DUAL AGENCY not disclosed, pressuring 200k over asking with seller financing

OP

Member since 2023 · 24 posts · 1 vote

Quote from @Bill B.:

Only offer what you think it’s worth. If you truly think they are motivated to earn double commissions then offer $50k over asking, or less. If commissions are their motivation they’ll push your offer on the seller over other offers…

Always include an inspection contingency and you’ll probably need a longer loan contingency. (Are you pre-approved, not pre-qualified?) ask your lender how long they need. AND an appraisal contingency, what if it’s worth less than asking?

OBVIOUSLY if the offer “deadline” passed and they’re still willing to accept your offer either there were no other offers or none that the seller would accept. They may have told the seller they would lost it low and then a bidding war would insure, except it didn’t.

I would probably offer at or near list, heck maybe less if it’s been on the market more than 15-20 days. Lots of sales are falling through when interest rates climb during the inspection/offer period.

If you don’t get this deal I think I’d find a new realtor, you two have just gotten off on the wrong foot, especially if they didn’t have you sign a “dual agency” form.

Ps. Pretty sure BP has an agent referral option and you could even try reaching out to David Greene from the podcasts, he runs a broker or two in California.

Given the area I think it can very well sell for over 1 mil. Would I be willing to spend 1.2 million in a 2b/2b house? Absolutely not. Despite the claim of other offers it seems to me that if we were to agree and sign that our offer would be accepted, that’s simply the impression I have.

After the heated back and forth one of the agents said “counter offers are coming out soon and it’ll be 1.125 mil. That’s what I’ll accept”. Thoughts? Does that make sense? I’m just trying to understand the motivation or benefits to either the seller or agent.

Even after that back and forth the co-agent texted an hour following stating that she added the appraisal contingency and that if we were ready to sign. They also are the sellers agent. If they have better offers why would they be so adamant about us moving forward? Much higher than other offers? Idk.

Does anyone know how sellers financing would play in this situation? They say they need us to sign first then they’ll present the offer of seller financing to the seller. But wouldn’t they have had that discussion already? Esp with other offers?

We got w pre approval certificate from the agents themselves/perhaps the lender they work with. The pre approval is for the exact amount of 1.2 mil and I’m even surprised we got that bc I sent over very minimal information.

This is an agent my friend met at the listing who sold her the promise of getting her the home. At what cost? That’s what I’m trying to figure out.

Bill B.

Investor · Las Vegas, NV · Member since 2013 · 8k+ posts · 10k+ votes

Why wouldn’t you offer $1.130M, be the highest offer and save $70k?

There is zero chance I would be getting prequalified with a real estate agent, do they own a bank? What’s the interest rate? How long’s the loan? Talk to a real mortgage broker. Ask for the federal NMLS of their lender.

This sounds really shady. Did they give you an estimate of your payments and did that number sound acceptable? (what if it’s a 5 year arm at 12% interest with 20% down?)

OP

Member since 2023 · 24 posts · 1 vote

Quote from @Russell Brazil:

If they are your agent, they will not make any more or less money if you buy this house. They will make X dollars from selling this house, then they will make Y dollars from whatever house you buy, whether it’s this one or another one. It is a zero sum game when one of your own buyers buys one of your listings.

They are the sellers agent who decided to represent us as buyers for this particular house. Met them at listing. If we don’t go with this house then we may or may not move forward with them. But noted, thankyou

OP

Member since 2023 · 24 posts · 1 vote

Quote from @Bill B.:

Why wouldn’t you offer $1.130M, be the highest offer and save $70k?

There is zero chance I would be getting prequalified with a real estate agent, do they own a bank? What’s the interest rate? How long’s the loan? Talk to a real mortgage broker. Ask for the federal NMLS of their lender.

This sounds really shady. Did they give you an estimate of your payments and did that number sound acceptable? (what if it’s a 5 year arm at 12% interest with 20% down?)

