What are the best and worst Chicago south side sub markets?
Dpo, AE · Member since 2016 · 50 posts · 3 votes
What are the best and worst Chicago south side sub markets?
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Real Estate Agent · Chicago, IL · Member since 2016 · 283 posts · 71 votes
9y@michaelnewman I work very closely in the southside market here in Chicago and I can definitely you that these markets are trending upwards especially with the news of the Obama library as well as the general uptick in Chicago. Woodlawn, Bronzeville, Jackson Park, and I would add Washington Park has areas in chicago most affected and on the uptick. These are great areas for investing in my opinion as long as you have great management (which I would be more than happy to assist you with). In general id say the on the purchase side about 2 years ago you could have gotten in at around 25-30k a unit when purchasing an REO however now those numbers are at 30-40k a unit for REOs
Other great areas in Chatham, South Shore, Auburn Gresham has great multi units available still. Other than that the 'upcoming' south side areas included Roseland and West Pullman which I have spent a good deal of time in too since these markets are just starting to turn around
Hit me with a direct message if you want to chat!
36 Replies
- Real Estate Agent · Chicago, IL · Member since 2016 · 283 posts · 71 votes9y
@michaelnewman I work very closely in the southside market here in Chicago and I can definitely you that these markets are trending upwards especially with the news of the Obama library as well as the general uptick in Chicago. Woodlawn, Bronzeville, Jackson Park, and I would add Washington Park has areas in chicago most affected and on the uptick. These are great areas for investing in my opinion as long as you have great management (which I would be more than happy to assist you with). In general id say the on the purchase side about 2 years ago you could have gotten in at around 25-30k a unit when purchasing an REO however now those numbers are at 30-40k a unit for REOs
Other great areas in Chatham, South Shore, Auburn Gresham has great multi units available still. Other than that the 'upcoming' south side areas included Roseland and West Pullman which I have spent a good deal of time in too since these markets are just starting to turn around
Hit me with a direct message if you want to chat!
- 9yMark AinleyBusiness MemberProperty Manager · Roselle, IL (Chicago Suburb) · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
@Michael Newman The best areas are small pockets, sometimes just a block or two, within these larger neighborhoods. My advice is to find someone local that you can bounce a specific address off of as you go so they can share with you their knowledge of that particular block. Or use BP as a sound board.
GC Realty & Development LLC4.61085 Reviews - Flipper/Rehabber · Louisville, KY · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes9y
What Mark said is right. In general, people might say Bronzeville for example is an up and coming place or Hyde Park is great. On the other hand there are terrible parts of Hyde Park and Bronzeville is a crap shoot. It does go block by block and one of the ways out of town investors getting fooled is by sellers calling something Hyde Park when it is really not or on the fringe of.
The neighborhoods do not always have definitive lines and things can be very different block to block especially when in neighborhoods with gangs.(almost all of them) The gang territory borders matter much more than the borders of the neighborhood.
My suggestion to out of towners is you need to come and walk the neighborhoods. Nothing prepares for the reality of some of these areas than actually walking in them. You will get a feeling in your gut....I assure you. Then you can make a decision about whether you really want to own a property there. If you ignore this, ignorance can be bliss for a while because the numbers can look spectacular but it will come back to bite you.
- Real Estate Broker · Chicago, IL · Member since 2010 · 33 posts · 33 votes9y
These are all great neighborhoods and they are definitely trending up. Many investors have been focusing on these areas since the announcement of the Presidential Library. Investor competition has increased while the inventory has decreased. Inventory is tight. The best properties are going pretty fast. Are you looking for large apartment buildings? If so, you would probably find more inventory in the South Shore neighborhood. Jackson Park Highlands is a tiny part of the South Shore neighborhood.
Jackson Park Highlands is not really known for its apartment buildings. It is more known for its large suburban-like single family homes. Bronzeville has been hot for a few years now. The prices, and low market times, reflect that. Marianos recently opened a large grocery store in the area near 39th and King Drive. There has been other commercial activity near 47th and Cottage Grove which includes a Wal-Mart grocery store.
