To sell or to keep my condo?

To sell or to keep my condo?

Member since 2023 · 21 posts · 8 votes

I bought a 1 bedroom condo in 2005 for $135k. It’s just outside of Philly on the “Main Line”. It’s an affluent area with blue ribbon schools in a great location within walking distance to town and the train station into Center City Philadelphia as well as the suburbs. By being outside the city (the city line is a few blocks away), you save on city wage tax. 

I've been renting the condo out at a loss since I moved out in 2007 because it was underwater for a long time. I couldn't even refinance when rates were low. Back in 2014, a mortgage appraiser valued the home at $85k, comparing the condo to an REO property and a co-op in another town since nothing in the complex had sold in a few years. Everyone was holding on to their condos like me. Since then, I've paid several special assessments, replaced the HVAC and hot water heater twice, and absorbed tax and HOA increases. Back in 2005, I was able to charge about $1050 for rent and now I was finally able to increase to $1250 because rents in the area have finally gone up. I'm still not breaking even but not losing a ton.

FINALLY this place is nearly paid off. In hindsight, I’m certain that I would have done better putting my money into an S&P index fund (even with tenants helping pay down the principal) but you know what they say about hindsight…


I was excited to see that two 2 bedrooms in the complex have sold for a record price (for the complex) at over $200. I was excited and thought that this would be the year to sell. Using square feet as a basis, I estimated that this meant that my condo could sell for around $170k. However recently a few 1 bedrooms sold for around $130k…still less than what I paid for my 1 bedroom!


I’ve been talking to the listing agent for the 2 bedroom that went for $220k. The owner had to spend about $25k to get this much for their condo.  For a “typical” home, $25k would be reasonable, but we both agree that it’s not worth putting more than a few thousand in - if that. And he won’t really suggest a listing price, other than to say that a few 1 bedrooms went for $130k recently. My unit has a few things going for it, such as being on the top floor. It is well-maintained and there probably wouldn’t be many inspection findings. However it doesn’t have a garage space and kitchen has the old 80s cabinets (realtor says that we can paint them). Appliances are newer.

Do I cut my losses and just sell the place? It kills me to lose money after so many years of effort but I could at least have a down payment for perhaps two income producing rental homes that might actually appreciate one day (in a totally different state that is!). If I keep the condo, it will be paid off soon at which point I’ll get about $800/month in income (not factoring in maintenance and turnover). If all I did was sell and put the money in a high yield savings account, I could make nearly that much with no effort. 

If I do sell, would it be worth waiting until the renters move out in the spring (I would need to terminate the lease)? I would make some minor updates then (eg painting kitchen cabinets). I fear that I wouldn’t be to sell after terminating the lease, or that I wouldn’t get more money for the condo and now I’ve just spent more than I needed to. On the flip side, I could probably update the cabinets while the tenants lived there, and tell them that if I don’t find a buyer, at least they will have a nice looking kitchen. 

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Morris County, NJ · Member since 2020 · 5k+ posts · 2k+ votes
2y

@Lori Edelman

Yeah, sorry about your situation.  Mine is omething similar.  Since mine were purchased ~20years ago, they didn't come back up to value until just over a year ago.

You don't hear about it, but lots of RE investors lose money.  Just about nobody wants to post about it.  I've lost money, but luckily i have made otu more than I've lost.  We just hit bad timing because of the 07-08 crash.  Lots of people are running around saying how great RE is, but many have onlyi been doing it for the past 5-7 years when values and rents have skyrocketed.  Also, catching the tail of the rise after the 07-08 correction.

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  • Morris County, NJ · Member since 2020 · 5k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    2y

    @Lori Edelman sounds like you need to sell.  Not entirely sure of your market and landlord/tenant laws in PA, but probably sell when the tenant it out.  The market is still strong with homeownership in my area and we aren't that far apart.

    Yeah, hindsight is 20/20.  Who knew the public markets would soar with double digit+ returns for the last 20-25 years!  Just more options to look at, especially if you investigate other investing strategies.

    Anyway, hope this bit helps.  Happy to chat.  Good luck.

  • Member since 2021 · 7 posts · 0 votes
    2y

    You could do a lease option and still collect rent without having the responsibility of taking care of it. so maintenance costs you 0

  • Member since 2023 · 21 posts · 8 votes
    2y
    Quote from @Alakai Richardson:

    You could do a lease option and still collect rent without having the responsibility of taking care of it. so maintenance costs you 0

    Can you please clarify what a lease option is?
  • Member since 2023 · 21 posts · 8 votes
    2y
    Quote from @David M.:

    @Lori Edelman sounds like you need to sell.  Not entirely sure of your market and landlord/tenant laws in PA, but probably sell when the tenant it out.  The market is still strong with homeownership in my area and we aren't that far apart.

