Need Advice on 'Selling" or "Renting" A Condo I own

Need Advice on 'Selling" or "Renting" A Condo I own

Member since 2020 · 3 posts · 1 vote

Hello BiggerPockets Community. First time blog posting and I could use your advice! Your insights and comments will be appreciated!

Here is my situation:

I own a condo in NY (Queens borough) since 2002 that I’ve lived in and still live in for most of those years since. From that perspective its been good for me.  However, I purchased a condo specifically to have flexibility with renting when and if I needed to. I had moved out for a few years but had to return and I then had to deal with my tenant who would not get out and so it turned into a whole eviction process. An eye opening process especially here in NY.

I know that I want to move on from living in the condo as I have contemplated a change for a while. I’ve lived here many years and feel its just time for a change. Additionally, my immediate family who live in pretty close proximity to me (Parents & brother) are all moving to Florida soon. Being close to them was a pretty good reason to be nearby but with them leaving, that’s one less reason to stay where I’m located specifically. With that said, I have been on the fence about my options:

#1) Sell the Condo – Sell it outright and use the proceeds to rent temporarily somewhere until housing prices cool and buy then or buy investment property

#2) Rent the Condo – This would mean I move out, buy a new house but keep the condo and rent it again

In either scenario, I would be moving to Long Island, NY to be closer to my kids. There are pros and cons for each option which I will spell out below. I have been leaning towards a sell and getting out before what seems like an eventual downturn in the market. I want to make a decision by June2023 which is less than a week away

Year of Home Purchase                           2002

Year of Home Mortgage Payoff              2032

Mortgage Payoff Amount                        ~$54K (Slightly under)

Unit                                                              2 BR / 2 Bath + Balcony (1050 sq feet)

Building Complex                                      5th Floor of a 6 Story Condo (Part of a 2 Building complex)

Note: Refinanced to a better rate when 20 yrs was left on mortgage to a 20 yr loan (rate of 3.875%)

Financical Stats:

Costs While I Live in Condo

Mortgage (PITI): $933.00 + HOA: $1,256.00 = $2,189.00

PITI (Principal/Interest/Taxes/Insurance) per month

Note: Mortgage is inclusive of PITI (Principal / Interest / Taxes / Insurnace)

Note: HOA Covers Building Insurance, Super/Porters; Garbage/Snow Removal/Landscaping/Cleaning of Interior & Hallways; Covers Water Usage & Home Heating/Cooking (per month)

Costs If I Rent Condo (Includes expenses above plus these additional ones)

Condo Costs: $2,189.00 + Condo Sublet Fee: $250.00 + Vacancy: $183.00 + Renters Insurance: $10 = $2,632.00

Note: The Condo requires a $250 sublet fee if I rent out my unit; They do this to discourage rentals and keep units mostly owner occupied

Note: Vacancy per month equals the monthly cost (1/12) of 1 months rent

Decision - Keeping Condo & Rent It

Pros

  1. Through Rental, tenant will pay off my mortgage over time (10 years remain)
  2. In 5 years when the mortgage is down to half amount for example, I will prob have the flexibility to just pay the remainder outright and have a unit free and clear

Cons

  1. The maintenance costs are a bit crazy to me but not necessarily out of the norm; There is an assessment that has just been levied for some major repairs and a 10 year loan has been taken out to do the repairs and minimize the per unit owner cost to a manageable size; That assessment is increasing maintenance to $1,256 p/month. A lot more than my PITI costs combined.
  2. The condo charges a $250 sublet fee for renting out my unit; That would bring my total monthly expense over $2600; Based on what I researched I could get for rents in this area, not sure I can get $2600; Even if I could I would just be breaking even with no cash flow; Wont include amount needed for potential vacancy; The sublet fee kills my flexibility

Decision - Sell Condo

Pros

  1. Would probably get top dollar on sale of home selling now; if there is a downturn it can be MANY years before I can get the money I would be able to get now (anticipate $425k to $450k)
  2. Sell and use part of the money to buy new home for myself and/or use the money on alternate investment(s)
  3. Keep the money liquid for opportunities that come up in the next 1 to 2 years
  4. Free myself from the politics of the condo board and how the complex operates; A lot of the issues are financial in that over the years money has been collected and not well managed or spent which is why HOA fee is so high; this provides a level of inflexibility on managing expenses which I have limited control over

Cons

  1. Don’t have that much left on mortgage; selling now would mean investing elsewhere via new long term mortgage at todays higher interest rates (albeit at smaller mortgage amt since I would be able to put down a larger down pymt); Additionally, at todays market prices, I would not be able to get a unit like this one for the price I paid over 2 decades ago and for the interest rate I have now
  2. I have been wanting to build a real-estate portfolio and my thought has been that this would be my 1st unit in that portfolio and I should keep it & build from there; Selling would mean starting from scratch instead of building; However is this Condo Unit really a good investment? 