- Dpo, AE · Member since 2016 · 50 posts · 3 votes9y
All,
Great advice and comments. I definitely plan to visit and see neighborhoods in person, as I look at properties. At this point I'm exploring buildings of not more than 25 units so nothing huge. It will be my first apt investment with my partner.
I've talked to Equity Build about their turnkey process involving purchase, renovation, and management. But still in my research phase. I expect that even if I move forward with them I'll want some independent advice/team that I can work with. my knowledge of the area is rudimentary at best--lived there about 20 yrs ago while working at a bank. Thanks again guys.
- Dpo, AE · Member since 2016 · 50 posts · 3 votes9y
Adding to the above, has anyone worked with EquityBuild in this manner previously? Are there any other turnkey firms that do apt buildings?
Thanks.
- Contractor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2016 · 35 posts · 20 votes9y
Hi Michael, I can speak on the Roseland and Pullman areas (60628). As a matter of fact after doing research and discovering the area is trending upwards with ongoing developments, I bought a home in the Rosemoor community (stable middle class community) and I'm hoping to buy more. Public transportation expansions are happening, street repairs, Whole Foods Distribution, and about $2m worth of business proposals including a hotel for tourism is in the works because of the Historic Pullman District and President Obama naming it a National Park District. Artists lofts have recently been built in Pullman. Of course there is a Walmart and a growing shopping center around it. There are still dollar stores here and there, but waiting for Starbucks to make abode once other projects are done. According to what I've researched it appears that some parts of 60628 are in about the late 3rd to early 4th stage of rejuvenation and the Chicago Neighborhood Initiative is behind the progress. Real Estate Prices are extremely good right now. A word of advice would be to work with someone very familiar with the areas. It's very neighborhoodsy, and still undergoing change. It's typical to find a beautiful quiet neighborhood, and a couple of blocks down run into a crime infested patch.
- Dpo, AE · Member since 2016 · 50 posts · 3 votes9y
Anyone have any thoughts on the area by the 6400-6700 block of S. Harvard Ave.?
- Rental Property Investor · Manteno, IL · Member since 2009 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes9y
Here's a thought. Be careful of buying anything in Chicago and/or Cook County.
1) Landlord laws in cook county are some of the worst I've seen anybody on BP report. Evictions take anywhere from 5 mos to a year.
2) Property taxes are the highest in the country (they say NJ is higher but I'm not buying that one bit for the areas in northern illinois - i.e. north of rte 80. I'm paying 3 to 4% of the market value for taxes- and more in a couple of towns).
3) The city and the state are in incredibly dire straits financially. This state hasn't had a budget in a couple of years now. There's only way they're going to fix that - higher taxes. The pensions are killing us but the state is legally obligated to provide those benefits as there is a state law that restricts them from being lowered in anyway. Democrat fat cats did a real number on us to ensure the union vote.4) Crime. Not sure if you've noticed but the crime rate, specifically murder and shootings, in Chicago is the absolute worst in the country with no signs of slowing.
5) Population drain. There was a recent article that said Illinois had the highest outflow of residents as a percentage of population of any state in the US. And given the state's financial condition and the crime, thats not a surprise to say the least.
So before you buy anything in chicago, I would strongly recommend you assess your risks with whats going on in the area and the city/county/state. Because I think an investor would have to be absolutely crazy to invest in the city given all the uncertainty of our economy and the outflow of residents due to the economy/crime.
- Real Estate Lender and Broker · Dallas, TX · Member since 2013 · 966 posts · 500 votes9y
Originally posted by @Michael Newman:
Hello all,
Hoping to get some first-hand knowledge and/or opinions on the best southside Chicago sub markets for apartment building investments. I've heard that Woodlawn, Bronzeville, and Jackson Park highlands are submarkets that are trending upwards or are expected to be in the near future. I believe these are close to the University of Chicago and the proposed presidential library. Can anyone confirm this? Or does anyone feel bad these areas are not good investments? Other areas that people think are good? Thanks in advance. Trying to learn about the investment climate there.
Michael,
What type of property are you looking for? Do you want a turn key asset in an established neighborhood? Are you looking to be an urban pioneer? The south side has some great neighborhoods and some really bad ones. Englewood maybe the worst. If I was going to check out a neighborhood, I would check it out in the late afternoon to get a real feel for what is going on.
