Remodeling My First Unit On First Investment Property!

[Brett Riemensnider]

 Looking for some insight on a few things before starting construction on my first rental property! Area is not a high end area by any means, all units don’t have laundry as well as no centralized air. Trying to add value but need to be mindful of spending and not overdo it. Basically everything I’m looking for is what’s the biggest bang for my buck.

1. 1. Does anyone have a recommendation for a good window ac unit? I see some that get mounted to a wall, some in the window. 3 bedrooms and only 750sqft.
2. Swing doors, front doors and trim. Is a store like Home Depot the spot to get these items? Should I be shopping around more on these?
3. 
   2. LVP. Trying to avoid having too many transitions in carpet to hardwood/vinyl flooring and plan on doing LVP throughout the entire unit, bedrooms and bathroom included. Any suggestions on a good quality LVP that will last while also being a good price? I heard to get the ones with the backing to make for easier DIY install but have heard you don’t want to go too cheap also. 
4. 
   3. Shower. Window in the shower has is cased with a stool and apron. Obviously wood does not belong in a shower. What’s the best way to remodel this that will be the most cost effective? I thought a block window with a shower insert going right up to it but maybe that’s more expensive and more work than I should be doing.

I appreciate all the feedback I’ve been getting. This property I’ve planned on holding for only about 5-7 years due to it being 130+ years old. If anyone has any other rehab like advice I’d love to hear it! Pretty anxious about this job I’m taking on so anything to calm the nerves is appreciated! Thanks!

[Kevin Sobilo]

@Brett Riemensnider, here are a few things to think about.

1. Look at rentals in your market and see what is EXPECTED from the kind of rental you are trying to create. It could be that the typical rental is circa 1990. So, you may not need to do all the improvements you wish. This isn't about what YOU like, its about what gets you more rent as most rentals are for cash-flow.

2. Identify some sizzle features that are NOT expected in typical rentals in your market and look to add a couple (NOT ALL) and only the ones that are easiest to add (low hanging fruit). That might be adding a washer/dryer, dishwaher, microwave hood, or even just allowing pets. Like I said you want to find the EASIEST and CHEAPEST way to be a little better than the typical.

3. Home Depot & Lowes are fine for commodity items. Get their store credit card and try to make LARGER orders through their pro-desk or pro-website. If you make sufficiently large orders they will give you discounted pricing like a contractor saving you 10-20%.

4. I would not worry about transitions between flooring types in a rental unless it was really high end maybe.

LVP is good stuff, but there can be challenges in old houses. LVP may not want to stay locked together if the floor isn't close to perfectly flat. Often old houses have some rooms which are not flat even if they appear to be so to the eye.

Also, when you are spending money, you want to make the biggest difference for the cost.

For a typical rental of mine, I will use LVP in the living room and maybe dining room (public areas of the house). For hard working rooms, I typical use peel & stick vinyl because it doesn't need a professional installer (myself or a handyman can do a good job). For private areas of the house like bedrooms, I refinish the original wood floors. I own a sander so its not expensive to do. Also, even an old beat up floor looks decent and bedrooms usually have a lot of furniture so you can only see a small part of the floor anyways and tenants may even put down a throw rug.

I feel like this approach gives me the best bang for my buck since its cheaper than all new LVP and will be easier to maintain the hard working rooms. You can easily replace a damaged tile with peel & stick unlike regular tile or LVP.

5. I typically just remove windows and block up the opening in bathrooms. They really aren't necessary and like you said create their own issues when they are in a shower.

6. I would not worry about a homes age. If its well built and maintained, it can last indefinitely.

7. Keep in mind the decision making criteria is different for your primary residence versus an investment. Keep that in mind too when listening to advice from others. People have a tendency to want to do what they know and what they like which is fine for your primary residence, but not always the best choice for an investment.

Think of the EXTREME example where someone buys a ratty house in a TERRIBLE neighborhood and then GROSSLY over improves it because that is what they know and like themselves. They won't get rent to support that investment in that neighborhood and won't have created the equity they need to even break even because properties in that area aren't worth as much because its a TERRIBLE neighborhood. So, keep in mind your market and what your target property result looks like in that market. 

