not at all, that allows Landlords to expedite the process. So, because she is in violation of the lease by paying rent late (almost every month by the way), can't I just serve her with the 3 day pay or quit and tell her to leave in X days instead of needing to use the 60 day notice?

Also, do I have to do a formal walk through in these processes, or is it about getting my unit back from the tenant first and foremost and then having the time to do all the admin stuff (walk thru, inspection to determine deposit return amount, etc.?)

If someone could walk me through the exact process in this scenario, I'd greatly appreciate it! Process meaning, can I post the 3 day or Unconditional quit notice or does it still have to be the 60 day notice... who has to serve it using the "post and mail" option... once it is served, after the allotted time expires without payment, what do I do next... etc.?!?!

Thanks!