Mark
- Contractor · Romeoville, IL · Member since 2015 · 198 posts · 137 votes9y
I would be very careful on the south side of town. Like some have mentioned it is a block by block deal. And heed the advice of @Eric M., the gang borders matter more than the neighborhood borders. The cost of doing business is higher on the south side for us for several reasons, many of which involve security issues. I am on these streets multiple times per week and I personally feel it's getting worse not better.
- Real Estate Broker · Florida & Chicago · Member since 2010 · 46 posts · 20 votes9y
@Michael Newman It's your money, but here is my two cents worth of experience... @Mike H. is right on all of his points! stay out of IL. unless you live here. My opinion, stay local. The DC market (dc loop) is hot and growing for housing and demand for rentals. Know your market.
Secondly, you have to go where the jobs are coming, population is growing and taxes are under control...if you want to go out of state with your money, I would go with FL, TX or AZ all great on taxes, jobs and population growth = demand for housing. Good Luck.
- Flipper/Rehabber · Crown Point, IN · Member since 2009 · 482 posts · 216 votes9y
Michael,
If you're considering Illinois, I would strongly recommend you look into Northwest Indiana, over investing in Chicago. Northwest Indiana is only 20-40 minutes to downtown Chicago. The taxes are far less and I mean far less, than Illinois. Indiana is a Landlord friendly state. Evicting someone in Illinois will give you ulcers, not to mention drain your pocket! Let me give you an example: I looked at a house today in Portage, Indiana. Good schools, low crime and the house was a 3 bed 1.5 bath, with a basement and on .7 acres of land. We could purchase it AND rehab it for less than $75k. The ARV is approximately $105k. ( I haven't had a chance to run sold comps as of yet.) I can rent it for $1250 a month. Oh, the taxes........They're a whopping $419. That's a year! You can also evict someone very quickly. If you know how to file, your "non paying" tenants can be thrown out in 30 days or less. PM me if you'd like more information on the area. I wish you the best of luck, wherever you purchase.
- Real Estate Broker · Chicago, IL · Member since 2014 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes9y
Originally posted by @Michael Newman:
Hello all,
I believe these are close to the University of Chicago and the proposed presidential library. Can anyone confirm this? Or does anyone feel bad these areas are not good investments? Other areas that people think are good?
I'm not sure if Woodlawn & Bronzeville are "trending up" but there are pockets of development which are good bets. Regarding Woodlawn the closer to the University the better. Regarding Jackson Park- One can assume that it will trend upward w/ the Presidential Library but.....
Another area would be Kenwood.
- Dpo, AE · Member since 2016 · 50 posts · 3 votes9y
thanks for all the thoughts, factoring them into my research.
Trying to narrow down locals into anchors/hubs in this regard, like the Presidential library, Mariano's, and UofC. Any others people know of?
- Investor · Alpharetta, GA · Member since 2016 · 19 posts · 3 votes9y
- I have been reviewing the emails I get from EquityFinance re: their crowdfunding efforts (via being an investor in Notes) to purchase Chicago area multi-family. It also appears that EquityFinance Note holders/investors are buying Apartment buildings from EquityBuild (maybe where EquityBuild already purchased the complex at deep discount). Is their system one of Buy at Deep Discount, then Sell "as is" to Note Investors, then Rehab/Stabilize, then Refinance-via-commercial lender-payback note investors? The 16% ROI for note investing is very attractive....so is it likely that the front-end profit to EquityBuild is so good that they can promote a 16% ROI to note investors for 18 months? I don't have the experience in Multi-family investing to fully understand the financials, but I have a high level of interest. Any help would be much appreciated.
- Investor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2016 · 515 posts · 247 votes9y
Originally posted by @Mike H.:
Here's a thought. Be careful of buying anything in Chicago and/or Cook County.
1) Landlord laws in cook county are some of the worst I've seen anybody on BP report. Evictions take anywhere from 5 mos to a year.
2) Property taxes are the highest in the country (they say NJ is higher but I'm not buying that one bit for the areas in northern illinois - i.e. north of rte 80. I'm paying 3 to 4% of the market value for taxes- and more in a couple of towns).