    Yeah, hindsight is 20/20.  Who knew the public markets would soar with double digit+ returns for the last 20-25 years!  Just more options to look at, especially if you investigate other investing strategies.

    Anyway, hope this bit helps.  Happy to chat.  Good luck.

    I suppose this is a “cut my losses” type situation. It’s just frustrating that the place hasn’t appreciated in 19 years, and there isn’t even anything wrong with it or the area, and I’ve never even been able to break even. It goes against everything you hear about real estate investing. No cash flow OR appreciation. 
  • Morris County, NJ · Member since 2020 · 5k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    2y

    @Lori Edelman

    Yeah, sorry about your situation.  Mine is omething similar.  Since mine were purchased ~20years ago, they didn't come back up to value until just over a year ago.

    You don't hear about it, but lots of RE investors lose money.  Just about nobody wants to post about it.  I've lost money, but luckily i have made otu more than I've lost.  We just hit bad timing because of the 07-08 crash.  Lots of people are running around saying how great RE is, but many have onlyi been doing it for the past 5-7 years when values and rents have skyrocketed.  Also, catching the tail of the rise after the 07-08 correction.

  • Theresa HarrisPro Member
    Member since 2019 · 15k+ posts · 11k+ votes
    2y

    Talk to the tenants and see if they are interested in buying it.  If not, give them notice and put it up for sale.  Your place sounds like the first place I bought which was to live in and then rent though my rent did cover the expenses.  Sell it and use the money to buy another rental.

    I bought my place around 1996 for about $90K, when I went to move out, prices had dropped a bit, so I rented it.  I had long term tenants in after a few shorter term ones, gave them notice and sold it not quite 10 years ago.  In my case, prices had gone up (finally) and the condo was now paid for.  I used the money as a down payment for a new rental and also to buy a second one.  I sold the original place just before a massive special assessment that took a few years to get the work done.  I put in about $6K for new flooring and trim, I painted it and it sold within a few weeks.  The two places I bought with that money-one hasn't gone up in price (typical of the market in that area), while the other has doubled in price (typical of that market).

  • Member since 2021 · 7 posts · 0 votes
    2y
  • Alan AsriantsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2019 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    2y

    Hey Lori, thanks for sharing your post. 

    There is a lot going on here and a few moving pieces that is making it difficult to make a decision.

    As a Realtor: 

    Your best time to sell is when your property is vacant. Selling with tenants in the unit, unless it is a multi family property is usually not the best move. It makes showing the property more challenging, you have close on a date when the tenants can leave (what if they need more time), and some people just don't want to inherit tenants. 

    Painting the property, updating cabinets, changing some light fixtures will give you the best results for selling the property at the highest value. Again this all depends on your returns and without know the address I cannot give any suggestions

    Listing your property close to spring/summer is the best time. It is also good to list when rates drop a bit, bring more buyers to the market. The interest rates are really affecting the amount of showings and offers sellers get. 

    $1250 seems a bit low for the main line TBH. Condition of course plays a role

    As an investor:

    Seems like you won't have a mortgage soon and you can sit on some nice cash flow. 

    Your capital gains will be very low since you are buying and selling at practically the same price. You can probably even record a loss...

    $135k value for $1300/m in rent is actually a pretty solid return on the main line. I know properties in D class areas not getting those kinds of returns.


    Long story short, there is a lot of options and giving suggestions on a post is tough. I'd be happy to connect and give you a second opinion as a realtor and investor on what is best for you situation. 


    Reach out anytime!

    Alan Asriants - New Century Real Estate 511 Reviews
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  • Basit SiddiqiBusiness Member
    Accountant · New York, NY · Member since 2015 · 8k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    2y

    It seems like you been having pain with this decision for close to 15 years.
    Life is too short to hold on to things that hurt you.

    Sell it.

    You will feel much better once you no longer have to make those HOA / mortgage payment on this property.

  • Flipper/Rehabber · Cincinnati, OH · Member since 2022 · 72 posts · 28 votes
    2y

    If it were me, im selling and accepting my loss and taking away knowledge of what not to buy. Condos. 

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