[Brett Riemensnider]

Quote from @Kevin Sobilo:

@Brett Riemensnider, here are a few things to think about.

1. Look at rentals in your market and see what is EXPECTED from the kind of rental you are trying to create. It could be that the typical rental is circa 1990. So, you may not need to do all the improvements you wish. This isn't about what YOU like, its about what gets you more rent as most rentals are for cash-flow.

2. Identify some sizzle features that are NOT expected in typical rentals in your market and look to add a couple (NOT ALL) and only the ones that are easiest to add (low hanging fruit). That might be adding a washer/dryer, dishwaher, microwave hood, or even just allowing pets. Like I said you want to find the EASIEST and CHEAPEST way to be a little better than the typical.

3. Home Depot & Lowes are fine for commodity items. Get their store credit card and try to make LARGER orders through their pro-desk or pro-website. If you make sufficiently large orders they will give you discounted pricing like a contractor saving you 10-20%.

4. I would not worry about transitions between flooring types in a rental unless it was really high end maybe.

LVP is good stuff, but there can be challenges in old houses. LVP may not want to stay locked together if the floor isn't close to perfectly flat. Often old houses have some rooms which are not flat even if they appear to be so to the eye.

Also, when you are spending money, you want to make the biggest difference for the cost.

For a typical rental of mine, I will use LVP in the living room and maybe dining room (public areas of the house). For hard working rooms, I typical use peel & stick vinyl because it doesn't need a professional installer (myself or a handyman can do a good job). For private areas of the house like bedrooms, I refinish the original wood floors. I own a sander so its not expensive to do. Also, even an old beat up floor looks decent and bedrooms usually have a lot of furniture so you can only see a small part of the floor anyways and tenants may even put down a throw rug.

I feel like this approach gives me the best bang for my buck since its cheaper than all new LVP and will be easier to maintain the hard working rooms. You can easily replace a damaged tile with peel & stick unlike regular tile or LVP.

5. I typically just remove windows and block up the opening in bathrooms. They really aren't necessary and like you said create their own issues when they are in a shower.

6. I would not worry about a homes age. If its well built and maintained, it can last indefinitely.

7. Keep in mind the decision making criteria is different for your primary residence versus an investment. Keep that in mind too when listening to advice from others. People have a tendency to want to do what they know and what they like which is fine for your primary residence, but not always the best choice for an investment.

Think of the EXTREME example where someone buys a ratty house in a TERRIBLE neighborhood and then GROSSLY over improves it because that is what they know and like themselves. They won't get rent to support that investment in that neighborhood and won't have created the equity they need to even break even because properties in that area aren't worth as much because its a TERRIBLE neighborhood. So, keep in mind your market and what your target property result looks like in that market. 

Fantastic advice Kevin! Thank you! 

[Jacob Sherman]

Pricing the different variations with available contractors is usually best . Some get materials cheaper than others and some have more of an eye for design than others 

[Matt Vohnoutka]

Hey @Brett Riemensnider, sounds like you've got a fun project on your hands!  I fully renovated the upstairs unit (~850sf) of an up-down duplex in Northeast Minneapolis last year, and that project covered a lot of the same items which you mentioned doing for your reno plans.

Window AC. Much like your property, my unit didn't have any central air or heating. For the AC, I went with the GE Profile ClearView window AC unit, specifically the 8,300 BTU model which runs off of a standard 110v outlet, and is available on Amazon with Prime shipping. We only have this one window AC unit in the bedroom of my STR unit, but coupled with a ceiling fan in the living room one room over, it does a really good job at keeping the apartment cool on even the warmest of days. This AC unit was super easy to set up and install, and is also wifi-enabled so you can see exactly how much power you/your tenants are using via the GE app, as well as giving you alerts when the filters need to be cleaned (pull-out reusable filters are very convenient and easy to maintain). I also really like that this is a U-shaped window unit which wraps over the window sill, meaning that you get to keep nearly all of your window's view and natural light, as well as it being theoretically harder for someone to break into the apartment by kicking in/pulling out the AC unit (ours is on the second floor, but the safety concerns for first floor units is definitely a consideration you'll want to factor in).