I don’t know what the highest offer is. And I’m so sorry but I mistyped. The counter he claimed was 1.225, so 25k over what they want us to offer in the first place.

And the offer is from the home loans mortgage company who works with them. I have no idea what the internet rate is or any details about the loan we just got a pre approval letter with the amount. When I asked multiple times they said they needed a signed offer to present it to the seller for seller financing and then it would be discussed then.

And exactly what I explained to my friend. What if the internet rate is 20%?? Which is why I’m wondering what happens with a short loan contingency. What happens if we don’t agree in that time frame and the seller themself is the one financing and giving the terms. I’m very curious.

Theresa HarrisPro Member

Member since 2019 · 15k+ posts · 11k+ votes

If you aren't comfortable paying what the agent is wanting you to pay, simply tell them no and then hang up the phone.

1 Reply

Russell BrazilBusiness Member

Moderator

Real Estate Agent · Washington, D.C. · Member since 2012 · 17k+ posts · 30k+ votes

[email protected]301-893-4635 Podcast Guest on Show #192

Quote from @Amanda Kwem:

Quote from @Russell Brazil:

If they are your agent, they will not make any more or less money if you buy this house. They will make X dollars from selling this house, then they will make Y dollars from whatever house you buy, whether it’s this one or another one. It is a zero sum game when one of your own buyers buys one of your listings.

They are the sellers agent who decided to represent us as buyers for this particular house. Met them at listing. If we don’t go with this house then we may or may not move forward with them. But noted, thankyou

Then nothing was undisclosed. It would be obvious to anyone that the agent hosting the open house is the sellers agent.

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2 Reply

OP

Member since 2023 · 24 posts · 1 vote

Quote from @Russell Brazil:

Quote from @Amanda Kwem:

Quote from @Russell Brazil:

If they are your agent, they will not make any more or less money if you buy this house. They will make X dollars from selling this house, then they will make Y dollars from whatever house you buy, whether it’s this one or another one. It is a zero sum game when one of your own buyers buys one of your listings.

They are the sellers agent who decided to represent us as buyers for this particular house. Met them at listing. If we don’t go with this house then we may or may not move forward with them. But noted, thankyou

Then nothing was undisclosed. It would be obvious to anyone that the agent hosting the open house is the sellers agent.

Perhaps? I wasn’t there initially and did not know that it was the listing agent. My friend saw the house days before me and again we are first time buyers and aren’t too savvy with these things. Additionally 2 separate people were in our text thread and one of them said they were independent when I asked then the other said they were co-agents then after more discussion they said they used to work together but co-listed. So a lot of confusion for me personally

OP

Member since 2023 · 24 posts · 1 vote

Quote from @Theresa Harris:

If you aren't comfortable paying what the agent is wanting you to pay, simply tell them no and then hang up the phone.

Personally don’t plan on moving forward. Just wondering what the motivation or benefit would be to get us to sign it if there are “other offers” and if the “counter offer” is 25k more than what I’m not even willing to pay in the first place.

Mike Dymski

Investor · Greenville, SC · Member since 2016 · 5k+ posts · 13k+ votes

Forget everything that happened above. You and your agent should determine the value of the home using comps provided by your agent. That value will determine your offer price. Your agent and your lender should provide clarity on the amount of financing you are qualified for and your loan terms. Whether your agent is your buyers agent or the sellers agent is irrelevant to these statements...either should provide the items listed here. If not, I recommend getting your own agent that will provide these standard items. Or, be very versed in market values, your criteria, and your loan qualifications and work directly with the sellers agent because they don't matter because you know everything already and all you need them to do is present your offer.

OP

Member since 2023 · 24 posts · 1 vote

Quote from @Mike Dymski:

Forget everything that happened above. You and your agent should determine the value of the home using comps provided by your agent. That value will determine your offer price. Your agent and your lender should provide clarity on the amount of financing you are qualified for and your loan terms. Whether your agent is your buyers agent or the sellers agent is irrelevant to these statements...either should provide the items listed here. If not, I recommend getting your own agent that will provide these standard items. Or, be very versed in market values, your criteria, and your loan qualifications and work directly with the sellers agent because they don't matter because you know everything already and all you need them to do is present your offer.