3) The city and the state are in incredibly dire straits financially. This state hasn't had a budget in a couple of years now. There's only way they're going to fix that - higher taxes. The pensions are killing us but the state is legally obligated to provide those benefits as there is a state law that restricts them from being lowered in anyway. Democrat fat cats did a real number on us to ensure the union vote.4) Crime. Not sure if you've noticed but the crime rate, specifically murder and shootings, in Chicago is the absolute worst in the country with no signs of slowing.
5) Population drain. There was a recent article that said Illinois had the highest outflow of residents as a percentage of population of any state in the US. And given the state's financial condition and the crime, thats not a surprise to say the least.
So before you buy anything in chicago, I would strongly recommend you assess your risks with whats going on in the area and the city/county/state. Because I think an investor would have to be absolutely crazy to invest in the city given all the uncertainty of our economy and the outflow of residents due to the economy/crime.
Much of this is false.
Chicago property taxes are abnormally low for being a World Class city. They are not the highest in the nation. Many Chicago suburbs and other large cities, particularly those on the coasts, have higher taxes than Chicago.
http://money.cnn.com/interactive/real-estate/prope...
According to money.cnn, Cook County's taxes(1.51%) are actually lower than Kankakee's(1.96%).
Chicago's murder rate is not remotely close to being the worst in the country. Chicago surely does have issues with crime, but those are mostly concentrated in a four particular neighborhoods where rival gangs are feuding with each other. The vast majority of the city is very safe. Chicago's murder rate is not in the top 30 nationally.https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/top-lists/highes...
Chicago's population is fairly stagnant, but it is changing. In general, the city is gentrifying. People are moving out of lower class neighborhoods and yuppies are flooding into the city. So while the population isn't really changing, the amount of wealth is.
http://www.chicagobusiness.com/article/20161213/BL...
The city and state governments have been financially irresponsible, but the economy of the city of Chicago is growing. Companies(McDonald's, Motorolla, Kraft, Hillshire, Conagra, etc.) are moving here. The tech scene is booming. People are investing billions of dollars into the city. 44 high-rise buildings are currently under construction, for example. - Lender · Chicago, IL · Member since 2015 · 191 posts · 86 votes9y
Originally posted by @Jeff Burdick:
Originally posted by @Mike H.:
Here's a thought. Be careful of buying anything in Chicago and/or Cook County.
1) Landlord laws in cook county are some of the worst I've seen anybody on BP report. Evictions take anywhere from 5 mos to a year.
2) Property taxes are the highest in the country (they say NJ is higher but I'm not buying that one bit for the areas in northern illinois - i.e. north of rte 80. I'm paying 3 to 4% of the market value for taxes- and more in a couple of towns).
3) The city and the state are in incredibly dire straits financially. This state hasn't had a budget in a couple of years now. There's only way they're going to fix that - higher taxes. The pensions are killing us but the state is legally obligated to provide those benefits as there is a state law that restricts them from being lowered in anyway. Democrat fat cats did a real number on us to ensure the union vote.4) Crime. Not sure if you've noticed but the crime rate, specifically murder and shootings, in Chicago is the absolute worst in the country with no signs of slowing.
5) Population drain. There was a recent article that said Illinois had the highest outflow of residents as a percentage of population of any state in the US. And given the state's financial condition and the crime, thats not a surprise to say the least.
So before you buy anything in chicago, I would strongly recommend you assess your risks with whats going on in the area and the city/county/state. Because I think an investor would have to be absolutely crazy to invest in the city given all the uncertainty of our economy and the outflow of residents due to the economy/crime.
Much of this is false.
Chicago property taxes are abnormally low for being a World Class city. They are not the highest in the nation. Many Chicago suburbs and other large cities, particularly those on the coasts, have higher taxes than Chicago.
http://money.cnn.com/interactive/real-estate/prope...
According to money.cnn, Cook County's taxes(1.51%) are actually lower than Kankakee's(1.96%).
Chicago's murder rate is not remotely close to being the worst in the country. Chicago surely does have issues with crime, but those are mostly concentrated in a four particular neighborhoods where rival gangs are feuding with each other. The vast majority of the city is very safe. Chicago's murder rate is not in the top 30 nationally.https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/top-lists/highes...