Heating.  In case it comes up during your project, I also removed all of the old baseboard heaters during my reno and installed new Cadet in-wall electric heaters in their place in every room.  The heaters themselves (available at the big box stores) are great and keep the unit as toasty as you could ever want it to be during the winter, and they're much less bulky compared to traditional baseboard heaters.  If you do install any Cadet heaters though, for the love of god please pair them with the manual knob-style thermostats - the Cadet electronic programmable thermostats are maybe the single worst product I've purchased in my renovating life, and were replaced almost immediately after installing them.

Doors and Trim.  Any of the big box stores - Home Depot, Lowes, or Menards - are great for both items.  For my money, I think Home Depot has a slight advantage in availability of in-stock door sizes/styles (which you can check online to find your exact style/size/swing and see which locations have it in stock), while Menards has a wider range of trim options.

LVP Flooring.  I installed Home Depot's LifeProof LVP flooring into a 120-year old rental house in St. Paul - all DIY installed without much hassle over the course of a few days, and I liked the integrated underlayment that the LifeProof LVP flooring offered.  That property's floors are far from level, and as Kevin mentioned above, the flatter your subflooring is, the better your LVP will hold up.  4 years on, the moderately wavey floors in the 1st floor of my 120-year old rental look as good as the day I installed them; the LVP on the 2nd floor, however, needed to be fully torn out and replaced with carpet because there was too much variance in the subflooring and it was causing the seams on the LVP to crack and come apart.

Shower Window.  If you're going down to the studs in the bathroom already, tearing out the window trim/stool/apron is probably the best bet.  If it's a vinyl window, or if you could swap out the existing window for a vinyl window without much hassle (e.g. if it's on the first floor and you have easy access to the exterior), then waterproofing the inside shower area around the window would be much easier.  If it's an old wood window that can't be replaced or blocked super easily, you could always go down to the studs from the inside, put a piece of treated plywood (painted black) over the window itself, and screw that into place so that it's flush with the studs.  From the outside, it will look like a dark room, and from the inside, you'll have a fresh slate to install your shower surround (just make sure you don't screw through the plywood and shatter the glass behind it though!).

Shower Surround.  In case you're looking for input on shower surrounds, I can't say enough good things about the Mansfield NexTile 60x30x74 Alcove Panel Shower Surround - I ordered mine from Lowes and got it for under $600 with shipping.  Installation was a breeze, the panels are super robust and easy to clean, and having an alcove/niche in the shower makes it feel like a much higher end experience for the user than the product's price tag suggests.

My only other piece of advice would be to go keyless with at least one set of door locks at the property.  During the reno process, you can send any contractors or other helpers a keypad code to access the property without you needing to physically be there.  After the renovation is complete and you're renting the unit, not having to worry about tracking physical keys is a super convenient perk for residents/guests, and also has the added benefit of minimizing the amount of lockouts and other headaches you'll potentially have to deal with later on down the road.  Schlage Encode is my go-to for all of my properties.

Hopefully this all helps take some of the anxiety out of the reno process - take it one manageable step at a time, try to have fun along the way, and you'll be finished up in no time!

[Brett Riemensnider]

Quote from @Matt Vohnoutka:

Hey @Brett Riemensnider, sounds like you've got a fun project on your hands!  I fully renovated the upstairs unit (~850sf) of an up-down duplex in Northeast Minneapolis last year, and that project covered a lot of the same items which you mentioned doing for your reno plans.

Window AC. Much like your property, my unit didn't have any central air or heating. For the AC, I went with the GE Profile ClearView window AC unit, specifically the 8,300 BTU model which runs off of a standard 110v outlet, and is available on Amazon with Prime shipping. We only have this one window AC unit in the bedroom of my STR unit, but coupled with a ceiling fan in the living room one room over, it does a really good job at keeping the apartment cool on even the warmest of days. This AC unit was super easy to set up and install, and is also wifi-enabled so you can see exactly how much power you/your tenants are using via the GE app, as well as giving you alerts when the filters need to be cleaned (pull-out reusable filters are very convenient and easy to maintain). I also really like that this is a U-shaped window unit which wraps over the window sill, meaning that you get to keep nearly all of your window's view and natural light, as well as it being theoretically harder for someone to break into the apartment by kicking in/pulling out the AC unit (ours is on the second floor, but the safety concerns for first floor units is definitely a consideration you'll want to factor in).