I'm hoping the amount of info I posted doesn't turn anyone off from responding. I tried to give the full story so that you knew where I was coming from. Again your insights and comments are welcome!

1Reply
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Most Popular Reply

Jason LeePro Member
Real Estate Agent · New York, NY · Member since 2015 · 401 posts · 235 votes
3y

Rents are at their historic peak right now so if you're not going to cash flow with vacancy (you will have some vacancy) then you can expect it to be worse when the rental market softens and rents dip. Meanwhile the sales market is pretty hot and inventory is way down (about 25% YOY for condos). Given the info you provided, I would probably sell now and take advantage of the cap gains exclusion.

See this reply in the discussion

3 Replies

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  • Jason LeePro Member
    Real Estate Agent · New York, NY · Member since 2015 · 401 posts · 235 votes
    3y

    Rents are at their historic peak right now so if you're not going to cash flow with vacancy (you will have some vacancy) then you can expect it to be worse when the rental market softens and rents dip. Meanwhile the sales market is pretty hot and inventory is way down (about 25% YOY for condos). Given the info you provided, I would probably sell now and take advantage of the cap gains exclusion.

  • Real Estate Broker · Hyde Park Tampa, FL · Member since 2019 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    3y

    As a broker AND investor, I can offer that condos are generally not the highest ROI investments due to that dang HOA fee which only goes in one direction and still subjects you to 'special assessments' which are short on 'special' and high on 'assessment.' You did a lot of analysis here and it all seems to come down to 'this isn't the cruise you signed up for.' My recommendation - and it's just one of many you'll receive (feel free, fellower BPers, to not mention me in your take on this...) - would be to sell it. And, then go find an investment that gets you excited about owning a piece of the planet.

  • Abel CurielBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Queens, NY · Member since 2016 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @Omar Pena:

    Hello BiggerPockets Community. First time blog posting and I could use your advice! Your insights and comments will be appreciated!

    Here is my situation:

    I own a condo in NY (Queens borough) since 2002 that I’ve lived in and still live in for most of those years since. From that perspective its been good for me.  However, I purchased a condo specifically to have flexibility with renting when and if I needed to. I had moved out for a few years but had to return and I then had to deal with my tenant who would not get out and so it turned into a whole eviction process. An eye opening process especially here in NY.

    I know that I want to move on from living in the condo as I have contemplated a change for a while. I’ve lived here many years and feel its just time for a change. Additionally, my immediate family who live in pretty close proximity to me (Parents & brother) are all moving to Florida soon. Being close to them was a pretty good reason to be nearby but with them leaving, that’s one less reason to stay where I’m located specifically. With that said, I have been on the fence about my options:

    #1) Sell the Condo – Sell it outright and use the proceeds to rent temporarily somewhere until housing prices cool and buy then or buy investment property

    #2) Rent the Condo – This would mean I move out, buy a new house but keep the condo and rent it again

    In either scenario, I would be moving to Long Island, NY to be closer to my kids. There are pros and cons for each option which I will spell out below. I have been leaning towards a sell and getting out before what seems like an eventual downturn in the market. I want to make a decision by June2023 which is less than a week away

    Year of Home Purchase                           2002

    Year of Home Mortgage Payoff              2032

    Mortgage Payoff Amount                        ~$54K (Slightly under)

    Unit                                                              2 BR / 2 Bath + Balcony (1050 sq feet)

    Building Complex                                      5th Floor of a 6 Story Condo (Part of a 2 Building complex)

    Note: Refinanced to a better rate when 20 yrs was left on mortgage to a 20 yr loan (rate of 3.875%)

    Financical Stats:

