Financial Advisors vs Investors

Financial Advisors vs Investors

Investor · St Petersburg, FL · Member since 2014 · 231 posts · 221 votes

My wife and I have been interviewing financial advisors lately, all CFP's from reputable firms, and all fiduciaries. We've reached a point where we have enough income from our day jobs that we feel we need some help diversifying and directing it to meet our goals. We've both started learning as much as we can about REI and personal finance (separate but related topics in our opinion), especially since we got married last year. I've been a buy and hold investor for about 3 years, together we own 4 properties (including my home, which will get rented eventually) and aside from those four mortgages, we are totally debt free. We plan to buy more, and I may do real estate part- or full-time when I get out of the military.

But in listening to several financial podcasts, and at least one of the interviews with a CFP, I hear a lot of warnings against real estate. One advisor even said "when the market peaks, I would get rid of all those houses." Could be good advice, but there's a lot more to consider when making such a decision, obviously.

So is this anti-real estate mentality a result of lack of understanding, or seeing other clients' lack of success in REI? Why are so many financial professionals against owning real estate?

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Investor · Fort Wayne, IN · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 515 votes
10y

@Colin Reidfollow the money trail, how does a cfp make money telling you real estate is good. They want/need your money in the stock market to make money. just MHO

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  • Investor · Fort Wayne, IN · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 515 votes
    10y

    @Colin Reidfollow the money trail, how does a cfp make money telling you real estate is good. They want/need your money in the stock market to make money. just MHO

  • Investor · Princeton, TX · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    10y

    @Colin Reid  I agree with @Jeremy Tillotson.  You should also ask him which day last year he told all his clients to dump all their stocks and bonds because those markets were peaking.

  • Ned CareyPro Member
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    Investor · Baltimore, MD · Member since 2008 · 17k+ posts · 13k+ votes
    10y

    I doubt CFPs know near as much about real estate investing as their REI clients and they only know the REI market in very general terms but all real estate is local.

    I actually agree next time we have a significant peak like we did in 2007~ that is the time to sell. But I sure wouldn't count on a CFP to tell me when that was!

  • Real Estate Broker · North Richland Hills, TX · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 607 votes
    10y

    How much is the stock market down YTD?   Would you rather have your money invested there?      

    I've gotten some really dumb financial advice from money managers, and every time I've hired one I've outperformed him/her w/ the portion of the portfolio I held back to self-manage.     They seem to be very conservative and focus on avoiding getting beat too bad by the market vs. helping your get wealthy.

  • Professional · Riverside, CA · Member since 2009 · 254 posts · 273 votes
    10y

    What you are seeing is clearly a "my way is better.".  The financial advisors putting down real estate.  And the above commenters, who are real estate investors, putting down stock markets.  I actually think it's ignorant to believe one is truly better than the other.

    It is inaccurate to simply compare purely numbers for ROI. If I invest in the S&P index fund, I set it and forget it. Even when I "lost" money in 2008 during the great recession, it was simply unrealized losses that recovered over the next few years. This frees up my time to do other activities like make an income from a job.

    Let's just say the S&P index IRR over past 6 years is 10%, a real estate investor who flips houses can say, "REI is so much better" because my return when I flip houses is 35%. But the flipper is working essentially a job. So if I include my income from my job with the S&P index fund (again because I'm not spending any time on the investment), then chances are, my returns are greater than the house flipper.

    Even in a buy/hold REI spends some effort and time in dealing with the investment, the time taken can be considered an opportunity cost of the investment.

    Furthermore, when RE takes a downturn, because most investors leverage their properties, REAL losses occur due capital injection to meet expenses and foreclosures.  The S&P index investor has only paper/unrealized losses that over time is expected to recover.  

    It just depends on what kind of investor you want to be. I've met many many REI that "lost everything" during 2008. Yes, they've rebuilt since then. But for myself, I prefer a more smoother path. I am diversified in domestic/foreign stocks, bonds, REITs, small businesses, and real estate. It's unlikely I will "lose everything" ever, no matter how the market turns. But then again, I don't expect to make Forbes richest either.

  • Property Manager · San Bernardino, CA · Member since 2014 · 473 posts · 238 votes
    10y

    @Daniel Chang

    Hi Daniel, I agree with most of your statement except where you say flipping is comparable to a job. Flipping is more comparable to owning a business. Yes there is work involved, but if I am good at what I do, I will make much more money than working for someone else as an employee. I can eventually hire people to drive and do the paperwork. I can eventually hire a manager (Or team of managers) to take over my job. I can sit passively while I still bring in say, 20% after paying all of my employees. 

    Now, I am not knocking investing in stocks. If that is what someone feels comfortable with, then they should invest in that. Warren Buffet says, "If you don't understand a business, don't buy it." There are many paths to becoming wealthy, and most of them aren't passive.

  • Investor · San Diego, CA · Member since 2014 · 592 posts · 765 votes
    10y

    Be sure to get a fee-only planner who gets paid by consultation.  The ones who work for a larger brokerage and push products onto you are nothing more than glorified salesmen who will neither understand nor care about your finances.

  • Investor · St Petersburg, FL · Member since 2014 · 231 posts · 221 votes
    10y

    @Daniel Chang, I agree with your sentiment, and that's why we're trying to diversify. We're certainly not getting out of real estate anytime soon, but we realize a need to be in other asset classes as well. 

    @Frank Jiang, we've been burned by a salesman claiming to be an "advisor" once. That's why we're only interested in working with fiduciaries.

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