Heating.  In case it comes up during your project, I also removed all of the old baseboard heaters during my reno and installed new Cadet in-wall electric heaters in their place in every room.  The heaters themselves (available at the big box stores) are great and keep the unit as toasty as you could ever want it to be during the winter, and they're much less bulky compared to traditional baseboard heaters.  If you do install any Cadet heaters though, for the love of god please pair them with the manual knob-style thermostats - the Cadet electronic programmable thermostats are maybe the single worst product I've purchased in my renovating life, and were replaced almost immediately after installing them.

Doors and Trim.  Any of the big box stores - Home Depot, Lowes, or Menards - are great for both items.  For my money, I think Home Depot has a slight advantage in availability of in-stock door sizes/styles (which you can check online to find your exact style/size/swing and see which locations have it in stock), while Menards has a wider range of trim options.

LVP Flooring.  I installed Home Depot's LifeProof LVP flooring into a 120-year old rental house in St. Paul - all DIY installed without much hassle over the course of a few days, and I liked the integrated underlayment that the LifeProof LVP flooring offered.  That property's floors are far from level, and as Kevin mentioned above, the flatter your subflooring is, the better your LVP will hold up.  4 years on, the moderately wavey floors in the 1st floor of my 120-year old rental look as good as the day I installed them; the LVP on the 2nd floor, however, needed to be fully torn out and replaced with carpet because there was too much variance in the subflooring and it was causing the seams on the LVP to crack and come apart.

Shower Window.  If you're going down to the studs in the bathroom already, tearing out the window trim/stool/apron is probably the best bet.  If it's a vinyl window, or if you could swap out the existing window for a vinyl window without much hassle (e.g. if it's on the first floor and you have easy access to the exterior), then waterproofing the inside shower area around the window would be much easier.  If it's an old wood window that can't be replaced or blocked super easily, you could always go down to the studs from the inside, put a piece of treated plywood (painted black) over the window itself, and screw that into place so that it's flush with the studs.  From the outside, it will look like a dark room, and from the inside, you'll have a fresh slate to install your shower surround (just make sure you don't screw through the plywood and shatter the glass behind it though!).

Shower Surround.  In case you're looking for input on shower surrounds, I can't say enough good things about the Mansfield NexTile 60x30x74 Alcove Panel Shower Surround - I ordered mine from Lowes and got it for under $600 with shipping.  Installation was a breeze, the panels are super robust and easy to clean, and having an alcove/niche in the shower makes it feel like a much higher end experience for the user than the product's price tag suggests.

My only other piece of advice would be to go keyless with at least one set of door locks at the property.  During the reno process, you can send any contractors or other helpers a keypad code to access the property without you needing to physically be there.  After the renovation is complete and you're renting the unit, not having to worry about tracking physical keys is a super convenient perk for residents/guests, and also has the added benefit of minimizing the amount of lockouts and other headaches you'll potentially have to deal with later on down the road.  Schlage Encode is my go-to for all of my properties.

Hopefully this all helps take some of the anxiety out of the reno process - take it one manageable step at a time, try to have fun along the way, and you'll be finished up in no time!

 Matt, sorry it took so long to respond! I read this last week and have already taken so many notes from this. Just forgot to tell tou how thankful I am for the detail! Nice to see another local investor helping out a beginner. Appreciate it so much, thanks again!

[Tim Swierczek]

Quote from @Matt Vohnoutka:

Hey @Brett Riemensnider, sounds like you've got a fun project on your hands!  I fully renovated the upstairs unit (~850sf) of an up-down duplex in Northeast Minneapolis last year, and that project covered a lot of the same items which you mentioned doing for your reno plans.