Chicago's population is fairly stagnant, but it is changing. In general, the city is gentrifying. People are moving out of lower class neighborhoods and yuppies are flooding into the city. So while the population isn't really changing, the amount of wealth is.
http://www.chicagobusiness.com/article/20161213/BL...
The city and state governments have been financially irresponsible, but the economy of the city of Chicago is growing. Companies(McDonald's, Motorolla, Kraft, Hillshire, Conagra, etc.) are moving here. The tech scene is booming. People are investing billions of dollars into the city. 44 high-rise buildings are currently under construction, for example.I agree with these comments, I own a rental property in the north side and my prop taxes are less than 1.5% of value. Cook County taxes are not the cheapest in the country, but the county does get a disproportionate amount of its taxes from businesses and commercial property so the residents do not have to carry as much. As a comparison, the collar counties like Lake, Will, Dupage, etc pay almost twice as much.
Crime is also more headlines than reality. Not to downplay the crime, because the murder rate is very bad, but it is concentrated in certain areas. More reason to focus on your neighborhood and block.
Population is also flat but shifting to certain neighborhoods. For example, the west side near the United Center used to be a terrible place to be after dark. Now there are restaurants, condos, etc. Much like NYC, the more people out on the street, the safer the neighborhood.
I do have concerns about the government finances. Property taxes are most at risk for increases to fill the pension fund gaps. The state income tax (3%) is still fairly competitive but also at risk for increases.
If you've ever read the work of Richard Florida, you would be bullish on the city. His theory is that centers of culture tend to have the best growth prospects. Corporations are recognizing that they need to come back into the city to continue to recruit young talent, and Chicago is seeing a lot of the influx of these HQ's.
- Rental Property Investor · Manteno, IL · Member since 2009 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes9y
I am not familiar with chicago property tax rates. But I can tell you that cook county tax rates are some of the worst in the state and country. I can also tell you that Illinois has the 2nd highest tax rate of any state in the country (next to new jersey).
I have several properties in Cook County. There isn't anything close to 1.51% of a tax rate.
Again, maybe the northside of chicago/cook county is different. But he was asking about southside suburbs.
And here are the numbers I'm seeing:
5120 Roberta ln, richton park - Assessed value= 116,080, Property Taxes=$6,077.49: TAX RATE = 5.2%
29538 Lake shore, lynwood - Assessed value=129810, Property taxes =$5480.05 TAX RATE =4.2%
22413 plum creek, sauk village - *** value - 151,030, Taxes=6032.32 RATE=3.9%If you think cook county property taxes are 1.5%, I'd love to see you find me a single town whose
tax rate is 1.5%. Maybe in the 600k and above price range I guess. But not in the "investor" areas of 100k to 200k price range. And if you think kankakee county is 1.9%, you're also completely misinformed. I have no idea where those reports are getting their numbers but I can tell you that nobody down here is paying 1.9%.I have homes in bourbonnais, bradley, manteno and one in aroma park. And 3% is about the best you're going to see. Kankakee itself is closer to 5%!
So before you pull canned reports and pass them off as fact, you need to actually check some real numbers against them. The one fact that I would support is that Illinois is reported to have the 2nd highest property tax rate in the entire country (next to new jersey). Thats one that I would be likely to believe.
In terms of murder rate, again, I don't know what you're reading but Chicago's escalating murder rate is driving people out of the city in full force. The Tribune has a murder/shooting tally on the front page every day now. If the south and west side of chicago doesn't have the worst murder/shooting rate of anyone in the county right now, I'd be shocked. Maybe you're pulling reports again that are 3 years old. Here's something from april of 2016. And its gotten much, much worse over the last 10 mos. Either your head is in the sand or you've got some ulterior motive by saying its not violent here.CHICAGO — Murders in the nation's third-largest city are up about 72%, while shootings have surged more than 88% in the first three months of 2016 compared with the same period last year, according to data released Friday by the ChicagoPolice Department.Apr 1, 2016
And in terms of population loss, holy cow, you are simply lost. But you must not be reading the tribune regularly where they actually give you real up to date FACTS. There is a huge population drain occurring in chicago.