    Costs While I Live in Condo

    Mortgage (PITI): $933.00 + HOA: $1,256.00 = $2,189.00

    PITI (Principal/Interest/Taxes/Insurance) per month

    Note: Mortgage is inclusive of PITI (Principal / Interest / Taxes / Insurnace)

    Note: HOA Covers Building Insurance, Super/Porters; Garbage/Snow Removal/Landscaping/Cleaning of Interior & Hallways; Covers Water Usage & Home Heating/Cooking (per month)

    Costs If I Rent Condo (Includes expenses above plus these additional ones)

    Condo Costs: $2,189.00 + Condo Sublet Fee: $250.00 + Vacancy: $183.00 + Renters Insurance: $10 = $2,632.00

    Note: The Condo requires a $250 sublet fee if I rent out my unit; They do this to discourage rentals and keep units mostly owner occupied

    Note: Vacancy per month equals the monthly cost (1/12) of 1 months rent

    Decision - Keeping Condo & Rent It

    Pros

    1. Through Rental, tenant will pay off my mortgage over time (10 years remain)
    2. In 5 years when the mortgage is down to half amount for example, I will prob have the flexibility to just pay the remainder outright and have a unit free and clear

    Cons

    1. The maintenance costs are a bit crazy to me but not necessarily out of the norm; There is an assessment that has just been levied for some major repairs and a 10 year loan has been taken out to do the repairs and minimize the per unit owner cost to a manageable size; That assessment is increasing maintenance to $1,256 p/month. A lot more than my PITI costs combined.
    2. The condo charges a $250 sublet fee for renting out my unit; That would bring my total monthly expense over $2600; Based on what I researched I could get for rents in this area, not sure I can get $2600; Even if I could I would just be breaking even with no cash flow; Wont include amount needed for potential vacancy; The sublet fee kills my flexibility

    Decision - Sell Condo

    Pros

    1. Would probably get top dollar on sale of home selling now; if there is a downturn it can be MANY years before I can get the money I would be able to get now (anticipate $425k to $450k)
    2. Sell and use part of the money to buy new home for myself and/or use the money on alternate investment(s)
    3. Keep the money liquid for opportunities that come up in the next 1 to 2 years
    4. Free myself from the politics of the condo board and how the complex operates; A lot of the issues are financial in that over the years money has been collected and not well managed or spent which is why HOA fee is so high; this provides a level of inflexibility on managing expenses which I have limited control over

    Cons

    1. Don’t have that much left on mortgage; selling now would mean investing elsewhere via new long term mortgage at todays higher interest rates (albeit at smaller mortgage amt since I would be able to put down a larger down pymt); Additionally, at todays market prices, I would not be able to get a unit like this one for the price I paid over 2 decades ago and for the interest rate I have now
    2. I have been wanting to build a real-estate portfolio and my thought has been that this would be my 1st unit in that portfolio and I should keep it & build from there; Selling would mean starting from scratch instead of building; However is this Condo Unit really a good investment? 

    I'm hoping the amount of info I posted doesn't turn anyone off from responding. I tried to give the full story so that you knew where I was coming from. Again your insights and comments are welcome!

     Hello Omar and welcome to BiggerPockets!

    I can certainly understand your dilemma here especially since you're 2/3 of the way from owning this unit free & clear.

    Market cycles, like the current one we are in, only come around about once per decade and this is the longest lasting seller's market we've seen in our lifetimes. That said, I can understand why selling is on your mind as well. @Jason Lee makes a great point regarding inventory and demand!

    Given your history and your family's migration down to Florida, I think its worth seriously considering your options for capitalizing on the equity you've built and using that equity to further expand your portfolio in more landlord-friendly states. 

    Florida would be a natural fit because of the fact that your family is going there and it is a lot more tenant-friendly than NY. You'd want to focus on areas that aren't as overvalued as the southern-most counties. Moody's Analytics highlighted the overvalued/undervalued markets earlier in the week on a national scale. Other landlord friendly states to consider for OOS investing would be Texas and Tennessee. 

    Lastly, if you were going to rent on Long Island, you'd likely be paying more than you would be currently at the condo. Another option to consider would be a househack in Nassau or Suffolk. With ~350-400K net proceeds from your potential condo sale, you should be able to find opportunities both locally and OOS.

    All the best to you on your journey!

    Abel

    REbuild Team - eXp Realty5234 Reviews
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