Window AC. Much like your property, my unit didn't have any central air or heating. For the AC, I went with the GE Profile ClearView window AC unit, specifically the 8,300 BTU model which runs off of a standard 110v outlet, and is available on Amazon with Prime shipping. We only have this one window AC unit in the bedroom of my STR unit, but coupled with a ceiling fan in the living room one room over, it does a really good job at keeping the apartment cool on even the warmest of days. This AC unit was super easy to set up and install, and is also wifi-enabled so you can see exactly how much power you/your tenants are using via the GE app, as well as giving you alerts when the filters need to be cleaned (pull-out reusable filters are very convenient and easy to maintain). I also really like that this is a U-shaped window unit which wraps over the window sill, meaning that you get to keep nearly all of your window's view and natural light, as well as it being theoretically harder for someone to break into the apartment by kicking in/pulling out the AC unit (ours is on the second floor, but the safety concerns for first floor units is definitely a consideration you'll want to factor in).

Heating.  In case it comes up during your project, I also removed all of the old baseboard heaters during my reno and installed new Cadet in-wall electric heaters in their place in every room.  The heaters themselves (available at the big box stores) are great and keep the unit as toasty as you could ever want it to be during the winter, and they're much less bulky compared to traditional baseboard heaters.  If you do install any Cadet heaters though, for the love of god please pair them with the manual knob-style thermostats - the Cadet electronic programmable thermostats are maybe the single worst product I've purchased in my renovating life, and were replaced almost immediately after installing them.

Doors and Trim.  Any of the big box stores - Home Depot, Lowes, or Menards - are great for both items.  For my money, I think Home Depot has a slight advantage in availability of in-stock door sizes/styles (which you can check online to find your exact style/size/swing and see which locations have it in stock), while Menards has a wider range of trim options.

LVP Flooring.  I installed Home Depot's LifeProof LVP flooring into a 120-year old rental house in St. Paul - all DIY installed without much hassle over the course of a few days, and I liked the integrated underlayment that the LifeProof LVP flooring offered.  That property's floors are far from level, and as Kevin mentioned above, the flatter your subflooring is, the better your LVP will hold up.  4 years on, the moderately wavey floors in the 1st floor of my 120-year old rental look as good as the day I installed them; the LVP on the 2nd floor, however, needed to be fully torn out and replaced with carpet because there was too much variance in the subflooring and it was causing the seams on the LVP to crack and come apart.

Shower Window.  If you're going down to the studs in the bathroom already, tearing out the window trim/stool/apron is probably the best bet.  If it's a vinyl window, or if you could swap out the existing window for a vinyl window without much hassle (e.g. if it's on the first floor and you have easy access to the exterior), then waterproofing the inside shower area around the window would be much easier.  If it's an old wood window that can't be replaced or blocked super easily, you could always go down to the studs from the inside, put a piece of treated plywood (painted black) over the window itself, and screw that into place so that it's flush with the studs.  From the outside, it will look like a dark room, and from the inside, you'll have a fresh slate to install your shower surround (just make sure you don't screw through the plywood and shatter the glass behind it though!).

Shower Surround.  In case you're looking for input on shower surrounds, I can't say enough good things about the Mansfield NexTile 60x30x74 Alcove Panel Shower Surround - I ordered mine from Lowes and got it for under $600 with shipping.  Installation was a breeze, the panels are super robust and easy to clean, and having an alcove/niche in the shower makes it feel like a much higher end experience for the user than the product's price tag suggests.

My only other piece of advice would be to go keyless with at least one set of door locks at the property.  During the reno process, you can send any contractors or other helpers a keypad code to access the property without you needing to physically be there.  After the renovation is complete and you're renting the unit, not having to worry about tracking physical keys is a super convenient perk for residents/guests, and also has the added benefit of minimizing the amount of lockouts and other headaches you'll potentially have to deal with later on down the road.  Schlage Encode is my go-to for all of my properties.

Hopefully this all helps take some of the anxiety out of the reno process - take it one manageable step at a time, try to have fun along the way, and you'll be finished up in no time!

 Great detailed post.