Chicago area sees greatest population loss of any major U.S. city, region in 2015
Did you read this article? That was in 2015. I guarantee you 2016 was far worse. The shootings/killings are completely out of control. I have people calling me from the city asking about my rentals down here. They literally just went out.
And the real hit of the city's pension shortfall is going to mean even more tax increases.Keep in mind, the city just recently passed one of the biggest property tax increases in its history. So I guarantee you that isn't showing up in any one of your reports.
Pulling data thats 2 and 3 years old doesn't tell the story. If you don't see there being huge problems in the city and cook county along with the state itself, you're simply not well informed. If I was an investor looking to invest out of state, the one area I would tell people not to invest in is Illinois. Cook County in particular for buy and hold. Not only do you have all the pending tax issues from the city, county and state (the state is billions in arrears on payments and in a bind on their pensions too in case you weren't aware). But you have the crazy crime and outflow of population. And then you have some of the worst landlord laws in the country (evictions in cook county can take 4 to 6 mos minimum).
Why in the world would you ever tell someone that things are great here? If you live here, then you make the best of it. But for someone considering out of state investing in an area, to suggest the state/county/city are a good idea is pure insanity.
- Investor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2016 · 515 posts · 247 votes9y
Originally posted by @Mike H.:
I am not familiar with chicago property tax rates. But I can tell you that cook county tax rates are some of the worst in the state and country. I can also tell you that Illinois has the 2nd highest tax rate of any state in the country (next to new jersey).
I have several properties in Cook County. There isn't anything close to 1.51% of a tax rate.
Again, maybe the northside of chicago/cook county is different. But he was asking about southside suburbs.
And here are the numbers I'm seeing:
5120 Roberta ln, richton park - Assessed value= 116,080, Property Taxes=$6,077.49: TAX RATE = 5.2%
29538 Lake shore, lynwood - Assessed value=129810, Property taxes =$5480.05 TAX RATE =4.2%
22413 plum creek, sauk village - *** value - 151,030, Taxes=6032.32 RATE=3.9%If you think cook county property taxes are 1.5%, I'd love to see you find me a single town whose
tax rate is 1.5%. Maybe in the 600k and above price range I guess. But not in the "investor" areas of 100k to 200k price range. And if you think kankakee county is 1.9%, you're also completely misinformed. I have no idea where those reports are getting their numbers but I can tell you that nobody down here is paying 1.9%.I have homes in bourbonnais, bradley, manteno and one in aroma park. And 3% is about the best you're going to see. Kankakee itself is closer to 5%!
So before you pull canned reports and pass them off as fact, you need to actually check some real numbers against them. The one fact that I would support is that Illinois is reported to have the 2nd highest property tax rate in the entire country (next to new jersey). Thats one that I would be likely to believe.
In terms of murder rate, again, I don't know what you're reading but Chicago's escalating murder rate is driving people out of the city in full force. The Tribune has a murder/shooting tally on the front page every day now. If the south and west side of chicago doesn't have the worst murder/shooting rate of anyone in the county right now, I'd be shocked. Maybe you're pulling reports again that are 3 years old. Here's something from april of 2016. And its gotten much, much worse over the last 10 mos. Either your head is in the sand or you've got some ulterior motive by saying its not violent here.CHICAGO — Murders in the nation's third-largest city are up about 72%, while shootings have surged more than 88% in the first three months of 2016 compared with the same period last year, according to data released Friday by the ChicagoPolice Department.Apr 1, 2016
And in terms of population loss, holy cow, you are simply lost. But you must not be reading the tribune regularly where they actually give you real up to date FACTS. There is a huge population drain occurring in chicago.
Chicago area sees greatest population loss of any major U.S. city, region in 2015
Did you read this article? That was in 2015. I guarantee you 2016 was far worse. The shootings/killings are completely out of control. I have people calling me from the city asking about my rentals down here. They literally just went out.
And the real hit of the city's pension shortfall is going to mean even more tax increases.Keep in mind, the city just recently passed one of the biggest property tax increases in its history. So I guarantee you that isn't showing up in any one of your reports.