I agree, perhaps all of this is being averted because offers were due yesterday. I explained that while I like the house it seems I’ve missed the ride but they’re insisting while also saying time has run out (but also they’ll give us an extra day) and it just seems like we’re being rushed into signing. Just curious about the whole matter. Comps would be great as m sure it will smell for over a mil

Theresa HarrisPro Member

Member since 2019 · 15k+ posts · 11k+ votes

Quote from @Amanda Kwem:

Quote from @Theresa Harris:

If you aren't comfortable paying what the agent is wanting you to pay, simply tell them no and then hang up the phone.

Personally don’t plan on moving forward. Just wondering what the motivation or benefit would be to get us to sign it if there are “other offers” and if the “counter offer” is 25k more than what I’m not even willing to pay in the first place.

My guess is there are no other offers or they are trying to get the other offer to go higher. It is greed on the part of the realtor.

1 Reply

Bill B.

Investor · Las Vegas, NV · Member since 2013 · 8k+ posts · 10k+ votes

If they “have an offer for 1.25M” why would they tell you to offer $25k less?

Why would you care what terms the seller is offering if you already have an approval from a real mortgage company, the terms will probably be worse.

If this was part of a movie I would say they were partners with the seller and helping him sell for more than it’s worth by offering seller financing.

Look at the sales history see if it’s a flip, decide if it’s your dream home, if so decide what it’s worth to you, it doesn’t matter what others are offering. They might be planning to house hack or do STRs and they can pay more than you. If it’s not your dream home I’d just move on and see what it sells for eventually. You can always offer less if it doesn’t go pending in a week.

I REALLY do like the deadline that isn’t a deadline and being told to offer $200k over list and $25k less than another offer.

1 Reply

OP

Member since 2023 · 24 posts · 1 vote

Quote from @Bill B.:

If they “have an offer for 1.25M” why would they tell you to offer $25k less?

Why would you care what terms the seller is offering if you already have an approval from a real mortgage company, the terms will probably be worse.

If this was part of a movie I would say they were partners with the seller and helping him sell for more than it’s worth by offering seller financing.

Look at the sales history see if it’s a flip, decide if it’s your dream home, if so decide what it’s worth to you, it doesn’t matter what others are offering. They might be planning to house hack or do STRs and they can pay more than you. If it’s not your dream home I’d just move on and see what it sells for eventually. You can always offer less if it doesn’t go pending in a week.

I REALLY do like the deadline that isn’t a deadline and being told to offer $200k over list and $25k less than another offer.

I don’t know what the other offer amounts are only that they claim there are other offers. They are firm on US offering 1.2 million with the contract reflecting that amount despite me personally saying that’s not what I’d be willing to pay. They say they need that amount to be competitive. Again theyd know things we wouldn’t.

After our back and forth they said the counter that will be coming out soon is 1.225 not 1.125, that was a typo I will try and edit that. So 25k over the price they told us would be competitive.

the approval came from THEM/the mortgage company that they work with. This whole time they’ve been selling us on seller financing and how it’s such a rare opportunity and how they can convince the seller finance and they’ll beable to get us no money down at that. It has been exclusively talked about so it’s there’s an understanding that that is apparently “desirable”.

The pre approval from the mortgage company came today for the purchase amount as they were trying to get us to sign by today. As I explained in another comment I sent over very minimal info about my finances/not many documents however since it’s 3 of us on 1 house maybe that’s enough idk? Would a seller fianance AND accept no money down?

I simply have a feeling that they would not even be willing to write an offer for less than 1.2 mil. I’ll reiterate I have no idea what the other offers are, that’s not disclosed only that they really want us to offer 1.2 million and after a brief argument they claimed that the counter that will come out is 1.225 mil

OP

Member since 2023 · 24 posts · 1 vote