Pulling data thats 2 and 3 years old doesn't tell the story. If you don't see there being huge problems in the city and cook county along with the state itself, you're simply not well informed. If I was an investor looking to invest out of state, the one area I would tell people not to invest in is Illinois. Cook County in particular for buy and hold. Not only do you have all the pending tax issues from the city, county and state (the state is billions in arrears on payments and in a bind on their pensions too in case you weren't aware). But you have the crazy crime and outflow of population. And then you have some of the worst landlord laws in the country (evictions in cook county can take 4 to 6 mos minimum).
Why in the world would you ever tell someone that things are great here? If you live here, then you make the best of it. But for someone considering out of state investing in an area, to suggest the state/county/city are a good idea is pure insanity.
I don't even know where to begin with this post.
It seems that you're basing conclusions based on rhetoric instead of facts.
I don't know why your taxes in Cook country are so high, but I pay $4800 for a property valued at 420K. That's well less than 1.5%. I know others who are similar. I've looked at dozens(maybe hundreds?) of properties that are all a comparable percentage.
You're letting the news media cloud your judgement and ignoring facts. The "news every day" is not facts. It is propaganda and showing violence is what sells.
Crime in Chicago is actually trending down over the last 15 years.
http://crime.chicagotribune.com/
The city of Chicago gained 14,000 people over the last 5 years. So no, people are not "being driven out of the city in full force."
http://www.chicagobusiness.com/article/20161213/BL...Again, the murder rate is not in the top 30 nationally...whether you want it to be or not.
https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/top-lists/highest-murder-rate-cities2016/
I could careless if out of state investors invest in Chicago but I do care when people pump out erroneous misinformation about my city. However, it appears as if you have a personal hatred against the city of Chicago and it doesn't matter how many facts I present to you, you're not going to let facts cloud your judgement, so I'm not going to waste any more time. - Rental Property Investor · Manteno, IL · Member since 2009 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes9y
And what area do you live in? There's a huge difference in the city of Chicago when you talk about the north side versus the south or west side. But to suggest cook county is great for buy and hold investing is terrible advice - whether you have "pride in your city" or not.
And no matter how you cut it, I would never tell anyone to invest in the area. You have a state that hasn't had a budget in two years now and whose pension shortfall is the worst in the country. A county and city who have more pension shortfalls.
I am actually shocked at how low your taxes are. No wonder the city is in such dire straits - the suburbs are the ones paying all the taxes. Any other collar county is, for the most part, paying a minimum of 3% and many are closer to 4%. Apparently, some of the areas in the city aren't paying their fair share. But I bet you won't be paying 1.5% too much longer. Have you seen what your new tax bill AFTER the most recent tax hike will be in effect? And there are more coming.
Did you see this article in today's Tribune?
Ratings agency says big tax hike is 'most likely' CPS fix
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/politics/...
The tab on Emanuel's series of tax hikes: $1,700 a year for average family
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/politics/...For anybody looking to invest in an area, the last thing you would EVER want to do is pick an area where people are moving out. Crime is out of control. Trump has even mentioned possibly sending in the National Guard to the city of Chicago.
Here is a recent article: Does that look like a trend of an area you want to recommend someone go into?
More than 750 people have been murdered in Chicago in 2016, the police said, a 58 percent increase over last year and the highest total since 1997. There have been more than 3,500 shootings in the city this year. Over Christmas weekend, at least 60 people were shot, 11 fatally, according to The Chicago Tribune.Dec 28, 2016
Its not getting better either - its getting worse.
So again, I'm not sure why in the world anyone would suggest Chicago as a good place to invest. Not unless you're talking about the northern suburbs. Even that, buyer beware. Significant tax increases have just been passed so don't just look at last year's tax rate - look at the taxes that are going to be paid going forward with the new rate. And there are likely several more on the way (both for the city and the state).
This state is in awful shape. The fact that you don't seem to be concerned that our state hasn't had a budget in two years is mind boggling. Or the fact that we are billions short on our pension liabilities. That money has to come from somewhere and its going to be in the form of taxes.
Companies are NOT moving into Illinois. They're moving out. The taxes here are beyond onerous to many of our neighbors like indiana and the like. Too many liberals that were in bed with the unions and promised ridiculous benefits that we simply can't afford. And now the bill has finally come due.
- Investor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2016 · 515 posts · 247 votes9y
Originally posted by @Mike H.:
And what area do you live in? There's a huge difference in the city of Chicago when you talk about the north side versus the south or west side. But to suggest cook county is great for buy and hold investing is terrible advice - whether you have "pride in your city" or not.
And no matter how you cut it, I would never tell anyone to invest in the area. You have a state that hasn't had a budget in two years now and whose pension shortfall is the worst in the country. A county and city who have more pension shortfalls.
I am actually shocked at how low your taxes are. No wonder the city is in such dire straits - the suburbs are the ones paying all the taxes. Any other collar county is, for the most part, paying a minimum of 3% and many are closer to 4%. Apparently, some of the areas in the city aren't paying their fair share. But I bet you won't be paying 1.5% too much longer. Have you seen what your new tax bill AFTER the most recent tax hike will be in effect? And there are more coming.
Did you see this article in today's Tribune?
Ratings agency says big tax hike is 'most likely' CPS fix
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/politics/...
The tab on Emanuel's series of tax hikes: $1,700 a year for average family
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/politics/...For anybody looking to invest in an area, the last thing you would EVER want to do is pick an area where people are moving out. Crime is out of control. Trump has even mentioned possibly sending in the National Guard to the city of Chicago.
Here is a recent article: Does that look like a trend of an area you want to recommend someone go into?
More than 750 people have been murdered in Chicago in 2016, the police said, a 58 percent increase over last year and the highest total since 1997. There have been more than 3,500 shootings in the city this year. Over Christmas weekend, at least 60 people were shot, 11 fatally, according to The Chicago Tribune.Dec 28, 2016
Its not getting better either - its getting worse.
So again, I'm not sure why in the world anyone would suggest Chicago as a good place to invest. Not unless you're talking about the northern suburbs. Even that, buyer beware. Significant tax increases have just been passed so don't just look at last year's tax rate - look at the taxes that are going to be paid going forward with the new rate. And there are likely several more on the way (both for the city and the state).
This state is in awful shape. The fact that you don't seem to be concerned that our state hasn't had a budget in two years is mind boggling. Or the fact that we are billions short on our pension liabilities. That money has to come from somewhere and its going to be in the form of taxes.
Companies are NOT moving into Illinois. They're moving out. The taxes here are beyond onerous to many of our neighbors like indiana and the like. Too many liberals that were in bed with the unions and promised ridiculous benefits that we simply can't afford. And now the bill has finally come due.
You're choosing to ignore facts and seem to have a political agenda. So I'm not going to waste my time arguing with you anymore. Property taxes are local, so it has nothing to do about the city not paying its fair share. And in terms of state revenue, the city of Chicago has 20% of the population, pays 20% of sales tax, yet receives 15% of state education revenue. Being short changed $500 million. So, in reality, it is downstate that is not paying its fair share.
Chicago is a great place to invest because of the facts. Growing population. Growing economy. Inflow of highly educated people. Gentrification occurring in a bunch of neighborhoods. Rising property values. Rising rents. Companies moving in. Companies growing in size. Booming tech industry.
But you clearly have your mind made up. Facts won't change your mind. Best of luck to you. - Real Estate Agent · Chicago, IL · Member since 2013 · 386 posts · 218 votes9y
Hi!
I invest in the near south side. My neighborhoods of choice are Bridgeport and McKinnley Park. Great working class areas, close to public transport and good communities.
When you go South of 40th, it really is block by block. There are really some wonderful streets, but you really need to know where to look.
- Dpo, AE · Member since 2016 · 50 posts · 3 votes9y
Originally posted by @Jeff Burdick:
Originally posted by @Mike H.:
Crime in Chicago is actually trending down over the last 15 years.
http://crime.chicagotribune.com/
Jeff,
Thanks for those fantastic links to real data. A great help for me to narrow down specific neighborhoods that have had historical increasing income as well as some population growth in the long term. Also Key to identify neighborhoods that had historical negative trends.Michael
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